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HUNH May Be Killed

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #40 on: February 13, 2014, 05:29:07 PM »
I wonder if Ellis Johnson was also in the room?
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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #41 on: February 13, 2014, 06:04:21 PM »
I wonder if Ellis Johnson was also in the room?

He wasn't.

That's the difference.

He didn't like it in the past.  He's now trying to win football games with a team that relies solely on a hurry up style of offense.  I'd say he's learned to love it. 
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The Guy That Knows Nothing of Hyperbole

Saniflush

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #42 on: February 13, 2014, 07:43:11 PM »
What about the Gettys, the Rothchilds, The Queen...and Col. Sanders!

Is this before or after the Colonel went tits up?
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"Hey my friends are the ones that wanted to eat at that shitty hole in the wall that only served bread and wine.  What kind of brick and mud business model is that.  Stick to the cart if that's all you're going to serve.  Then that dude came in with like 12 other people, and some of them weren't even wearing shoes, and the restaurant sat them right across from us. It was gross, and they were all stinky and dirty.  Then dude starts talking about eating his body and drinking his blood...I almost lost it.  That's the last supper I'll ever have there, and I hope he dies a horrible death."

The Six

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #43 on: February 13, 2014, 10:32:31 PM »
http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014/02/what_does_science_say_about_hu.html

Quote
What does science say about football injuries from hurry-up offenses?
Joe Solomon

Count University of Arizona head athletic trainer Randy Cohen among the skeptics about the NCAA Football Rules Committee's proposal to slow down hurry-up offenses in the name of safety.

"If you want to do it for a competitive advantage, then come out and say you're doing it for a competitive advantage," said Cohen, who chairs the college committee of the National Athletic Trainers' Association. "Don't say it's a safety issue because right now we don't have any data about this. None."


The idea to make offenses wait 10 seconds before snapping the ball has caused widespread backlash by many up-tempo coaches. They claim it's a ploy to let defenses strategically substitute and slow down creative and productive offenses such as Auburn's. Alabama's Nick Saban and Arkansas' Bret Bielema, both defensive-minded coaches, participated in committee discussions about the proposal but did not have a vote, according to USA Today Sports.

So what does science say about hurry-up offenses? And are there truly medical benefits from this proposed rule? The answers appear to be speculative.

There could be health advantages to making offenses wait, according to several medical personnel and researchers in the sports world who were interviewed for this article. But some of them are scratching their heads over the NCAA proposal just like some coaches.

Yes, they say, fewer plays would lead to less chance of injury. But some question whether the number of plays would be reduced enough to have an impact, especially since the NCAA said "research indicated that teams with fast-paced, no-huddle offenses rarely snap the ball with 30 seconds or more on the play clock."[/u]

Yes, some medical officials and researchers say, fatigue can lead to poor technique and put players at greater risk for injuries, including concussions. But some point out players can leave a game now simply by falling down on the field -- lately in games against up-tempo teams this causes accusations of fake injuries -- and medical personnel and researchers question if there's data showing tempo causes more injuries.

Rogers Redding, the national coordinator of officiating, told CBSSports.com there wasn't much "hard data" to consider for the substitution rule, which must still be approved on March 6 by the Playing Rules Oversight Panel.

"What you don't want is that tired defensive player who is a liability in the game and you can't get him off the field," Louisiana-Monroe coach Todd Berry, a rules committee member, told CBSSports.com. "He's gonna get injured. That's what's driving this thing."


Because this is an off year in the NCAA football rules cycle, any new playing rule passed would have to be related to safety.

"From the outside looking in, it looks like they're using the health and safety initiative to pass it this year because that's the only way to pass it," said Harvard head athletic trainer Brant Berkstresser, a member of the NCAA Competitive Safeguards Committee. "That being said, I don't think there's any harm for the student-athlete. The longer players are on the field or play a set amount of plays longer than the previous norm, you certainly can make a theoretical assumption that would increase the risks of injury."

Patrick Larimore, who retired as a UCLA linebacker in 2012 due to suffering at least seven concussions, said it's "ridiculous" to think the 10-second rule is for competitive purposes. Fatigue from up-tempo offenses can absolutely result in injuries, he said.

"I think if you're a fan and you care about the players' health, especially at this level because we're not getting paid, then it's definitely necessary," Larimore said. "Player safety, especially with all this concussion information coming out, has to be put first. What is this, gladiators?"

Click the link if you want to read more.
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CCTAU

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #44 on: February 13, 2014, 11:33:35 PM »
Add an extra TO. Take away a game. What? Lose money? No way.

This has nothing to do with safety. The LB chiming in should have learned how to hit without using his head first.
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Five statements of WISDOM
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friends, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

bottomfeeder

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #45 on: February 13, 2014, 11:40:29 PM »
I'm sensing a consensus among those with intimate college football knowledge that this is Nicks way of catching up and not about safety.

I don't think it passes but if it does, I have confidence in Gus to figure something out. We have arguably more to lose than any other team in the country if it passes. If it doesn't, a win next year in JHS west will feel much sweeter.

There should be more outrage that its even being considered.

Silent snap.
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The Prowler

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #46 on: February 14, 2014, 03:13:07 AM »
If they pass the rule, Coach Malzahn will play nice until the Iron Bowl then after the first 1st down, he'll run up to the line and snap it, take the 5 yard penalty...get a first down on the next couple plays, run up to the line and snap it, take the 5 yard penalty...get a first down on the next couple plays, run up to the line and snap it, take the 5 yard penalty...get a first down the next couple plays, run up to the line and snap it. By then sabbin's out of shape Dlinemen and LBers will be suckin wind. Do that the next series or two, maybe catch sabbin out on the field crying to the refs...direct CJ Uzomah to run him over and step on his face. You know, good fun for the whole family. If the refs block the ball from being snapped, as long as the offense didn't make a substitution snap it anyway, then run his fat ass over. After Auburn is up a few TDs in the 3rd qtr, Gus can then have the offense sit on the ball by snapping it with a couple seconds left on the play clock (Gus will still have everyone run up to the ball as if they're going to snap it).
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"Patriotism and popularity are the beaten paths for power and tyranny." Good, no worries about tyranny w/ Trump

"Alabama's Special Teams unit is made up of Special Ed students." - Daniel Tosh

"The HUNH does cause significant Health and Safety issues, Health issues for the opposing fans and Safety issues for the opposing coaches." - AU AD Jay Jacobs

GH2001

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #47 on: February 14, 2014, 08:22:24 AM »
Rich Rod and Leach are beyond pissed.

Knew I liked those guys.

Other I've seen quoted who think it's ridiculous:

Freeze
Briles
Tubs
Rutgers Coach
Mac
Sunbelt

I'm sure there are others.

I'm glad most of the rest of the country sees this for what it is. A ploy by Bilemmia and Sabynz. Just like Scarbo said.
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WDE

CCTAU

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #48 on: February 14, 2014, 08:45:42 AM »
This is a rational bammer explanation:

J
Quote
ust a word on the proposal to slow down offenses in the NCAA, which in the interest of full disclosure I am opposed to.  My Auburn friends want us to believe that Nick Saban is pushing this as some sort of attack on their coach.  However, for a different perspective consider this.  Both high profile coaches that appeared before the committee to express their concerns, both did so long before Gus Malzahn became head coach at Auburn and both are members of the American Football Coaches Association.  As members they have a right to speak out on issues that are important to them and have the right to attempt to effect change.  The AFCA and the rules committee has an obligation to listen to them on these issues and, if other members agree have an obligation to use their influence to attempt to effect changes that their members support. Bielema is a non voting member  of the rules committee and certainly has a right to be at the committee meeting, Nick Saban is a member of AFCA and has a right to express his opinion, his appearance is neither normal or unusual. Just my two cents.


Deflection. He was complaining "long before" Malzahn was head coach! You know, he started about the time Malzah's offense ripped his nuts off the second half of the 2010 Iron Bowl!
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Five statements of WISDOM
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friends, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #49 on: February 14, 2014, 09:08:06 AM »
A couple of thoughts...

1.  Could the rule change actually benefit the HUNH? 

The whole purpose of the rule change is to give the defense ten seconds to substitute.  That's not a lot of time if you know what goes on with defensive substitutions.  They 99% of the time are not giving two shits about their players sucking wind.  In fact, most teams keep the same secondary and linebackers on the field the whole game and rarely give those guys breathers. Defensive linemen get changed out more often, but even then, it's usually a big change out by series. 

Defensive substitutions happen to match personnel and field situations.  3rd and long?  Send in a nickel for a linebacker.  3rd and medium?  Send in the quick pass rusher and the nickel for the fat guy and linebacker.  They brought in a fullback and a tight end?  Let's substitute our fat guys to match their heavy set. 

What the ten second rule does is allow the defenses to rush their guys out onto the field and slow down the pace of the drive.  Yes, this helps them. 

But on defense, you have to read and react.  The main reason why a HUNH hurts a defense - especially one like Saban's - is that it's moving too fast to line up correctly, audible the coverage or blitz, get into proper position on the defensive line, get your eyes and head focused presnap, read and react after the snap while running the play. 

So they get ten seconds from the time the ball carrier is whistled down. 

The offense hurries to the line to get lined up.  The defense in ten seconds will have to sprint a new set of legs onto the field and the old, fatigued set of legs off the field.  By the time they get into the defensive formation, are they aware of what the offense is doing?  Do they have more time or less to get lined up and read and react to the offense?  Who would really be better at stopping Malzahn's "Let's run the same successful play as many times in a row until they stop it"?  The defensive guys that just faced it or the ones who are sprinting 25 yards onto the field for the first time that drive? 

2.  The ball carriers will delay the game and the refs will have to be petulant and ridiculous to call a penalty on them. 

Artis-Payne hits a six yard run and is tackled near the sideline.  According to the rule change, if I'm reading it correctly, that's when the ten second window begins.  So Payne holds onto the ball for a second or two while getting himself up.  He looks around.  "Which ref gets this?  Oh you?  Wait was it you?  Oops sorry I didn't get a good toss to you."  The ball bounces around while the ref picks it up.  The ref tosses it to the ref that spots the ball.  The ten seconds are nearly up, and Auburn's offense is standing all over the field.  Gus gives the signal.  "Run it! Run it!"  Boom.  Offense lines up in a new position as soon as the ten seconds are up, hikes it, and the defense still didn't have time to read and react. 

3.  The bullshit of the "protecting fatigued players" aspect.  Sure, Alabama will have fifteen 5 star defensive linemen they can run out there every play, but not every team is Alabama.  Most teams only have a two deep to rotate into the game on defense.  Even then, their two deep isn't the best option to stop a good offense. 

So if they want to keep their players fresh and "uninjured," they'll have to run them onto the field often.  In order to get them out there on time with the ability to read and react, they'll be forcing them to sprint 15 yards on and off the field over and over again all while telling them to hurry up, line up, read, react, fight off blockers, chase, tackle, pop up and get ready to do it again. 

They will be just as tired running wind sprints as they would be defending their side of the field against a HUNH.
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The Guy That Knows Nothing of Hyperbole

CCTAU

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #50 on: February 14, 2014, 09:30:32 AM »
I think this has a lot to do with Saban rubbing his NCAA power/connections in a lot of people's noses.

I'll put my AU tinfoil hat on and hang up and listen.
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Five statements of WISDOM
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friends, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #51 on: February 14, 2014, 09:40:22 AM »
I think this has a lot to do with Saban rubbing his NCAA power/connections in a lot of people's noses.

I'll put my AU tinfoil hat on and hang up and listen.

That's honestly the biggest beef I have.  This is the first time in twenty years I've seen a football rules committee considering altering the game to benefit the defense.  If Tuberville were our coach and this rule change came out of the blue, I'd probably be trying to argue for it if I'm truthful to myself. 

But the stink here is that Saban goes on a rant prior to the season about the HUNH being dangerous to defensive players, which everyone laughed off as bullshit.  Then he loses two games to fast paced teams and suddenly the NCAA rules committee is considering altering the game to stop HUNH from being so effective, and the short motherfucker got to sit in the room while they discussed it. 

And it's not just this.  It's just more and more add ons to the ever growing list of "What the fuck, NCAA?" when it comes to Saban and Alabama.

I mean, I could start the list again, but I'm not sure the comment box allows for that many words. 

But you know, the Al-Betar case, the Fishing Trip case, the Laptop issue, the Hot Wheelz, the Sticks and Stuff stuff, the Bama booster/Agent issue, the Agent party, the Kidnapping of a Recruit, the never ending smear campaigns, the StruggleOverWit pictures, the Dodge Chargers, the No More Peanut Butter Sandwiches, and the countless others that make everyone but Alabama fans say, "What the fuck, NCAA?"
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The Guy That Knows Nothing of Hyperbole

Buzz Killington

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #52 on: February 14, 2014, 09:48:57 AM »
Come on guys...USA Today said Saybinz didn't have a vote.  Think of the safety of these poor kids.
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Now I may be an idiot, but there is one thing I am not, sir, and that, sir, is an idiot.

CCTAU

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #53 on: February 14, 2014, 09:55:07 AM »
But the stink here is that Saban goes on a rant prior to the season about the HUNH being dangerous to defensive players, which everyone laughed off as bullshit.  Then he loses two games to fast paced teams and suddenly the NCAA rules committee is considering altering the game to stop HUNH from being so effective, and the short motherfucker got to sit in the room while they discussed it. 

He didn't JUST sit in on the discussion, he requested to be able to SPEAK to the committee on this subject!

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Five statements of WISDOM
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friends, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

noxin

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #54 on: February 14, 2014, 09:57:47 AM »
You have to be fair to the 350 pound lineman who is just too large to get into proper condition to play more than 2 or 3 plays at a time.  If you can't just shuffle him in on 3rd and 1, you're taking food out of his family's mouth.

We have rules protecting our kickers so tiny men can play football, so it's only fair to have rules to protect the morbidly obese who want in the game too.
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AUChizad

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #55 on: February 14, 2014, 10:25:41 AM »
Rich Rod and Leach are beyond pissed.

Knew I liked those guys.

Other I've seen quoted who think it's ridiculous:

Freeze
Briles
Tubs
Rutgers Coach
Mac
Sunbelt

I'm sure there are others.

I'm glad most of the rest of the country sees this for what it is. A ploy by Bilemmia and Sabynz. Just like Scarbo said.
Someone is notably absent from that list...

Also Cowherd is ripping the shit out of this as well. Calling Saban & Beleima out as the bitches they are.
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #56 on: February 14, 2014, 11:30:48 AM »
IF this rule is changed (and I don't think it will be anytime soon) then they may as well relocate the NCAA headquarters to Tuscaloosa.

Even if it doesn't change now, the fact that it is being considered is concerning. A movement for change has to start somewhere.

At the rate we are going with rules changes, I seriously may not follow the game in 10 years. It's already like  the QB is playing flag in many respects.
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GH2001

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #57 on: February 14, 2014, 01:11:41 PM »
Someone is notably absent from that list...

Also Cowherd is ripping the shit out of this as well. Calling Saban & Beleima out as the bitches they are.

Saw where Sumlin and Butch had statements today blasting it. I would imagine Meyer, Jimbo, Spurrier, Petrino, Holgerson and Gundy will too if they haven't already.

The only people I can really see being for this shit are Bama and the Big Ten.
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WiregrassTiger

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #58 on: February 14, 2014, 01:18:31 PM »
Saw where Sumlin and Butch had statements today blasting it. I would imagine Meyer, Jimbo, Spurrier, Petrino, Holgerson and Gundy will too if they haven't already.

The only people I can really see being for this shoot are Bama and the Big Ten fat teams.
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Kaos

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Re: HUNH May Be Killed
« Reply #59 on: February 14, 2014, 01:26:29 PM »
IF this rule is changed (and I don't think it will be anytime soon) then they may as well relocate the NCAA headquarters to Tuscaloosa.

Everything I read seems to indicate that the rules committee (which knows nothing about the game and will only consider "safety issues") will most likely rubber stamp it.
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