Tigers X - Number one Source to Talk Auburn Tigers Sports
Pat Dye Field => Signing Day => Topic started by: AuburnChopper 3.0 on January 28, 2009, 11:14:21 AM
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These are QB's on 2008 NCAA Div-1 Rosters. So, just in case anyone happens to think we're wasting our time in Texas....
1. Colt McCoy, Texas (Tuscola Jim Ned)
2. Matthew Stafford, Georgia (Highland Park)
3. Todd Reesing, Kansas (Austin Lake Travis)
4. Brian Johnson, Utah (Baytown Lee)
5. Jevan Snead, Ole Miss (Stephenville)
6. Chase Holbrook, New Mexico State (Hurst L.D. Bell)
7. Chase Daniel, Missouri (Southlake Carroll)
8. Christian Ponder, Florida State (Colleyville Heritage)
9. Robert Griffin, Baylor (Copperas Cove)
10. Graham Harrell, Texas Tech (Ennis)
11. Jerrod Johnson, Texas A&M (Humble)
12. Casey Dick, Arkansas (Allen)
13. Case Keenum, Houston (Abilene Wylie)
14. Jarrett Lee, LSU (Brenham)
15. Giovanni Vizza, North Texas (San Antonio Alamo Heights)
16. Chase Clement, Rice (San Antonio Alamo Heights)
17. Bo Levi Mitchell, SMU (Katy)
18. Andy Dalton, TCU (Katy)
19. Nick Stephens, Tennessee (Flower Mound)
20. Kevin Moore, Tulane (Flower Mound Marcus)
21. Trevor Vittatoe, UTEP (Euless Trinity)
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I don't understand why anyone is thinking that we are wasting our time in Texas. Are we wasting our time in Florida too? Maybe we should just try to get all the awesome talent in our own talent rich state.
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I don't think anybody would disagree that TX is normally loaded with talent.
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I don't think anybody would disagree that TX is normally loaded with talent.
You'd be surprised...
Unbridled pessimism is a hell of a drug.
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^^ What he said^^
I have already read and heard from some that we are making a mistake by recruiting kids from TX and that we shouldn't be doing this.
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^^ What he said^^
I have already read and heard from some that we are making a mistake by recruiting kids from TX and that we shouldn't be doing this.
Don't get me wrong, I don't think recruiting just anybody from TX just because they are from there is a good idea. However, they do turn out an awful large amount of talent. Just ask Texas, Texas Tech, A&M, LSU, and Oklahoma.
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Don't get me wrong, I don't think recruiting just anybody from TX just because they are from there is a good idea. However, they do turn out an awful large amount of talent. Just ask Texas, Texas Tech, A&M, LSU, and Oklahoma.
You think? I mean they could have some slow ass white boys like myself that had a hard time guarding the fucking water bottles, but I think that the coaches would stay away from them in the first place.
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Don't get me wrong, I don't think recruiting just anybody from TX just because they are from there is a good idea. However, they do turn out an awful large amount of talent. Just ask Texas, Texas Tech, A&M, LSU, and Oklahoma.
I have already heard from some, "yeah, they look good on film, but how is the competition, can they play in the SEC....If we start to build a piepline to TX then we can hang it up, we will never win again...blah,blah,blah"
As AUChizad said: "Unbridled pessimism is a hell of a drug."
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Auburn's bread and butter, ham and gravy, biscuits and eggs, grits and sausage has traditionally (this means always) been in recruiting close to home.
Where did the greatest players in Auburn history come from? Cribbs, Sullivan, Bo, Terry (both), Carnell, etc. all came from Alabama. Ronnie, James Brooks and tons of others came from Georgia. Fullwood and half a billion other kids came from Florida. Jason Campbell came from Mississippi.
That's where Auburn will live and that's where Auburn will die.
Chasing Texas is the worst strategy I can imagine and it just reinforces how stupid I think Chiz is.
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I have already heard from some, "yeah, they look good on film, but how is the competition, can they play in the SEC....If we start to build a piepline to TX then we can hang it up, we will never win again...blah,blah,blah"
As AUChizad said: "Unbridled pessimism is a hell of a drug."
If there is some badass that is a combination of Andre Smith and DJ Fluker in Alaska, I want him at Alabama. If there is some guy that is a combination of Julio Jones, AJ Green, and Rueben Randle and he lives in Maine, he can bring his ass to Alabama too. Who gives a shit where they are from, if they can play, they can play. I do think there is some merit to the argument of level of competition, etc. That is up to the coaches to say "Hey, this kid is blowing it up in 2A and is a beast, AND has all the tools to compete in the SEC.", or say, "Hey, this kid is blowing it up in the 2A but just isn't good enough by the standards of college ball." Just because a kid plays 2A or something doesn't automatically mean he's going to be horrible. He just as well could walk right in and fall flat on his face though. Thats where you hope like hell that your coaches can evaluate talent properly.
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Auburn's bread and butter, ham and gravy, biscuits and eggs, grits and sausage has traditionally (this means always) been in recruiting close to home.
Where did the greatest players in Auburn history come from? Cribbs, Sullivan, Bo, Terry (both), Carnell, etc. all came from Alabama. Ronnie, James Brooks and tons of others came from Georgia. Fullwood and half a billion other kids came from Florida. Jason Campbell came from Mississippi.
That's where Auburn will live and that's where Auburn will die.
Chasing Texas is the worst strategy I can imagine and it just reinforces how stupid I think Chiz is.
Here's news...
We're STILL recruiting those areas... We're just expanding into Texas. What's so hard to understand about that, and what about that makes Chizik "stupid"?
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Auburn's bread and butter, ham and gravy, biscuits and eggs, grits and sausage has traditionally (this means always) been in recruiting close to home.
Where did the greatest players in Auburn history come from? Cribbs, Sullivan, Bo, Terry (both), Carnell, etc. all came from Alabama. Ronnie, James Brooks and tons of others came from Georgia. Fullwood and half a billion other kids came from Florida. Jason Campbell came from Mississippi.
That's where Auburn will live and that's where Auburn will die.
Chasing Texas is the worst strategy I can imagine and it just reinforces how stupid I think Chiz is.
Only because we've never had a pipeline into Texas. :suicide:
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If there is some badass that is a combination of Andre Smith and DJ Fluker in Alaska, I want him at Alabama Auburn. If there is some guy that is a combination of Julio Jones, AJ Green, and Rueben Randle and he lives in Maine, he can bring his ass to Alabama Auburn too. Who gives a shit where they are from, if they can play, they can play. I do think there is some merit to the argument of level of competition, etc. That is up to the coaches to say "Hey, this kid is blowing it up in 2A and is a beast, AND has all the tools to compete in the SEC.", or say, "Hey, this kid is blowing it up in the 2A but just isn't good enough by the standards of college ball." Just because a kid plays 2A or something doesn't automatically mean he's going to be horrible. He just as well could walk right in and fall flat on his face though. Thats where you hope like hell that your coaches can evaluate talent properly.
Now, I agree with this. Good points RWS
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If there is some badass that is a combination of Andre Smith and DJ Fluker in Alaska, I want him at Alabama. If there is some guy that is a combination of Julio Jones, AJ Green, and Rueben Randle and he lives in Maine, he can bring his ass to Alabama too. Who gives a shit where they are from, if they can play, they can play. I do think there is some merit to the argument of level of competition, etc. That is up to the coaches to say "Hey, this kid is blowing it up in 2A and is a beast, AND has all the tools to compete in the SEC.", or say, "Hey, this kid is blowing it up in the 2A but just isn't good enough by the standards of college ball." Just because a kid plays 2A or something doesn't automatically mean he's going to be horrible. He just as well could walk right in and fall flat on his face though. Thats where you hope like hell that your coaches can evaluate talent properly.
I understand what you are saying, and I agree (did I really just type that), but some out there hate it and are going to hate it no matter what. You will never be able to convince some that sometimes going out of the normal recruiting area and getting a kid or three is a good thing, no matter how good the kid might be.
Atta boy for using caps to start a sentence. Even my blind ass didn't even have to strain my eyes this time. Now if you just hit the space bar twice between sentences, by god you will have this posting thing whipped. :thumbsup:
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Auburn's bread and butter, ham and gravy, biscuits and eggs, grits and sausage has traditionally (this means always) been in recruiting close to home.
Where did the greatest players in Auburn history come from? Cribbs, Sullivan, Bo, Terry (both), Carnell, etc. all came from Alabama. Ronnie, James Brooks and tons of others came from Georgia. Fullwood and half a billion other kids came from Florida. Jason Campbell came from Mississippi.
That's where Auburn will live and that's where Auburn will die.
Chasing Texas is the worst strategy I can imagine and it just reinforces how stupid I think Chiz is.
Well sure that has been the bread and butter. We have never really had the option before. Just because you pick up a couple of kids from Texas does that mean you can no longer recruit locally or it is no longer your bread and butter?
That argument is all hat and no cattle in my book.
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That argument is all hat and no cattle in my book.
Well played sir.
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Auburn's bread and butter, ham and gravy, biscuits and eggs, grits and sausage has traditionally (this means always) been in recruiting close to home.
Where did the greatest players in Auburn history come from? Cribbs, Sullivan, Bo, Terry (both), Carnell, etc. all came from Alabama. Ronnie, James Brooks and tons of others came from Georgia. Fullwood and half a billion other kids came from Florida. Jason Campbell came from Mississippi.
That's where Auburn will live and that's where Auburn will die.
Chasing Texas is the worst strategy I can imagine and it just reinforces how stupid I think Chiz is.
Texas High School Football - yeah, so stupid and so weak that they would never do a tv show about it... out here, TXHS ball is as much a religion as college ball is.
These high school players aren't taught to play Big 12 brand of football - they are taught to play FOOTBALL. Either they have a gift or they don't . And location has nothing to do with it. I have to agree wtih rws - I don't care WHAT their zip code is - if they can play ball, I want them at Auburn.
Kaos, you mean to tell me that you would have turned down Vince Young - the HIGH SCHOOL/COLLEGE Vince Young, not the NFL headcase - had he stated that he wanted to go to Auburn?
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Kaos, you mean to tell me that you would have turned down Vince Young - the HIGH SCHOOL/COLLEGE Vince Young, not the NFL headcase - had he stated that he wanted to go to Auburn?
Nope. I'm saying that Jason Campbell was the QB Auburn got, not Vince (who would have been wasted in Tuberville and Borges scheme anyway).
Getting an occasional kid from Texas, California, Wisconsin or Idaho doesn't bother me. If you're talking about a strategy of focusing on Texas because that's where these new coaches came from, I'm telling you now that it is a fail.
You can't serve two masters. You can't have your coaches out burning up the desert in Texas hoping to compete with Texas, OU, Tech, A&M, Nebraska, Baylor, SMU, Arkansas, North Texas, TCU, New Mexico, Arizona and the rest and still do an adequate job of maintaining your strengths.
In the end you'll lose on both ends.
The Chiz tried to recruit Texas for Iowa State too. While it will be easier to get a kid to come to Auburn than to an Iowa State type team, you're still looking at a difficult sell. Why? Because mom and dad want to be able to come see their son play and they don't want to have to buy a plane ticket to do so every weekend.
But whatever.
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Nope. I'm saying that Jason Campbell was the QB Auburn got, not Vince (who would have been wasted in Tuberville and Borges scheme anyway).
Getting an occasional kid from Texas, California, Wisconsin or Idaho doesn't bother me. If you're talking about a strategy of focusing on Texas because that's where these new coaches came from, I'm telling you now that it is a fail.
You can't serve two masters. You can't have your coaches out burning up the desert in Texas hoping to compete with Texas, OU, Tech, A&M, Nebraska, Baylor, SMU, Arkansas, North Texas, TCU, New Mexico, Arizona and the rest and still do an adequate job of maintaining your strengths.
In the end you'll lose on both ends.
The Chiz tried to recruit Texas for Iowa State too. While it will be easier to get a kid to come to Auburn than to an Iowa State type team, you're still looking at a difficult sell. Why? Because mom and dad want to be able to come see their son play and they don't want to have to buy a plane ticket to do so every weekend.
But whatever.
Auburn needs to stay in Al, MS, GA, and North Florida.
Signed,
Frank Sanders
Dillard High School
Class of 91
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You can't serve two masters. You can't have your coaches out burning up the desert in Texas hoping to compete with Texas, OU, Tech, A&M, Nebraska, Baylor, SMU, Arkansas, North Texas, TCU, New Mexico, Arizona and the rest and still do an adequate job of maintaining your strengths.
They're doing it now fairly successfuly with limited time. What makes you think they can't maintain, or do an effective job with more time? Other universities recruit nationally, what makes you think Auburn can't?
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They're doing it now fairly successfuly with limited time. What makes you think they can't maintain, or do an effective job with more time? Other universities recruit nationally, what makes you think Auburn can't?
Please pound your head on another brick wall.
Tuberville already had 90% of this class in the books. They didn't HAVE to do anything but make some phone calls.
Maybe they can. I just know you can't be in Texas watching a football game on the same Friday night you're in Andalusia. Not enough people to do so. And if you go fucking around in Texas all the time you ignore what's right under your nose -- low hanging fruit, so to speak.
If you target one or two kids from Texas or whatever, then that's one thing. If you're going to focus on Texas as one of your primary areas, that's another.
Comprende, Drama Llama?
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Tuberville already had 90% of this class in the books. They didn't HAVE to do anything but make some phone calls.
Tuberville isn't the coach anymore. There have been 21 recruits visit Auburn that were NOT contacted, or recruited by the past staff, including Rollison, Randle and others.
Maybe they can. I just know you can't be in Texas watching a football game on the same Friday night you're in Andalusia. Not enough people to do so. And if you go fucking around in Texas all the time you ignore what's right under your nose -- low hanging fruit, so to speak.
There are more than just one or two guys that hitting the road Kaos. Good grief, I cover everything from Savannah to Dallas in my job and see everyone in my territory once about every four weeks. It's not as difficult as you make it sound. You're low hanging fruit is an easy approach, but keeps you mediocre, unless you get lucky and one of the best players just HAPPENS to be close to home.
JMO....
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It could also be that most of the local, top level talent is already firmly committed to other schools and they decided to look to a very talent rich area where the new assistants already have some connections.
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They're doing it now fairly successfuly with limited time. What makes you think they can't maintain, or do an effective job with more time? Other universities recruit nationally, what makes you think Auburn can't?
A few of these guys were being recruited by coaches while they were at their previous employers. So, its not like they just jumped in in a months time and swayed some of these kids to come on. For example:
Tyrik Rollison 4*- was being recruited by Luper at OK St.
Nosa Eguae 3* - was being recruited by Chizik at Iowa St.
A few of them only had offers from scrub schools and would be incredibly stupid to turn AU down. For example:
Clint Moseley 3*- Arkansas St., Marshall, South Alabama, UAB
John Sullen 3*- Duke, Memphis, Southern Miss, Tulane, South Alabama, UAB
Izauea Lanier 3*- Kentucky, Mississippi State, Troy
Probably on the verge of committing:
Joel Knight 3* - was being recruited by Chizik at Iowa St.
Anthony Gulley 3* - Troy
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A few of these guys were being recruited by coaches while they were at their previous employers. So, its not like they just jumped in in a months time and swayed some of these kids to come on. For example:
Fine, but it doesn't address the point that was being made overall.
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Auburn's bread and butter, ham and gravy, biscuits and eggs, grits and sausage has traditionally (this means always) been in recruiting close to home.
Where did the greatest players in Auburn history come from? Cribbs, Sullivan, Bo, Terry (both), Carnell, etc. all came from Alabama. Ronnie, James Brooks and tons of others came from Georgia. Fullwood and half a billion other kids came from Florida. Jason Campbell came from Mississippi.
That's where Auburn will live and that's where Auburn will die.
Chasing Texas is the worst strategy I can imagine and it just reinforces how stupid I think Chiz is.
Your opinion is becoming stale.
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Your opinion is becoming stale.
:cage:
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You can't serve two masters. You can't have your coaches out burning up the desert in Texas hoping to compete with Texas, OU, Tech, A&M, Nebraska, Baylor, SMU, Arkansas, North Texas, TCU, New Mexico, Arizona and the rest and still do an adequate job of maintaining your strengths.
The ONLY two schools on that list that would give Auburn a run for their money right now would be UT and OU. MAYBE Texas Tech. Yeah, some kid is gonna choose Baylor/SMU/UNT/New Mexico or A&M over AUBURN and the SEC? Puh-leeze.
The Chiz tried to recruit Texas for Iowa State too.
Oranges and rotten apples, my friend.
While it will be easier to get a kid to come to Auburn than to an Iowa State type team, you're still looking at a difficult sell. Why? Because mom and dad want to be able to come see their son play and they don't want to have to buy a plane ticket to do so every weekend.
Mom & Dad would find a way or else would get over it if the son playing at Auburn/the SEC gave him a better shot at the NFL.
And honestly? A lot of these kids don't have parents who could come see them even if they were in College Station or Austin or heaven forbid, Lubbock. It is actually closer to drive to Auburn from Houston than from Houston to Lubbock, and still around 8 hours+ from Houston to Norman. Texas is a freaking big state, and just because these kids may choose to stay in the Big 12 area doesn't mean their parents would automatically have an easier time getting to see them play. I know if my kid was in Norman, I sure as hell would not be driving up there every weekend. I would either fly or watch it on TV.
Sorry, dude, but again - your argument just does not hold water. No downside to recruiting Texas.
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Auburn's bread and butter, ham and gravy, biscuits and eggs, grits and sausage has traditionally (this means always) been in recruiting close to home.
Where did the greatest players in Auburn history come from? Cribbs, Sullivan, Bo, Terry (both), Carnell, etc. all came from Alabama. Ronnie, James Brooks and tons of others came from Georgia. Fullwood and half a billion other kids came from Florida. Jason Campbell came from Mississippi.
That's where Auburn will live and that's where Auburn will die.
Chasing Texas is the worst strategy I can imagine and it just reinforces how stupid I think Chiz is.
WTF is chasing texas? We have 2 recruits from there so far. I mean are you saying we pass on rollison because he aint from around here? We are just expanding a little, and still going where we have always gone as well. Relax, chicken little.
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I wish that we'd hit up Ohio and California a little. I know I would. BTW, Kaos....Auburn got a commitment from John Sullen, while they were "ALL OVER" Texas...he was right under our nose from Auburn High.
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I wish that we'd hit up Ohio and California a little. I know I would. BTW, Kaos....Auburn got a commitment from John Sullen, while they were "ALL OVER" Texas...he was right under our nose from Auburn High.
Duke, Memphis, Southern Miss, Tulane, South Alabama, and UAB have had about enough of y'alls bullshit this past month. Not to mention Central Arkansas and Marshall.
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Duke, Memphis, Southern Miss, Tulane, South Alabama, and UAB have had about enough of y'alls bullshit this past month. Not to mention Central Arkansas and Marshall.
Go ahead and explain. Surely you're not claiming these are the only schools we've earned prospects over.... That would be stupid.
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Go ahead and explain. Surely you're not claiming these are the only schools we've earned prospects over.... That would be stupid.
No, but it does seem to be the pattern the past month. Gulley just commited, he had an offer only from Troy.
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No, but it does seem to be the pattern the past month. Gulley just commited, he had an offer only from Troy.
So Rollison and Egua who had had offers from KSU, Colorado, Texas Tech, Oregon, Florida St.... Those don't count towards this month?? I gotcha...
Must have just been another bad case of diarrhea of the mouth....
Thanks for the update on Gulley though... good kid, and glad he's coming!
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So Rollison and Egua who had had offers from KSU, Colorado, Texas Tech, Oregon, Florida St.... Those don't count towards this month?? I gotcha...
Must have just been another bad case of diarrhea of the mouth....
Thanks for the update on Gulley though... good kid, and glad he's coming!
Maybe you should have paid a little more attention to my previous post. Rollison and Eguae were pointed out that they had been recruited by Luper and Chizik at their previous place of employment. I did not list them under the scrub school category. Joel Knight had some decent offers as well. I still doubt Rollison qualifies anyway, so he's kind of a moot point. There are a few that have a halfway decent list. But alot of them have scrub offers.
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What did your offer list look like coming out of hs?
That's what I thought. Now shut the fuck up, and send somebody out to help that little old lady up.
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What did your offer list look like coming out of hs?
That is the dumbest fucking argument ever. I guess you shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion on politics since you have never been in public office? You can't criticize anything the president does because you're not any better? Total bullshit argument. My simple point is if one school in the entire country offered you (Troy), just how good are you? One way to gauge a recruit's skill is how many offers and where these offers are from. If you have a guy who has offers from virtually every school in the country, that tells you a shitload of coaches has evaluated him and they think he's pretty good. When you have say 5 Div-II teams offering you, that tells me either you have some major grade issues, or maybe you don't have alot of skill.
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Maybe you should have paid a little more attention to my previous post. Rollison and Eguae were pointed out that they had been recruited by Luper and Chizik at their previous place of employment. I did not list them under the scrub school category. Joel Knight had some decent offers as well. I still doubt Rollison qualifies anyway, so he's kind of a moot point. There are a few that have a halfway decent list. But alot of them have scrub offers.
They still are coming to Auburn you fucktard. You made a statement as if our players didn't have those offers. Also, it's already been pointed out that Rollison is actually PROBABLY going to make it into school. It's being reported by Rivals and Scout. So in other words, you doubting him not making it is based on you not knowing shit, and NOT a moot point. There are a few that have a halfway decent list, but the lists are decent, present and your representation was bullshit. Also it's Joe KIGHT, not "Knight". Also, it's not the 4th of February yet, which means by the time we're done, there might be even better lists.
You may now continue with your blowhard bullshit ways.
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They still are coming to Auburn you fucktard. You made a statement as if our players didn't have those offers. Also, it's already been pointed out that Rollison is actually PROBABLY going to make it into school. It's being reported by Rivals and Scout. So in other words, you doubting him not making it is based on you not knowing shit, and NOT a moot point. There are a few that have a halfway decent list, but the lists are decent, present and your representation was bullshit. Also it's Joe KIGHT, not "Knight". Also, it's not the 4th of February yet, which means by the time we're done, there might be even better lists.
You may now continue with your blowhard bullshit ways.
What he said.
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That is the dumbest fucking argument ever. I guess you shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion on politics since you have never been in public office? You can't criticize anything the president does because you're not any better? Total bullshit argument. My simple point is if one school in the entire country offered you (Troy), just how good are you? One way to gauge a recruit's skill is how many offers and where these offers are from. If you have a guy who has offers from virtually every school in the country, that tells you a shitload of coaches has evaluated him and they think he's pretty good. When you have say 5 Div-II teams offering you, that tells me either you have some major grade issues, or maybe you don't have alot of skill.
Fuck You!
Signed,
Karlos Dansby
Dontarrious Thomas
Ronnie Brown
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That is the dumbest fucking argument ever. I guess you shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion on politics since you have never been in public office? You can't criticize anything the president does because you're not any better? Total bullshit argument. My simple point is if one school in the entire country offered you (Troy), just how good are you? One way to gauge a recruit's skill is how many offers and where these offers are from. If you have a guy who has offers from virtually every school in the country, that tells you a shitload of coaches has evaluated him and they think he's pretty good. When you have say 5 Div-II teams offering you, that tells me either you have some major grade issues, or maybe you don't have alot of skill.
That is Dead On, RWS...Thank You
Signed,
Lamarcus Rowell
Willie Williams
Lee Tilley
Leon Hart
Jason Campbell (pre '04)
Greg Smiff
Brodie Croyle
and....
Fuck You!
Signed,
Rod Smith
Courtney Taylor
SenD
Tyronne Green
Tyrone Prothro
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Nope. I'm saying that Jason Campbell was the QB Auburn got, not Vince (who would have been wasted in Tuberville and Borges scheme anyway).
Getting an occasional kid from Texas, California, Wisconsin or Idaho doesn't bother me. If you're talking about a strategy of focusing on Texas because that's where these new coaches came from, I'm telling you now that it is a fail.
You can't serve two masters. You can't have your coaches out burning up the desert in Texas hoping to compete with Texas, OU, Tech, A&M, Nebraska, Baylor, SMU, Arkansas, North Texas, TCU, New Mexico, Arizona and the rest and still do an adequate job of maintaining your strengths.
In the end you'll lose on both ends.
The Chiz tried to recruit Texas for Iowa State too. While it will be easier to get a kid to come to Auburn than to an Iowa State type team, you're still looking at a difficult sell. Why? Because mom and dad want to be able to come see their son play and they don't want to have to buy a plane ticket to do so every weekend.
But whatever.
I think Kaos's point is valid. But I do not agree, because I think his analysis is shallow and incomplete.
If I may restate Kaos's point (correct me if I get it wrong, of course): Recruiting TX requires a reallocation of our resources that have traditionally been focused in AL, MS, GA. These traditional efforts have been the genesis of our success and the foundation upon which our program is built. It is inefficient to expend finite resources (time and money) on non-traditional recruiting grounds to the detriment of our efforts in our traditional recruiting grounds. This is the cost/benefit analysis: is the cost of expending our resources in TX going to present enough benefit to counterbalance the reduced resources spent in our traditional recruiting territory (presumably leading to lesser results in this area)?
If that is the sum total of your argument, then I must respectfully disagree and suggest that there is another analysis at play. The cost/benefit analysis is important, but there is also the risk/reward analysis to consider. The cost/benefit assumes that the value of the top recruits in AL, MS, GA is equal to or greater than the value of the top recruits in TX. I submit that it is not. The top TX recruits are generally rated much higher than the top AL recruits. Therefore, if we spend some resources in TX and snag one or two of their top recruits, this is, qualitatively, better than snagging the top one or two recruits in AL, MS or GA. The risk of not wasting time/money in TX is, in my opinion, outweighed by the reward potential in signing those kids.
I have intentionally left FL out of this analysis because, until recently (the Tuberville area) this pipeline has been sporadic and unreliable. Tuberville, due to his time coaching in SoFL, and his staff built a very nice pipeline to that area, but I do not know if these relationships will be maintained under the new staff. I hope that they are, FL is a very fertile recruiting ground, of course, but due to the uncertainty of the HS coaches' reception of the new staff at AU, I felt it prudent to exclude FL from the discussion.
This is my long winded way of saying, I am happy that our staff is recruiting TX.
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I commend the lawyer from Northwest Florida on his take. I think if you establish somewhat of a "Pipeline" from a particular area, why not keep after it? I certainly don't anticipate this staff foresaking our traditional recruiting grounds by any means. But, if these new coaches have some connections in Texas, it would be stupid not to tap into a resource like that. Somehow, Auburn established a good relationship with the coaches and players in south Florida years ago. Eddie Gran worked that area for Tuberville and that's not exactly a traditional recruiting area for us. But, Auburn has consistently pulled in some big time players from there. I would imagine it's just as long a trek or flight to Ft. Lauderdale/Miami as it is to Texas.
As several have said, if we could pull in 2-3 top kids each year from Texas, why not? And the chance to play in the SEC is not exactly chopped livah.
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I think Kaos's point is valid. But I do not agree, because I think his analysis is shallow and incomplete.
If I may restate Kaos's point (correct me if I get it wrong, of course): Recruiting TX requires a reallocation of our resources that have traditionally been focused in AL, MS, GA. These traditional efforts have been the genesis of our success and the foundation upon which our program is built. It is inefficient to expend finite resources (time and money) on non-traditional recruiting grounds to the detriment of our efforts in our traditional recruiting grounds. This is the cost/benefit analysis: is the cost of expending our resources in TX going to present enough benefit to counterbalance the reduced resources spent in our traditional recruiting territory (presumably leading to lesser results in this area)?
If that is the sum total of your argument, then I must respectfully disagree and suggest that there is another analysis at play. The cost/benefit analysis is important, but there is also the risk/reward analysis to consider. The cost/benefit assumes that the value of the top recruits in AL, MS, GA is equal to or greater than the value of the top recruits in TX. I submit that it is not. The top TX recruits are generally rated much higher than the top AL recruits. Therefore, if we spend some resources in TX and snag one or two of their top recruits, this is, qualitatively, better than snagging the top one or two recruits in AL, MS or GA. The risk of not wasting time/money in TX is, in my opinion, outweighed by the reward potential in signing those kids.
I have intentionally left FL out of this analysis because, until recently (the Tuberville area) this pipeline has been sporadic and unreliable. Tuberville, due to his time coaching in SoFL, and his staff built a very nice pipeline to that area, but I do not know if these relationships will be maintained under the new staff. I hope that they are, FL is a very fertile recruiting ground, of course, but due to the uncertainty of the HS coaches' reception of the new staff at AU, I felt it prudent to exclude FL from the discussion.
This is my long winded way of saying, I am happy that our staff is recruiting TX.
Say you're looking for a whorehouse.
Go to the biggest and best one. The small local places will only have a couple of good looking girls and everyone picks them.
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Say you're looking for a whorehouse.
Go to the biggest and best one. The small local places will only have a couple of good looking girls and everyone picks them.
<sniff. sniff.> I think I'm gonna cry.
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Say you're looking for a whorehouse.
Go to the biggest and best one. The small local places will only have a couple of good looking girls and everyone picks them.
Exactly.
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Say you're looking for a whorehouse.
Go to the biggest and best one. The small local places will only have a couple of good looking girls and everyone picks them.
Analogy, thy name is Boartitz.
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Thanks for stating my position more eloquently.
This is my final say on the matter.
Fucking around in Texas will be a bust. Not only will it be a bust, but it will detract from Auburn's ability to maintain the ties that have served us so well over the years in our "wheelhouse" of Florida, Georgia, Alabama and Mississippi.
I have no issue with targeting certain players from any state. But as an overall recruiting strategy, burning up the Texas highways will be an ass up.
I don't care how many vendors Chopper can see in a week. All of those vendors don't have presentations on the same night at the same time. Not even the miracle Drama Llama can be in more than one place at a time.
Please to be continuing your euphoria. In four or five years you can tell me if I was right or wrong.
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In four or five years you can tell me if I was right or wrong.
I won't need that long to know if we have turned our back on the bread and butter areas.
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I won't need that long to know if we have turned our back on the bread and butter areas.
I'm hungry.
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Thanks for stating my position more eloquently.
I just lost $5 to myself in a bet that I'd get that wrong somehow.
This is my final say on the matter.
Fucking around in Texas will be a bust. Not only will it be a bust, but it will detract from Auburn's ability to maintain the ties that have served us so well over the years in our "wheelhouse" of Florida, Georgia, Alabama and Mississippi.
I have no issue with targeting certain players from any state. But as an overall recruiting strategy, burning up the Texas highways will be an ass up.
I don't care how many vendors Chopper can see in a week. All of those vendors don't have presentations on the same night at the same time. Not even the miracle Drama Llama can be in more than one place at a time.
Please to be continuing your euphoria. In four or five years you can tell me if I was right or wrong.
I'm not euphoric about the TX strategy, but I do believe there is some gain to be had in the situation.
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The problem I'm having with this argument is I haven't seen anything to suggest Auburn is going to make Texas one of it's priorities in the future. Recruiting 2-3 kids from there late in the game doth not a strategy make. As I said earlier, there's very few big names locally left on the board that haven't ruled Auburn out in one sense or another. Why not use the connections you already have in Texas to pluck out some athletes to fill your roster?
Tuberville had already dipped into Texas this year with the lineman who decommitted last week. This staff has gone in and pulled out one of the top rated QB's in the land. I see no reason for that to be some cause for concern.
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I won't need that long to know if we have turned our back on the bread and butter areas.
No, but you will need that long to determine if bringing Texas kids to the SEC will be a boon or a bust. Let me reinforce the point some have apparently missed, I'm talking about an overall strategy of recruiting Texas as a whole and not the cherrypicking of individuals who might fit the program.
Chop posted his super duper list of great Texas QBs out there. How many of those guys seriously play in the SEC? Stafford and Snead? How many actually could start? Stafford, Snead, McCoy?
Why did Stafford go to Georgia? It wasn't because the Bulldogs were burning up the Texas trail. Stafford was the only person on their roster from the state. His sister is also a student at UGA. He was born in Tampa and lived in Dunwoody while his dad went to UGA. He chose the Bulldogs, not the other way around. They didn't have to recruit him.
Why did Snead come to Ole Miss? Certainly wasn't his first choice. He chose Texas but was going to sit there and justifiably so. He picked Ole Miss off the scrap heap because he could play immediately.
There are a shitload of good quarterbacks in California. Maybe Chiz should set up shop there, too. And also Ohio.
I feel the way I feel. Can't change my mind on it. Might be wrong. Hope I am and he doesn't waste three or four years chasing sagebrush in Texas.
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Wesfau's and Harvey's last two responses sum up my position on this. Also, I'd like to note that while it is true that I can not see all my "vendors" (they're clients) at the same time in different places, if I had even half the staff doing the job that Auburn has doing theirs, I'd have no problem being in more than one place at the same time. That's only if Texas WAS my main, one and only priority. Nobody here says it is.
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Chop posted his super duper list of great Texas QBs out there. How many of those guys seriously play in the SEC? Stafford and Snead? How many actually could start? Stafford, Snead, McCoy?
Who fucking cares who only played in the SEC? You going to tell me that that the other QB's on that list wouldn't start in the SEC if they had gone there? I personally don't care if they're from Bumblescrew, Wyoming. If they're the best, I at least want to guage whether or not we can get them to Auburn. Again, why does posting that list make you feel that Texas all the sudden becomes our one and ONLY priority. You talk as if we are saying that, I don't see it.
I feel the way I feel. Can't change my mind on it. Might be wrong. Hope I am and he doesn't waste three or four years chasing sagebrush in Texas.
So, do we have the right to tell you that you won't change ours?
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Who fucking cares who only played in the SEC? You going to tell me that that the other QB's on that list wouldn't start in the SEC if they had gone there? I personally don't care if they're from Bumblescrew, Wyoming. If they're the best, I at least want to guage whether or not we can get them to Auburn. Again, why does posting that list make you feel that Texas all the sudden becomes our one and ONLY priority. You talk as if we are saying that, I don't see it.
So, do we have the right to tell you that you won't change ours?
I don't give a shit what you tell me, DL.
And yeah, I'm saying most of the kids on that list wouldn't start in the SEC. That's EXACTLY what I'm saying. Congratulations on getting it right the first time and not wasting 24 pages on discussion about brownie recipes and the best route from Amarillo to Houston while you circled around it.
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No, but you will need that long to determine if bringing Texas kids to the SEC will be a boon or a bust. Let me reinforce the point some have apparently missed, I'm talking about an overall strategy of recruiting Texas as a whole and not the cherrypicking of individuals who might fit the program.
So Texas kids can't stand up to the mighty SEC caliber of football? I'm calling shennanigans. If you have talent you have talent.
Why did Stafford go to Georgia? It wasn't because the Bulldogs were burning up the Texas trail. Stafford was the only person on their roster from the state. His sister is also a student at UGA. He was born in Tampa and lived in Dunwoody while his dad went to UGA. He chose the Bulldogs, not the other way around. They didn't have to recruit him.
Still a Texas kid any way you cut it and did not play at the highest level of HS competition.
Why did Snead come to Ole Miss? Certainly wasn't his first choice. He chose Texas but was going to sit there and justifiably so. He picked Ole Miss off the scrap heap because he could play immediately.
The same could be said of Bo Jackson coming to AU.
There are a shitload of good quarterbacks in California. Maybe Chiz should set up shop there, too. And also Ohio.
If he can cherry pick one then maybe he should.
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One would be hard pressed to say that these QB's could not start in the SEC
1. Colt McCoy, Texas (Tuscola Jim Ned)
2. Matthew Stafford, Georgia (Highland Park)
4. Brian Johnson, Utah (Baytown Lee)
5. Jevan Snead, Ole Miss (Stephenville)
6. Chase Holbrook, New Mexico State (Hurst L.D. Bell)
7. Chase Daniel, Missouri (Southlake Carroll)
10. Graham Harrell, Texas Tech (Ennis)
12. Casey Dick, Arkansas (Allen)
14. Jarrett Lee, LSU (Brenham)
16. Chase Clement, Rice (San Antonio Alamo Heights)
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I don't give a shit what you tell me, DL.
And yeah, I'm saying most of the kids on that list wouldn't start in the SEC. That's EXACTLY what I'm saying. Congratulations on getting it right the first time and not wasting 24 pages on discussion about brownie recipes and the best route from Amarillo to Houston while you circled around it.
I hear ya. You're always the first to get to the point. Good effort at trying to stir the pot with your little quips and shots at me. I've caught them, they're just weak and irrellevant.
As far as you saying QB's like Colt McCoy, Graham Harrell, Chase Daniel not being SEC level talent, you prove that you're more hell-bent on being different, calling people names and being the black sheep as opposed to being rational.
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Why did Snead come to Ole Miss? Certainly wasn't his first choice. He chose Texas but was going to sit there and justifiably so. He picked Ole Miss off the scrap heap because he could play immediately.
Jevan Snead also went to Florida, and it was after some kid named Tebow showed up that he transferred for a second time. I'm sure you just forgot about that though.
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One would be hard pressed to say that these QB's could not start in the SEC
1. Colt McCoy, Texas (Tuscola Jim Ned)
2. Matthew Stafford, Georgia (Highland Park)
4. Brian Johnson, Utah (Baytown Lee)
5. Jevan Snead, Ole Miss (Stephenville)
6. Chase Holbrook, New Mexico State (Hurst L.D. Bell)
7. Chase Daniel, Missouri (Southlake Carroll)
10. Graham Harrell, Texas Tech (Ennis)
12. Casey Dick, Arkansas (Allen)
14. Jarrett Lee, LSU (Brenham)
16. Chase Clement, Rice (San Antonio Alamo Heights)
We saw that Jarrett Lee couldn't hack it already. So scratch that one. We've seen Casey Dick be both good and bad. Arky is always looking for something else at QB, so scratch that one. Besides, Arkansas recruiting some in East Texas makes geographic sense anyway.
I watched Harrell at the Senior Bowl. I don't think he would make it at a good SEC program, no I don't.
You list all those people and with the exception of Auburn, Tennessee and probably MSU, I think the quarterbacks in the SEC were just as good or better than most of that list. Outside McCoy and Stafford (who never really impressed me that much anyway) there's nothing really outstanding there.
You guys can't have it both ways. The argument is ALWAYS that the Big 12 and the Big 10 cannot match up with superior SEC size, skill and speed. We've seen it time and time again. Year after year. So which is it? You want them to be slow or you want them to be equal? Can't have it both way's sonny, cause iff'n they're equal they won't be slow. And iff'n they're slow, they're not gonna be as good...
Make up your minds. Mine's made up.
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Jevan Snead also went to Florida, and it was after some kid named Tebow showed up that he transferred for a second time. I'm sure you just forgot about that though.
I guess you forgot what the term "went" means.
Snead committed to Florida, but never went there. Changed his commit to Texas after a recruiting visit there.
I guess you "forgot" Enrique Davis went to Auburn before some kid showed up and he transferred. :taunt:
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Kaos,
Where was your outrage when Tuberville started establishing a pipeline in Florida?
Now you're revising history by saying that Florida is a "traditional" pipeline for Auburn.
And furthermore, why is it so important that this holy tr'dition be upheld anyway? Sounds like bammer talk to me.
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We saw that Jarrett Lee couldn't hack it already. So scratch that one. We've seen Casey Dick be both good and bad. Arky is always looking for something else at QB, so scratch that one. Besides, Arkansas recruiting some in East Texas makes geographic sense anyway.
I watched Harrell at the Senior Bowl. I don't think he would make it at a good SEC program, no I don't.
You list all those people and with the exception of Auburn, Tennessee and probably MSU, I think the quarterbacks in the SEC were just as good or better than most of that list. Outside McCoy and Stafford (who never really impressed me that much anyway) there's nothing really outstanding there.
You guys can't have it both ways. The argument is ALWAYS that the Big 12 and the Big 10 cannot match up with superior SEC size, skill and speed. We've seen it time and time again. Year after year. So which is it? You want them to be slow or you want them to be equal? Can't have it both way's sonny, cause iff'n they're equal they won't be slow. And iff'n they're slow, they're not gonna be as good...
Make up your minds. Mine's made up.
So you pick out a redshirt freshman that killed us at Auburn this year even if he was inconsistent the rest while splitting time with two other QB's, Graham Harrell, and base his effectiveness on his play in one game at the Senior Bowl despite his career, and then round it out with a questionable Casey Dick to make your point?
Weak. I'm not sure why this debate is even still going....
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I guess you forgot what the term "went" means.
Snead committed to Florida, but never went there. Changed his commit to Texas after a recruiting visit there.
I guess you "forgot" Enrique Davis went to Auburn before some kid showed up and he transferred. :taunt:
If Florida was an SEC School, then I guess he was good enough for them too was the point. I hear ya though... good comeback.
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We saw that Jarrett Lee couldn't hack it already.
That's premature, in my opinion. The kid got half a chance as a RsFr. He's still got some developing to do.
So scratch that one. We've seen Casey Dick be both good and bad. Arky is always looking for something else at QB, so scratch that one. Besides, Arkansas recruiting some in East Texas makes geographic sense anyway.
So, the program's proclivity to QB swap indicates a failing on the part of C. Dick? C'mon. You're better than that.
I watched Harrell at the Senior Bowl. I don't think he would make it at a good SEC program, no I don't.
Who would want a 70+% Heisman candidate at QB in the SEC? Your QB evaluation skills remain intact.
You guys can't have it both ways. The argument is ALWAYS that the Big 12 and the Big 10 cannot match up with superior SEC size, skill and speed. We've seen it time and time again. Year after year. So which is it? You want them to be slow or you want them to be equal? Can't have it both way's sonny, cause iff'n they're equal they won't be slow. And iff'n they're slow, they're not gonna be as good...
You're mixing your arguments: Big 12 is no defense; Big 10 is slow.
Make up your minds. Mine's made up.
You and George W. have that in common at least.
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Kevin, one question. Are you skeptical of the talent we may land out of Texas being able to excel in the SEC or are you apprehensive of this staff foresaking the "Traditional" recruting grounds for greener pastures?
If they do in fact give Alabama, Miss., Georgia etc. the back of their hand in an effort to establish themselves in Texas, I'm with ya' 100%. It's an absolute given that we have to keep the relationships with local programs in tact and pull the corp of our kids from around here. But, if your skepticism is over the talent we get from out West, I don't see it.
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Kaos,
Where was your outrage when Tuberville started establishing a pipeline in Florida?
Now you're revising history by saying that Florida is a "traditional" pipeline for Auburn.
And furthermore, why is it so important that this holy tr'dition be upheld anyway? Sounds like bammer talk to me.
Florida has been an Auburn recruiting ground since 1980. 29 years is long enough for me. Tuberville didn't "start a pipeline" to Florida. Not by ANY stretch of the imagination.
Dye did that. Bowden followed. Go back and check the rosters from the 80s and 90s. AU had plenty of kids from Florida then.
Dye established the Dillard High pathway, not Tuberville.
It's not about upholding tradition, it's about doing what you (should) do best.
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So you pick out a redshirt freshman that killed us at Auburn this year even if he was inconsistent the rest while splitting time with two other QB's, Graham Harrell, and base his effectiveness on his play in one game at the Senior Bowl despite his career, and then round it out with a questionable Casey Dick to make your point?
Weak. I'm not sure why this debate is even still going....
Because you rally round flags that don't exist, primarily.
I already said McCoy was good. I already said Snead had earned a spot at Ole Miss.
But beyond that your amazing list really wasn't that fucking amazing. You listed a bunch of guys who were playing QB at a bunch of SHIT schools for the most part. I don't think any of them would have warranted wasting time chasing jackrabbits in Texas.
Harrell was a product of the crazy ass system Leach runs (as several QBs have been before him) and looked like a wilting flower in the Sr. Bowl against quality competition. He impressed nobody there. The experts ranked him as the "biggest (fucking) disappointment of the week."
No, I don't think Harrell could play in the SEC. Period. You're the one who posted the golly gee amazing Texas list as if it proved something. Did you research how many QBs in the NFL were from Texas? From Florida? From Georgia? From Alabama? How many from those states were playing college footballl? I didn't think so.
So go ahead and plant your victory flag, Chop. It's your forte! You showed mean old Kaos what was what.
:taunt:
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If Florida was an SEC School, then I guess he was good enough for them too was the point. I hear ya though... good comeback.
No, llama, it wasn't a matter of you being misquoted or scoring your point. You said EXPLICITLY that Snead went to Florida and then transferred. Then you added your typical snide ass comment to show off.
Except -- sense a trend? -- you had it all fucked up and it wasn't the way you remembered it.
So you ended up making yourself look like a tool.
:thumbsup:
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can you guys continue...let's say between 8:00 p.m. - 10:00 p.m. (pst)..(?)...i'm not getting any work done today.
thank you in advance.
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I already said McCoy was good. I already said Snead had earned a spot at Ole Miss.
So no problems there.
But beyond that your amazing list really wasn't that fucking amazing. You listed a bunch of guys who were playing QB at a bunch of SHIT schools for the most part. I don't think any of them would have warranted wasting time chasing jackrabbits in Texas.
This is purely your opinion, not fact. I also happen to believe it's :bs: JMO...
Harrell was a product of the crazy ass system Leach runs (as several QBs have been before him) and looked like a wilting flower in the Sr. Bowl against quality competition. He impressed nobody there. The experts ranked him as the "biggest (fucking) disappointment of the week."
Fine, but there's no denying he ran his system well, and had 70% completions with as many attemts that were thrown in that "crazy" system. I don't give a shit what you think, that's fucking good.
No, I don't think Harrell could play in the SEC. Period.
I think you've made this clear. It's your opinion, but again doesn't make it fact. We simply disagree.
You're the one who posted the golly gee amazing Texas list as if it proved something. Did you research how many QBs in the NFL were from Texas? From Florida? From Georgia? From Alabama? How many from those states were playing college footballl?
Auburn isn't an NFL team. So I'm not sure what your point is there. However, while calling it what you want, the list DOES show a lot of quarterbacks that Qb'd winning teams THIS YEAR in Division 1 football, and others that made pretty good SEC squads.
So go ahead and plant your victory flag, Chop. It's your forte! You showed mean old Kaos what was what.
Spare me the pot stirring. It's just making YOU look stupid now.
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No, llama, it wasn't a matter of you being misquoted or scoring your point. You said EXPLICITLY that Snead went to Florida and then transferred. Then you added your typical snide ass comment to show off.
Except -- sense a trend? -- you had it all fucked up and it wasn't the way you remembered it.
So you ended up making yourself look like a tool.
:thumbsup:
Fine. You're right. I said it completely incorrectly.
However, the fact remains that he was allowed to commit to Florida shows that he was worthy of a scholarship at an SEC school. It was in rebutle to your assertion that most of the kids on that list were not SEC talent level QB's. Which I think was silly. JMO....
Keep the pot stirring going though. I know it's killing you that I'm not going the personal name calling route.
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Kevin, one question. Are you skeptical of the talent we may land out of Texas being able to excel in the SEC or are you apprehensive of this staff foresaking the "Traditional" recruting grounds for greener pastures?
If they do in fact give Alabama, Miss., Georgia etc. the back of their hand in an effort to establish themselves in Texas, I'm with ya' 100%. It's an absolute given that we have to keep the relationships with local programs in tact and pull the corp of our kids from around here. But, if your skepticism is over the talent we get from out West, I don't see it.
The issue I have is with the general philosophy of turning recruiting attention toward Texas. That was what I got out of whatever the original thread was that opened this can of worms. I've said a hundred times -- and I think only one dromedary has at this point failed to comprehend -- that I have no issue at all with finding kids in other states who have an interest and pursuing them as hard as legally allowed. Ben Tate for instance.
I'd love to be a "national recruiter." But not even the best recruiters go panning outside their base. Pete Carroll identifies a handful of kids in other states and throws every trick in the book at them. No problem there. But his base is still the southwest. That's where he knows he can almost always get the BEST kids from.
So what are my problems with Auburn skulking around in Texas, even now?
1) Most of the guys we have on staff now know that area better. Other than Chiz, there's not a soul there who could find Andalusia, Muscle Shoals, Brantley or Gadsden without a GPS. The time to be learning where all those places are is NOW. Maybe you don't pick up any of the big names still on the board in the state, but you're damn sure not going to get them if you're fucking around in Gonzales. And you're not going to see their teammates who will make up the NEXT class.
2) Which brings me to the number of highly-rated recruits still on the board in the state. When we're dicking around with kids from Texas, what are the guys here being told? Maybe Rollison invented sliced bread, I don't know. Was Texas or OU recruiting him? But if you ask me if I'd rather have him or Dre or Tana... well....
3) Chizik's past history is another concern. When he went to ISU, the first thing he did was start recruiting Texas. He was going to get the Cyclones in the business of national recruiting. Pretty fucking long haul from Texas to Iowa. Didn't work there. And spare me the "that's ISU, not Auburn." I know ISU isn't Auburn. But didn't he learn anything? Why come to AU and start up the same bullshit?
Skepticism is not that there is no talent in Texas. I'm sure there is. But it will be much (much) more difficult to draw that talent. In Auburn's geographic recruiting base you've got kids who grow up dreaming of playing in the SEC. There, it's the Big 12. Unless it's a weird situation (like Stafford, who grew up a Dawg and was going there no matter what or Snead who couldn't pull ahead of McCoy at UT) I don't think Auburn (or Alabama, Tennessee, Florida, Georgia or any other SEC team) can fight off Texas, OU, A&M, TCU, etc. for the true playmakers.
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So no problems there.
This is purely your opinion, not fact. I also happen to believe it's :bs: JMO...
Fine, but there's no denying he ran his system well, and had 70% completions with as many attemts that were thrown in that "crazy" system. I don't give a shit what you think, that's fucking good.
I think you've made this clear. It's your opinion, but again doesn't make it fact. We simply disagree.
Auburn isn't an NFL team. So I'm not sure what your point is there. However, while calling it what you want, the list DOES show a lot of quarterbacks that Qb'd winning teams THIS YEAR in Division 1 football, and others that made pretty good SEC squads.
Spare me the pot stirring. It's just making YOU look stupid now.
No, Chop, it isn't just MY opinion on Harrell. It's the opinion of professionals who are paid to make judgements on the relative talent of players competing for positions in the NFL draft. Harrell just doesn't have it. He's not "fucking good." I'm grateful you're not evaluating talent for a living.
And the point is you listed a bunch of quarterbacks from the state of Texas. So fucking what? Unless you have a relative comparison of how many quarterbacks on D1 rosters were from the states of Georgia, Florida, Tennessee, Mississippi and Alabama, then you just have a meaningless list. For all you know there are far more from those states who are on college rosters or who have gone on to NFL success. Maybe that invalidates your entire argument? But why bother finding out.
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Skepticism is not that there is no talent in Texas. I'm sure there is. But it will be much (much) more difficult to draw that talent. In Auburn's geographic recruiting base you've got kids who grow up dreaming of playing in the SEC. There, it's the Big 12. Unless it's a weird situation (like Stafford, who grew up a Dawg and was going there no matter what or Snead who couldn't pull ahead of McCoy at UT) I don't think Auburn (or Alabama, Tennessee, Florida, Georgia or any other SEC team) can fight off Texas, OU, A&M, TCU, etc. for the true playmakers.
The "true playmakers" want to go wherever they can play on the biggest stage, with the most coverage and for the biggest prizes.
The last 3 BCS champs have been SEC teams.
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Again, one simple statement makes your arguement moot for most to me at least. NOBODY here says that we agree with recruiting TEXAS exclusively. Nobody has. Nobody is. Nobody will. We're still getting recruits from all over the southeast, not JUST Texas. Your argument would make more sense if we had shown we were going to abandon our base recruiting areas. We just haven't. Period.
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No, Chop, it isn't just MY opinion on Harrell. It's the opinion of professionals who are paid to make judgements on the relative talent of players competing for positions in the NFL draft. Harrell just doesn't have it. He's not "fucking good." I'm grateful you're not evaluating talent for a living.
It isn't your talent for a living either. Thank God. Also, while you might have heard this and that that particular weekend, I've heard other "professionals" talk about HOW GOOD HE IS. Get over yourself, seriously.
And the point is you listed a bunch of quarterbacks from the state of Texas. So fucking what? Unless you have a relative comparison of how many quarterbacks on D1 rosters were from the states of Georgia, Florida, Tennessee, Mississippi and Alabama, then you just have a meaningless list. For all you know there are far more from those states who are on college rosters or who have gone on to NFL success. Maybe that invalidates your entire argument? But why bother finding out.
Dude, if you can't see the talent on that list and simply gather that there's talent in Texas and good talent at that, then continue pissing on your own shoes. So far you're the ONLY one here that hasn't "gotten" what that list is about. Good lord.
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Fine. You're right. I said it completely incorrectly.
However, the fact remains that he was allowed to commit to Florida shows that he was worthy of a scholarship at an SEC school. It was in rebutle to your assertion that most of the kids on that list were not SEC talent level QB's. Which I think was silly. JMO....
Keep the pot stirring going though. I know it's killing you that I'm not going the personal name calling route.
You're so wrong about this.
You see, Chop, despite your perception I don't care about YOU. I mean no offense in that, it's just that I don't concern myself with how you're going to react or what you're doing. I only care about the discussion and how its crafted.
Everything, Chop, is NOT about YOU no matter how many dramatic affirmations you post, how many new versions appear or how many mea culpas you issue.
I confess that I enjoy mocking the drama. It provides me with brief interludes of humor that break up the day's monotony. But if you'll note, I never mock you, I only mock the drama. I'm grateful that you provide it.
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The "true playmakers" want to go wherever they can play on the biggest stage, with the most coverage and for the biggest prizes.
The last 3 BCS champs have been SEC teams.
You would think this is easy to understand... but....
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The "true playmakers" want to go wherever they can play on the biggest stage, with the most coverage and for the biggest prizes.
The last 3 BCS champs have been SEC teams.
How many kids from Texas on their rosters? I mean, they couldn't have made it without that Texas infusion.
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You're so wrong about this.
You see, Chop, despite your perception I don't care about YOU. I mean no offense in that, it's just that I don't concern myself with how you're going to react or what you're doing. I only care about the discussion and how its crafted.
Everything, Chop, is NOT about YOU no matter how many dramatic affirmations you post, how many new versions appear or how many mea culpas you issue.
I confess that I enjoy mocking the drama. It provides me with brief interludes of humor that break up the day's monotony. But if you'll note, I never mock you, I only mock the drama. I'm grateful that you provide it.
Yawn. I just look at the 10 or so posts past your "this is my final word" statement, at the personal quips and shots at me, while I've only debated....and yawn, chuckle and retire from this arguement with you. It's worthless. While I've done it in the past, I'm not the one making myself look stupid here.
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How many kids from Texas on their rosters? I mean, they couldn't have made it without that Texas infusion.
That's an excellent strawman you're building. I'm full from taking CCTAU's bait earlier and I'll leave this worm in the pond.
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Again, one simple statement makes your arguement moot for most to me at least. NOBODY here says that we agree with recruiting TEXAS exclusively. Nobody has. Nobody is. Nobody will. We're still getting recruits from all over the southeast, not JUST Texas. Your argument would make more sense if we had shown we were going to abandon our base recruiting areas. We just haven't. Period.
And you pull a word out of your ass and try to fit it into my argument. Bzzzzzt.
I never said exclusive. My point is (and remains despite your babble) that you can't serve two masters. You can't "recruit Texas" and maintain what you're doing in Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Mississippi and Alabama.
I don't care how many clients you can miraculously serve simultaneously, programs simply DO NOT have the staff to be in that many places at once. You have to pick and choose your battles. IMO picking Texas as a battleground (if this is, in fact, what the strategy is) is a likely fail.
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While I've done it in the past, I'm not the one making myself look stupid here.
Ummmm, okaaaaaaaaaaaaay.
:thumbsup:
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(if this is, in fact, what the strategy is)
There's been a lot of pissing and moaning over a strategy that we don't even know has been implemented, is planned to be implemented or is even on the fucking table.
Awesome.
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I think I'm actually seeing some common ground here. Would it be safe to say that this argument is actaully pointless UNTIL this staff declares recruiting Texas big time as a strategy? Everyone agrees it's fine to use your connections and cherry pick...right? But until we see our guys in Texas week after week....
Okay, Wes beat me to the punch. Fucker.
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How many kids from Texas on their rosters? I mean, they couldn't have made it without that Texas infusion.
This is not germane to the argument anyone has made, but since you asked:
UF currently has 7 Texans.
LSU has 14.
I didn't go back and account for any graduating seniors after the '06 and '07 BCS Nat. Champ games.
That means that 8% of UF's scholarship roster and 16% of LSU's come from Texas. Those are not insignificant numbers.
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This is not germane to the argument anyone has made, but since you asked:
UF currently has 7 Texans.
LSU has 14.
I didn't go back and account for any graduating seniors after the '06 and '07 BCS Nat. Champ games.
That means that 8% of UF's scholarship roster and 16% of LSU's come from Texas. Those are not insignificant numbers.
Yeah, but how many play in the NFL!?!? hehe... just kidding. :bar:
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There's been a lot of pissing and moaning over a strategy that we don't even know has been implemented, is planned to be implemented or is even on the fucking table.
Awesome.
Agreed.
This entire thing blew up from me saying -- and I still say it -- that Auburn recruiting Texas is a FAIL.
Some folks jumped in with both feet.
If there's one thing you can count on, I'm going to defend my opinions even if the herd charges in another direction.
See? Mean old Kaos never said there was no talent in Texas. Never said that signing a kid from Texas was a bad thing. All nasty old Kaos said was that focusing there instead of where AU makes its hay is a deathtrap. Kaos said it because he's a student of history. He knows that most people are predictable. He knows that you can generally figure out what somebody is going to do by studying their past moves. Chiz busted a nut recruiting Texas for ISU. That was a bad deal. This is of concern to Kaos because that same pattern seems to be repeating now. He hired assistants with little to no SEC experience and whose base of knowledge is the Texas area.
And that's the whole thing in a nutshell. Some folks can't help frothing, though. It happens. Kaos understands.
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Agreed.
This entire thing blew up from me saying -- and I still say it -- that Auburn recruiting Texas is a FAIL.
Some folks jumped in with both feet.
If there's one thing you can count on, I'm going to defend my opinions even if the herd charges in another direction.
See? Mean old Kaos never said there was no talent in Texas. Never said that signing a kid from Texas was a bad thing. All nasty old Kaos said was that focusing there instead of where AU makes its hay is a deathtrap. Kaos said it because he's a student of history. He knows that most people are predictable. He knows that you can generally figure out what somebody is going to do by studying their past moves. Chiz busted a nut recruiting Texas for ISU. That was a bad deal. This is of concern to Kaos because that same pattern seems to be repeating now. He hired assistants with little to no SEC experience and whose base of knowledge is the Texas area.
And that's the whole thing in a nutshell. Some folks can't help frothing, though. It happens. Kaos understands.
Might I humbly suggest that we've maxed out our potential in the "traditional" recruiting grounds? We've been doing the same thing for decades now and still haven't quite made that leap into the rarefied air of perennial championship contenders.
Suppose we continue to foster our relationships at home and strike out into new areas (yes, even those areas that our current staff has developed relationships) and try snagging a few of those big names that begin to catapult a program in this day and age.
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Eeeeeasy Wes. Baby steps...
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Might I humbly suggest that we've maxed out our potential in the "traditional" recruiting grounds? We've been doing the same thing for decades now and still haven't quite made that leap into the rarefied air of perennial championship contenders.
Suppose we continue to foster our relationships at home and strike out into new areas (yes, even those areas that our current staff has developed relationships) and try snagging a few of those big names that begin to catapult a program in this day and age.
it worked for lewis and clark.
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Yeah, but how many play in the NFL!?!? hehe... just kidding. :bar:
Funny you should ask:
But some states fare better than others when it comes to seeing production from former high school players in the NFL. California holds its own - and the No. 1 spot - with the most NFL players with 214. Florida ranks second with 185 players, and Texas rounds out the top three with 170. Keeping pace with the most star-studded states, Miami and Houston top the list of hometowns with the most NFL players with 34 and 27, respectively.
High School to NFL Article (http://www.usafootball.com/articles/displayArticle/6332/6236)
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Might I humbly suggest that we've maxed out our potential in the "traditional" recruiting grounds? We've been doing the same thing for decades now and still haven't quite made that leap into the rarefied air of perennial championship contenders.
Suppose we continue to foster our relationships at home and strike out into new areas (yes, even those areas that our current staff has developed relationships) and try snagging a few of those big names that begin to catapult a program in this day and age.
Don't agree with the base being tapped out. It replenishes itself year after year. We did okay in '04 with a team full of kids that didn't hail from Texas or California.
Cherry pick from there maybe.
Otherwise? Fail. Not enough staff to serve two masters. Seriously.
Do you think Big 12 teams just ignore Florida because they hate sunshine and oranges?
Target a few and see what happens. It's not like AU hasn't done that. Ben Tate is from Maryland.
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it worked for lewis and clark.
How DID that whole "Louisiana Purchase" dealio work out?
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Funny you should ask:
But some states fare better than others when it comes to seeing production from former high school players in the NFL. California holds its own - and the No. 1 spot - with the most NFL players with 214. Florida ranks second with 185 players, and Texas rounds out the top three with 170. Keeping pace with the most star-studded states, Miami and Houston top the list of hometowns with the most NFL players with 34 and 27, respectively.
High School to NFL Article (http://www.usafootball.com/articles/displayArticle/6332/6236)
:doh:
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Don't agree with the base being tapped out. It replenishes itself year after year. We did okay in '04 with a team full of kids that didn't hail from Texas or California.
1 year out of how many?
Otherwise? Fail. Not enough staff to serve two masters. Seriously.
I've already dissected this argument. We disagree.
Do you think Big 12 teams just ignore Florida because they hate sunshine and oranges?
Texas and OU don't have to leave those two states to fill their rosters. Auburn does. The rest of the Big 12 isn't relevant to anyone outside of the Big 12.
Edit note: I was wrong about OU...their roster is a wide representation of the US. Texas has exactly 3 non-Texans on its roster.
Target a few and see what happens. It's not like AU hasn't done that. Ben Tate is from Maryland.
I agree with this.
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In my opinion, here is the bottom line:
Lets take Rollison for example. He's from Texas. His offer list isn't widely impressive, but he put up some good numbers, and I think he played 2A ball (I may be thinking of Mosley on this)? He's got some weight to put on to be able to withstand playing in the SEC, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's a bad QB either. It just means he needs a little more meat on his bones to take what he's going to get. If he can step in and shame every QB on the roster and light up SEC secondaries, then so be it. He's good. He may be the next coming of Jesus for all I know. But, one shouldn't think he's going to be a stud just because he's from TX and other QBs from Texas have been good. Just because he put up really good numbers at the HS level doesn't mean he will do it in the SEC. Look what happened to Kodi Burns. He was Mr. Everything his SR year. So far, he hasn't shown much, and that goes well beyond having a shitty OC for half the season.
There is usually a pretty good amount of talent that comes out of TX, but not everybody is. There is alot of good talent that comes out across the country for that matter. Not every single one of them turns out to be good at the college level, though. You don't really know if they're good or not until they play a little. Its easy enough to sit here and say this guy is or isn't good, but we honestly don't know. Everybody is entitled to their opinion as to how he will do. Its like I said before, it all comes down to the evaluation the coach makes. I would hope a coach wouldn't just take everything he can get out of TX blindly just because its TX. I see no problem with cherrypicking the talent out of a state though. You just better hope that "talent" translates to college "talent".
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I've already dissected this argument. We disagree.
More than one year. I just used 04 as an example.
Simple question: Are you willing to pass on kids from Alabama, Florida and Georgia to chase kids in Texas knowing that you're going to be (more than likely) only getting those kids for whom Texas and OU are out of the question?
You're going to have to show me how a coach can make four stops at kids at Alabama high schools to see them play on Friday night and talk to their mommas while he's also in Texas (or whereever) that same Friday night seeing kids and mommas there.
Can't be done.
You've got to pick battles and battlegrounds.
I'm more comfortable with Auburn fighting Urban Meyer and Nick Saban for recruits than I am Auburn trying to cross swords with Mack Brown and Bob Stoops because there you're fighting with one hand tied already.
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More than one year. I just used 04 as an example.
OK...give me the rest of the list.
Simple question: Are you willing to pass on kids from Alabama, Florida and Georgia to chase kids in Texas knowing that you're going to be (more than likely) only getting those kids for whom Texas and OU are out of the question?
I don't think that you have to pass on the ones you want.
You're going to have to show me how a coach can make four stops at kids at Alabama high schools to see them play on Friday night and talk to their mommas while he's also in Texas (or whereever) that same Friday night seeing kids and mommas there.
Can't be done.
There are lots of coaches on the staff. I think they can spread the duties around sufficiently. Call me a blind optimist if you must, but I'll just call you a blind pessimist.
You've got to pick battles and battlegrounds.
I'm more comfortable with Auburn fighting Urban Meyer and Nick Saban for recruits than I am Auburn trying to cross swords with Mack Brown and Bob Stoops because there you're fighting with one hand tied already.
I disagree.
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No, Chop, it isn't just MY opinion on Harrell. It's the opinion of professionals who are paid to make judgements on the relative talent of players competing for positions in the NFL draft. Harrell just doesn't have it. He's not "fucking good." I'm grateful you're not evaluating talent for a living.
And the point is you listed a bunch of quarterbacks from the state of Texas. So fucking what? Unless you have a relative comparison of how many quarterbacks on D1 rosters were from the states of Georgia, Florida, Tennessee, Mississippi and Alabama, then you just have a meaningless list. For all you know there are far more from those states who are on college rosters or who have gone on to NFL success. Maybe that invalidates your entire argument? But why bother finding out.
Are thise the same proffessionals that have said that tebow is not NFL caliber QB talent? Timmy and his Heisman and 2 national championships say he is one hell of a college QB. Graham Harrell would start at almost any school in the SEC, maybe short of FL.
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In my opinion, here is the bottom line:
Lets take Rollison for example. He's from Texas. His offer list isn't widely impressive, but he put up some good numbers, and I think he played 2A ball (I may be thinking of Mosley on this)? He's got some weight to put on to be able to withstand playing in the SEC, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's a bad QB either. It just means he needs a little more meat on his bones to take what he's going to get. If he can step in and shame every QB on the roster and light up SEC secondaries, then so be it. He's good. He may be the next coming of Jesus for all I know. But, one shouldn't think he's going to be a stud just because he's from TX and other QBs from Texas have been good. Just because he put up really good numbers at the HS level doesn't mean he will do it in the SEC.
Who knows about Rollison yet, but I'd be just as happy about landing the #2 Dual Threat QB in the NATION if he was from Pencildick, CT.
Look what happened to Kodi Burns. He was Mr. Everything his SR year. So far, he hasn't shown much, and that goes well beyond having a shitty OC for half the season.
Yeah, I'm sure sitting out half the year and having no QB coach, or any coaching for that matter, made a difference.
There is usually a pretty good amount of talent that comes out of TX, but not everybody is. There is alot of good talent that comes out across the country for that matter. Not every single one of them turns out to be good at the college level, though. You don't really know if they're good or not until they play a little. Its easy enough to sit here and say this guy is or isn't good, but we honestly don't know. Everybody is entitled to their opinion as to how he will do. Its like I said before, it all comes down to the evaluation the coach makes. I would hope a coach wouldn't just take everything he can get out of TX blindly just because its TX. I see no problem with cherrypicking the talent out of a state though. You just better hope that "talent" translates to college "talent".
Well, at least I don't think either side will disagree with you here.
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OK...give me the rest of the list.
I don't think that you have to pass on the ones you want.
There are lots of coaches on the staff. I think they can spread the duties around sufficiently. Call me a blind optimist if you must, but I'll just call you a blind pessimist.
I disagree.
Then you disagree with yourself. You said Texas and OU can fill their roster without leaving the state. That implies that they get who they want from there. That being the case, then AU would be at a significant disadvantage in that recruiting area.
As for the list? Since 1981, Auburn's had several ten and 11 win teams, two undefeated teams and three teams that could/should have won national titles. Georgia's had a ton of success. Alabama had the (alleged) number one recruiting class in the country last year. How many were from Texas? One. Round Square or some such shit. Never heard of him. How many were from states outside AL, MS, FL, GA, TN, LA? Three. One was the Round Square dude, the other was a kicker from Saban's home town in WV and the third was the son of a guy who played for Saban at Michigan State.
LSU has Texans on the roster but it makes sense geographically for them to do so. They are a border state. If Auburn were LSU, I'd expect them to recruit Texas.
Florida picked up a few (I think you said seven) but three or four of those are freshmen lured by the national prestige that UF created by winning -- with players primarily from the state of Florida. None of the Texans on the roster were significant contributors to the team. A senior running back who sat behind a freshman (from Florida) was about the biggest deal. Every Texas native on Florida's roster could have vanished into the night and nobody would have known.
Why are we still talking about this?
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Are thise the same proffessionals that have said that tebow is not NFL caliber QB talent? Timmy and his Heisman and 2 national championships say he is one hell of a college QB. Graham Harrell would start at almost any school in the SEC, maybe short of FL.
Disagree.
He would start at Auburn, but then so would you. Or I. Or the girl who lives across the street from me.
Chew on this.... Chris Todd and Harrell were neck and neck at Texas Tech. Those two battled it out for the starting job and Harrell finally got it a few weeks prior to the opening game of the season. During that year, though, Todd took over for him in several games.
Eventually, though, he decided to transfer figuring that Leach was going to back Harrell.
We saw Chris Todd play.
Any additional questions?
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Disagree.
He would start at Auburn, but then so would you. Or I. Or the girl who lives across the street from me.
Pretty sure he would start at:
Auburn
South Carolina
Kentucky
Vandy
MSU
Ole Miss
LSU
Arkansas
Alabama
UGA in 09
UT
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Pretty sure he would start at:
Auburn
South Carolina
Kentucky
Vandy
MSU
Ole Miss
LSU
Arkansas
Alabama
UGA in 09
UT
No no... He REALLY disagrees with you Tailgate....
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Then you disagree with yourself. You said Texas and OU can fill their roster without leaving the state. That implies that they get who they want from there. That being the case, then AU would be at a significant disadvantage in that recruiting area.
The sheer number of players in TX make that a non-issue. We'd most likely not be getting the best of the best at first, but a trend/pipeline has to begin somehow.
As for the list? Since 1981, Auburn's had several ten and 11 win teams, two undefeated teams and three teams that could/should have won national titles. Georgia's had a ton of success. Alabama had the (alleged) number one recruiting class in the country last year. How many were from Texas? One. Round Square or some such shit. Never heard of him. How many were from states outside AL, MS, FL, GA, TN, LA? Three. One was the Round Square dude, the other was a kicker from Saban's home town in WV and the third was the son of a guy who played for Saban at Michigan State.
We've had a good run, but we still can't seem to break through. If we're getting our share of the local kids and doing all that we can in this area, then I submit that it's time to dig a new well somewhere else.
LSU has Texans on the roster but it makes sense geographically for them to do so. They are a border state. If Auburn were LSU, I'd expect them to recruit Texas.
I agree with this.
Florida picked up a few (I think you said seven) but three or four of those are freshmen lured by the national prestige that UF created by winning -- with players primarily from the state of Florida. None of the Texans on the roster were significant contributors to the team. A senior running back who sat behind a freshman (from Florida) was about the biggest deal. Every Texas native on Florida's roster could have vanished into the night and nobody would have known.
Florida will always get its share from the home state. We don't have that advantage. We get some, but not the volume that UF will get. Tate Casey might argue that he contributed, however. I agree that winning begets better recruits.
Why are we still talking about this?
Because it's fun watching you chase the stick.
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No no... He REALLY disagrees with you Tailgate....
Fuck off, llama.
I modified my initial post to include the following:
Chew on this.... Chris Todd and Harrell were neck and neck at Texas Tech. Those two battled it out for the starting job and Harrell finally got it a few weeks prior to the opening game of the season. During that year, though, Todd took over for him in several games.
Eventually, though, he decided to transfer figuring that Leach was going to back Harrell.
We all saw Chris Todd play.
Any additional questions?
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Because it's fun watching you chase the stick.
Throwing it back isn't the same as chasing.
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Fuck off, llama.
Still name calling. I haven't yet.
I modified my initial post to include the following:
Chew on this.... Chris Todd and Harrell were neck and neck at Texas Tech. Those two battled it out for the starting job and Harrell finally got it a few weeks prior to the opening game of the season. During that year, though, Todd took over for him in several games.
Eventually, though, he decided to transfer figuring that Leach was going to back Harrell.
We all saw Chris Todd play.
Any additional questions?
I have an additional question.... Did Todd have the shoulder problems he had this year at Texas Tech when he was "battling it out with Harrell"?
Cause if not, I submit this year meant nothing. (....and that doesn't mean he wasn't terrible this year)
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Still name calling. I haven't yet.
I have an additional question.... Did Todd have the shoulder problems he had this year at Texas Tech when he was "battling it out with Harrell"?
Cause if not, I submit this year meant nothing. (....and that doesn't mean he wasn't terrible this year)
Todd may have sucked this year, but he was probably better than ......
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Todd may have sucked this year, but he was probably better than ......
You might be right, but I'd like to see them get proper coaching and work under a staff all on the same page. I think that's fair.
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(http://www.spunangel.com/opossum/argue.jpg)
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Florida will always get its share from the home state. We don't have that advantage. We get some, but not the volume that UF will get. Tate Casey might argue that he contributed, however. I agree that winning begets better recruits.
So we somehow improve by "expanding" recruiting to an area where AU has no traditional base, no long-term relationship with high school coaches, no real recognition.... an area that is basically "Florida-lite" considering that the Sunshine State pumps out more top quality recruits than Texas... an area where two schools already get the share from the home state and we won't have that advantage nor get near the volume those two get?
Your logic escapes me. But I'm used to people eventually arguing my points for me.
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Still name calling. I haven't yet.
I have an additional question.... Did Todd have the shoulder problems he had this year at Texas Tech when he was "battling it out with Harrell"?
Cause if not, I submit this year meant nothing. (....and that doesn't mean he wasn't terrible this year)
No, llama is a description of behavior. Not name calling. "Fucking feeb" would be an example of name calling. Llama is more a term of affection. Brotherly affection. Or maybe distant cousinly affection.
No, Todd did not have the shoulder problem at TT to my knowledge, but the "shoulder problem" didn't affect his eyes, his feet or any other disjointed part of his body. Shoulder or no, he wasn't going to wow anybody.
Harrell is a system QB as most of the Texas Tech QBs are. Put him at AU and he's not starting. Well, most years he's not. He's not starting over Brandon Cox.
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No, llama is a description of behavior. Not name calling. "Fucking feeb" would be an example of name calling. Llama is more a term of affection. Brotherly affection. Or maybe distant cousinly affection.
:bs:
I know though. You can't help yourself.
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So we somehow improve by "expanding" recruiting to an area where AU has no traditional base, no long-term relationship with high school coaches, no real recognition.... an area that is basically "Florida-lite" considering that the Sunshine State pumps out more top quality recruits than Texas... an area where two schools already get the share from the home state and we won't have that advantage nor get near the volume those two get?
Marginally fewer recruits, split between fewer schools than the Florida recruits. Add an extra 85 or 170 roster spots and the competition for FL kids gets a lot tighter.
Your logic escapes me. But I'm used to people eventually arguing my points for me.
I can assure you that I'm not arguing your point. Your logic exists in a vacuum accessible only to Kaos
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:bs:
I know though. You can't help yourself.
Chop, if you knew half as much as you thought you did... well....
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I can assure you that I'm not arguing your point.
Perhaps not intentionally. But you're scoring points in my basket. So I'll take it.
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PG "4"
This is my final say on the matter.
:suicide:
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Wow, 8 pages of Kaos confirming that he doesn't have a fucking clue when it comes to recruiting or football.
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No, llama is a description of behavior. Not name calling. "Fucking feeb" would be an example of name calling. Llama is more a term of affection. Brotherly affection. Or maybe distant cousinly affection.
No, Todd did not have the shoulder problem at TT to my knowledge, but the "shoulder problem" didn't affect his eyes, his feet or any other disjointed part of his body. Shoulder or no, he wasn't going to wow anybody.
Harrell is a system QB as most of the Texas Tech QBs are. Put him at AU and he's not starting. Well, most years he's not. He's not starting over Brandon Cox.
Did you really just say that Brandon Cox was a better QB than Harrell? WOW!!
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Wow, 8 pages of Kaos confirming that he doesn't have a fucking clue when it comes to recruiting or football.
Amazing when you can do it in a single post!
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:suicide:
Yeah. I feel the same.
You try to say something for the last time and then they got to start challenging it.
At a certain point I started going for page count. I was shooting for ten. Looks like I'll fall just short unless somebody blows a volcano here in a minute or two.
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Yeah. I feel the same.
You try to say something for the last time and then they got to start challenging it.
At a certain point I started going for page count. I was shooting for ten. Looks like I'll fall just short unless somebody blows a volcano here in a minute or two.
Look, jumbo will blow a lot of things: homeless men, random goats, even AIDS patients.
He will NOT, however, blow a volcano. That is just sick.
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Look, jumbo will blow a lot of things: homeless men, random goats, even AIDS patients.
He will NOT, however, blow a volcano. That is just sick.
I thought he just fisted teh dogs, I didn't know he did all that shit as well.
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I thought he just fisted teh dogs, I didn't know he did all that shit as well.
He's a renaissance man. Multi-tasker.
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speaking of volcano's blowing...mt. redoubt in alaska could go at any time.
carry on.
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Did you really just say that Brandon Cox was a better QB than Harrell? WOW!!
Okay, so maybe I'm addicted to hyperbole.
I don't know if he is or if he ain't. They played in two different systems.
I saw Harrell a couple of times. Saw him up close in the senior bowl. He didn't impress me. I'd have to see what he did in a different system to say he's "great" or whatever. Lots of QBs have looked like studs in Leach's crazy system only to turn out to be duds when asked to run a legit offense.
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Okay, so maybe I'm addicted to hyperbole.
I don't know if he is or if he ain't. They played in two different systems.
I saw Harrell a couple of times. Saw him up close in the senior bowl. He didn't impress me. I'd have to see what he did in a different system to say he's "great" or whatever. Lots of QBs have looked like studs in Leach's crazy system only to turn out to be duds when asked to run a legit offense.
Just responding to get you to the 10th page.
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Damn, let me try that 1 more time
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OK one more time
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FUCK will this thread ever reach 10 pages
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Damn, let me try that 1 more time
Still stuck at nine?
I didn't lose anything in Texas.
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FUCK will this thread ever reach 10 pages
How about now?
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How about now?
All we need now is a TITAN lock down
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FUCK will this thread ever reach 10 pages
Post a picture of a llama. That should do it. They're magic.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2169/1554742429_756a0ef5ee.jpg?v=0)
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Post a picture of a llama. That should do it. They're magic.
(http://www.wildcelticrose.net/lisasplace/dramallama.jpg)
No dice.
When's the next golf run Tailgate??
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Saturday, It's going to be sunny and 55
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Saturday, It's going to be sunny and 55
Hmm... B'day dinner and day with the fiance this Saturday. I'll be at your place Sunday. I'll be in-state all week next week though... Maybe someday next week?? If not the normal time next Sunday or something??
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I want to say Kudos to Kaos for arguing some of the dumbest points about recruiting I have ever read!
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From http://jaygtate.blogspot.com (http://jaygtate.blogspot.com) from an interview with CGC:
On focusing so much effort on recruiting Texas kids: ``Right now, that's what we have done -- we have targeted relationships and target things in that way. We don't have areas. We don't have any of that. We don't even have a full staff yet. We go where we feel comfortable and where we know we can have some relationships."
So it sounds like that is where CTT, CCL, CGM and CGC have some relationships built so that is what they hit b/c they got in it late in the game.
On the significance of meeting with the state's high-school coaches: ``It's big. Most of them, I've already met at one point or another. It's all about re-kindling relationships. It's really neat walking through the door seeing a bunch of guys I knew. When you've been here three years, you get a chance to meet a lot of guys. We're going to make sure we continue to make that grow -- to make the relationships continue with our new guys."
It sounds like he is going to keep recruiting in our bread and butter area. You have to remember that Chizik(at AU), Taylor(at UT), Rocker(at ARK and Ole Miss, West Alabama and Troy), and Roof(at GT and Duke) have recruited in these areas before, so it's not like we haven't had guys recruit AL, GA, MS, TN, FL, and the Carolina's before.
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It sounds like he is going to keep recruiting in our bread and butter area. You have to remember that Chizik(at AU), Taylor(at UT), Rocker(at ARK and Ole Miss, West Alabama and Troy), and Roof(at GT and Duke) have recruited in these areas before, so it's not like we haven't had guys recruit AL, GA, MS, TN, FL, and the Carolina's before.
I think (AUTiger1) your reasoning is Bull Shit, because Kaos doesn't think that way. He seems to think that Auburn is just going to recruit Texas....Only, from now on. Kaos' understanding of recruiting is the end all, be all. And that, is that. Got it? No More logical posts from you, from now on.
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I think (AUTiger1) your reasoning is Bull Shit, because Kaos doesn't think that way. He seems to think that Auburn is just going to recruit Texas....Only, from now on. Kaos' understanding of recruiting is the end all, be all. And that, is that. Got it? No More logical posts from you, from now on.
Knucklehead, thy name is prowler.
You, like one or two others, are trying to argue points that don't exist and create entire concepts for me that I never held.
Some of you are like a bunch of teenage girls. I say "wind's blowing your hair a little" and you spend four hours crying, pissing and bitching because "you hate my hair"
My original position (and the one I maintain) can easily be summarized as below:
a) There seemed to be an emerging pattern of focusing attention on kids from Texas.
b) That fit Chizik's modus operandi as he immediately turned his attention to the lonestar state when he took over at ISU
c) While there is a goodly portion of talent in Texas, there is no more so than in Florida, and defnintely less than in the southeastern states Auburn recruits.
d) Auburn would be at a significant recruiting disadvantage in Texas and find it difficult to break the Texas-Oklahoma stranglehold -- and do we REALLY want to be chasing the third or fourth choice after UT, OU and the other Texas programs had picked over what was there?
e) Despite the claims of some, no school has the staff or resources to serve two masters. You cannot add without subtracting. It simply is not possible. If it were possible, Southern Cal and Michigan and Texas and Penn State and Boston College would have recruiters permanently stationed in Florida.
For those reasons above my singular point was that a philosophy of turning attention to Texas would be a failed strategy. I haven't wavered from that and I won't.
Obviously others noted a turn of attention to Texas or the question wouldn't have been asked of him. His answer didn't completely satisfy me. "we go where we have relationships." Is this an ongoing strategy or a short-term situation? "We don't have areas." Sounds disorganized.
But whatever. We'll see.
Please to be continuing with making up arguments for me.
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Knucklehead, thy name is prowler.
This was your original post.....
Then you were like...nope...no... :hulk: Not good enough! Let me explain!!!!! So you edited...
You, like one or two others, are trying to argue points that don't exist and create entire concepts for me that I never held.
Some of you are like a bunch of teenage girls. I say "wind's blowing your hair a little" and you spend four hours crying, pissing and bitching because "you hate my hair"
My original position (and the one I maintain) can easily be summarized as below:
a) There seemed to be an emerging pattern of focusing attention on kids from Texas.
b) That fit Chizik's modus operandi as he immediately turned his attention to the lonestar state when he took over at ISU
c) While there is a goodly portion of talent in Texas, there is no more so than in Florida, and defnintely less than in the southeastern states Auburn recruits.
d) Auburn would be at a significant recruiting disadvantage in Texas and find it difficult to break the Texas-Oklahoma stranglehold -- and do we REALLY want to be chasing the third or fourth choice after UT, OU and the other Texas programs had picked over what was there?
e) Despite the claims of some, no school has the staff or resources to serve two masters. You cannot add without subtracting. It simply is not possible. If it were possible, Southern Cal and Michigan and Texas and Penn State and Boston College would have recruiters permanently stationed in Florida.
For those reasons above my singular point was that a philosophy of turning attention to Texas would be a failed strategy. I haven't wavered from that and I won't.
Obviously others noted a turn of attention to Texas or the question wouldn't have been asked of him. His answer didn't completely satisfy me. "we go where we have relationships." Is this an ongoing strategy or a short-term situation? "We don't have areas." Sounds disorganized.
But whatever. We'll see.
Please to be continuing with making up arguments for me.
Now THAT'S an edit. hahaha... Okay.. carry on. What's the page # goal today?
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This was your original post.....
Then you were like...nope...no... :hulk: Not good enough! Let me explain!!!!! So you edited...
Now THAT'S an edit. hahaha... Okay.. carry on. What's the page # goal today?
Whatever.
The edit was to change the term I originally posted to knucklehead. I decided it had a better ring to it.
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Whatever.
The edit was to change the term I originally posted to knucklehead. I decided it had a better ring to it.
I saw the original post.
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I saw the original post.
I wrote the original post. :taunt:
I'm editing this one to note that you have some personality issues. See a doctor.
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Why are you fucking around with llammas Kaos? The real money is in Alpacas.
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Why are you fucking around with llammas Kaos? The real money is in Alpacas.
Point taken.
I also heard there is a market for emus.
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I don't give a shit if it's a monkey, a llama or an emu from Texas. If he runs the 40 in 4.4 or under and can keek de touchdowns...sign his ass now. We need playmakers.
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I don't give a shit if it's a monkey, a llama or an emu from Texas. If he runs the 40 in 4.4 or under and can keek de touchdowns...sign his ass now. We need playmakers.
Ah, so. But if you chase the emus in Texas, the llamas in Florida, Alabama, Georgia and Mississippi will escape. And then they spit on you. Bad mojo.
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Ah, so. But if you chase the emus in Texas, the llamas in Florida, Alabama, Georgia and Mississippi will escape. And then they spit on you. Bad mojo.
Those suckers have some damn sharp claws too. You don't wanna cross no South Georgia emu.
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Those suckers have some damn sharp claws too. You don't wanna cross no South Georgia emu.
I once killed an emu from 50 yards away with little more than a marshmallow, two pennies and my watchband.
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Not all Texas kids are Longhorn/Sooner fans. In fact there are many that actually hate those two teams and were raised as fans of the "lower level" Texan teams. Given a chance to play on a larger scale-SEC- versus playing for Rice, Baylor, SMU, Houston etc., some are actually easy pickings. I'm talking about players who have the talent to play here in the SEC, not just UT/OU culls.
Back when we were in the old SWC we usually got a kid or two every year for the very reason that they hated the Longhorns. OU did/does too to this day.
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Not all Texas kids are Longhorn/Sooner fans. In fact there are many that actually hate those two teams and were raised as fans of the "lower level" Texan teams. Given a chance to play on a larger scale-SEC- versus playing for Rice, Baylor, SMU, Houston etc., some are actually easy pickings. I'm talking about players who have the talent to play here in the SEC, not just UT/OU culls.
Back when we were in the old SWC we usually got a kid or two every year for the very reason that they hated the Longhorns. OU did/does too to this day.
What the fuck does that have to do with emus?
Besides, it makes geographic sense for Arkansas to recruit some in Texas so your argument has no relevance. Your hogs should be in the Big 12 anyway.
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What the fuck does that have to do with emus?
The emu is the natural enemy of the Longhorn.
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Besides, it makes geographic sense for Arkansas to recruit some in Texas so your argument has no relevance. Your hogs should be in the Big 12 anyway.
oh no you din t.
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Vanderbilt and South Carolina belong in the ACC.
I hear Emu oil is good for what ails ya'. I've been trying to market Dr. Harvey's white root oil to the ladies but so far, that product hasn't taken off.
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oh no you din t.
Yes. Yes I did.
It never made sense to me for Arkansas to be in the SEC. Southern Miss, Georgia Tech, Florida State, Tulane, Clemson, Memphis yes. Arkansas? No.
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Yes. Yes I did.
It never made sense to me for Arkansas to be in the SEC. Southern Miss, Georgia Tech, Florida State, Tulane, Clemson, Memphis yes. Arkansas? No.
On the surface you are right. There were others that made more geographical sense.
GT-left of their own accord
FSU-had their chance when GT got out
Tulane- C'mon man. They get bitch slapped in the weak ass conference they are already in. No way they are coming in.
Memphis - See "Tulane"
Southern Miss & Clemson - Would have made sense.
The problem I saw and still see to some degree with Arkansas was that the SEC did not push harder to bring in a more natural rival from the old SWC with them. I believe that argument is almost moot now because they are starting to get some ill feelings toward the Dwarf, the Hat, and the Hoot, and that is just out of the West. No love for Tennessee either.
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Auburn would be at a significant recruiting disadvantage in Texas and find it difficult to break the Texas-Oklahoma stranglehold -- and do we REALLY want to be chasing the third or fourth choice after UT, OU and the other Texas programs had picked over what was there?
Back to the original topic. With several new assistants coming out of the Big 12, one would have to assume that they recruited Texas for their respective former employers. These guys have established connections and relationships with many TX high school coaches, and maybe even some players.
Kaos, PLEASE explain specifically HOW would this be a significant recruiting disadvantage for Auburn?
It's not like Auburn and the SEC fall off the radar once you cross the Mississippi River. The SEC is the best conference in college football, top to bottom. Not to mention that Dallas and Houston both have HUGE Auburn alumni groups because of electrical engineering (Texas Instruments, etc. in Dallas) and aerospace engineering (NASA in Houston). And like our little pork rind loving friend pointed out, Texas and OU are despised about as much as they are supported. So those two schools do not have a stranglehold on this state, and if an SEC powerhouse (I guess Auburn still applies, haha) comes in and builds upon those ALREADY EXISTING relationships, who's to say that we won't give them a run for their money? i sincerely doubt we would be taking the leftovers that got picked over by UT and OU first.
Not to mention that for all their hype, TX and OU are not all that and a bag of chips. Mack Brown is totally dependent on having a QB that is willing to get the living shit beat out of him in order to win, and they stumble every year to some upstart. Vince Young beat USC and dragged his team along with him. Bob Stoops might get to the big game, but in that crappy conference, that is not that big of an accomplishment, and even when he gets there, he can't seem to pull out the win. And the worst ass kicking of them all for him came at LSU's hands, no? An SEC team?
I get thewhole "Can't move out here/take time away from our base" thing, but I think we can afford one guy to start cherry picking the best of Texas to find our playmakers of the future.
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Obviously others noted a turn of attention to Texas or the question wouldn't have been asked of him. His answer didn't completely satisfy me. "we go where we have relationships." Is this an ongoing strategy or a short-term situation? "We don't have areas." Sounds disorganized.
I would guess that is the current strategy/short-term situation. This staff got in the game, 2 minutes left to go in the 4th, kind of late. He did say that he looked forward to growing and re-kindling relationships with coaches around here. He has told recruits such as Kirkpatrick and Kelly that needed to and wanted to get the top talent in state and that is why he started recruiting them (not that it did any good, they were committed long before then). I am not going to give him shit for recruiting right now. If anyone thought that recruiting wasn't going to take a hit this time with a coaching change, then they are being delusional. He is at a disadvantage and has been since day one. Now next year if he totally abandons this area and goes out west I will complain like most will. I imagine that coaches will have assigned areas next year, they might not, we will have to find out next year, but they have already talked to some juniors this time and they are in our "bread and butter areas" that, along with what he told recruits from here, and what he stated about growing relationships gives me an indication that we will not abandon it. Plus if he has been given a heads up on anything, he should know that fans are pissed about getting our ass kicked by the evil ones for in state talent last year. On the filp side, if the #1 prospect next year lives in Montana, TX, or wherever, I expect our staff to call him, give him a visit and see if he is at least interested.
I am not, and have not said that recruiting TX only is a good thing, but getting a good recruit or three from out there isn't a terrible thing, especially this late in the game when a lot of recruits have already been locked up by other schools.
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Back to the original topic. With several new assistants coming out of the Big 12, one would have to assume that they recruited Texas for their respective former employers. These guys have established connections and relationships with many TX high school coaches, and maybe even some players.
Kaos, PLEASE explain specifically HOW would this be a significant recruiting disadvantage for Auburn?
It's not like Auburn and the SEC fall off the radar once you cross the Mississippi River. The SEC is the best conference in college football, top to bottom. Not to mention that Dallas and Houston both have HUGE Auburn alumni groups because of electrical engineering (Texas Instruments, etc. in Dallas) and aerospace engineering (NASA in Houston). And like our little pork rind loving friend pointed out, Texas and OU are despised about as much as they are supported. So those two schools do not have a stranglehold on this state, and if an SEC powerhouse (I guess Auburn still applies, haha) comes in and builds upon those ALREADY EXISTING relationships, who's to say that we won't give them a run for their money? i sincerely doubt we would be taking the leftovers that got picked over by UT and OU first.
Not to mention that for all their hype, TX and OU are not all that and a bag of chips. Mack Brown is totally dependent on having a QB that is willing to get the living shit beat out of him in order to win, and they stumble every year to some upstart. Vince Young beat USC and dragged his team along with him. Bob Stoops might get to the big game, but in that crappy conference, that is not that big of an accomplishment, and even when he gets there, he can't seem to pull out the win. And the worst ass kicking of them all for him came at LSU's hands, no? An SEC team?
I get thewhole "Can't move out here/take time away from our base" thing, but I think we can afford one guy to start cherry picking the best of Texas to find our playmakers of the future.
Chizad is tired of hearing the same things over and over and over and over.
I am tired of repeating them.
In the ten pages prior I explained my position. Multiple times. You see things differently and that's fine. I don't have time to be dragged back into it again today. I said what I said. You can't serve two masters and you can't shit in two sandboxes. Those are realities. In business you can diversify because you can theoretically add whatever resources are necessary. This isn't business. In this venture, resources (manpower) are finite.
My portion of this discussion is now concluded. For real this time.
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Again.. PG "4"
This is my final say on the matter.
Please to be continuing your euphoria. In four or five years you can tell me if I was right or wrong.
:suicide:
I'm bettin' it isn't over yet.
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Yes. Yes I did.
It never made sense to me for Arkansas to be in the SEC. Southern Miss, Georgia Tech, Florida State, Tulane, Clemson, Memphis yes. Arkansas? No.
No love for Suwanee?
Well yall have us like it or not. I'm glad to be here. We've been on the same team since the 1860s. We're just a bunch of redneck hillbillies and we fit in here better than with the amigos and sodbusters.
You might be a good fit there. They have amber waves of grain for a Plainsman to frolic in.
Its not like the teams take bus rides to their games any more.
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Here's Dickheads take on recruiting. It's easier to coach from Mississippi in the SEC. He's doing really well at it, too. I think he has 3 of the top 40 recruits in MS going to Ole Miss. while Petrino has a top 20 class coming to Arkansas even after a losing season. Fuck Nutt.
http://collegefootball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=905931 (http://collegefootball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=905931)
Yall may think this irrevalent, but it comes down to the coach and staff to get the best player available, wherever they come from. Recruiting is part (a big part, IMVHO) of their job. At least yall don't have an idiot such as this. Thank God For Mississippi.
Recruiting was hard in Arkansas because he had things fucked up worse than a dick without a hole in it.
This is just to show yall that no matter how bad yall have it, some folks have it worse.
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Winning is gonna fix a bunch of this shit anyways. I think both of our programs are getting primed.
Fuck Nutt, Saban and Kiffin.
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Winning is gonna fix a bunch of this shit anyways. I think both of our programs are getting primed.
Fuck Nutt, Saban and Kiffin.
Uhhhh.... you're talking to yourself. Just saying.
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Uhhhh.... you're talking to yourself. Just saying.
I was always told it's OK to talk to yourself as long as you don't answer
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Uhhhh.... you're talking to yourself. Just saying.
I'll bet you a six pack of any kind of beer under $50 per sixpack that yall will have a better winning record in football than what you had last year.
Shit or get off the pot.
To clarify--- I meant this next year
Not my intention to make a trick bet. Yall's 2009 record will be better than 2008. Is that clear enough?
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Here's Dickheads take on recruiting. It's easier to coach from Mississippi in the SEC. He's doing really well at it, too. I think he has 3 of the top 40 recruits in MS going to Ole Miss. while Petrino has a top 20 class coming to Arkansas even after a losing season. Fuck Nutt.
http://collegefootball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=905931 (http://collegefootball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=905931)
Yall may think this irrevalent, but it comes down to the coach and staff to get the best player available, wherever they come from. Recruiting is part (a big part, IMVHO) of their job. At least yall don't have an idiot such as this. Thank God For Mississippi.
Recruiting was hard in Arkansas because he had things fucked up worse than a dick without a hole in it.
This is just to show yall that no matter how bad yall have it, some folks have it worse.
He may have shat himself. :rofl:
http://collegefootball.rivals.com/showmsg.asp?fid=2150&tid=124128168&mid=124128168&sid=1144&style=2 (http://collegefootball.rivals.com/showmsg.asp?fid=2150&tid=124128168&mid=124128168&sid=1144&style=2)