Tigers X - Number one Source to Talk Auburn Tigers Sports
Pat Dye Field => War Damn Eagle => Topic started by: Xanusus on November 27, 2011, 07:14:46 PM
-
I think I as well as many Auburn fans might be being a bit too harsh on Ted Roof. Here's the way I see it. Ted Roof is trying to run a scheme he's not used to. The Tampa 2 is Chizik's D and it's being ran by a guy who likes to run multiple fronts and blitz a lot. I really think Ted Roof may be a good coach who is simply trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. I'd like to see Roof run HIS defense for once. Looking over his coaching career it's obvious that his past defenses were no where near this bad. He always seemed to field a top 20 defense where ever he went when he was DC. I honestly think we may have a problem at Auburn in difference of philosophy and it's not meshing well. Chizik wants it ran his way and Roof is having to do things he's not used to doing.
Either we need to allow Roof to run it his way or we need to find a guy whose defensive philosophy matches Chizik's and who is well versed in the Tampa 2.
On another note we absolutely need to let Lolley go. I really think he's the weak link in all of this and that Roof because he's the DC is taking the majority of the heat for it.
If we can get a better position coach for our corners and safeties and Roof is allowed to implement his defense, I feel like we'll be alright. But, we do need to make some changes. There's just no putting lipstick on the Lolley pig. He's terrible.
Either let Roof go and find a Tampa 2 coordinator or let Roof run his defense I guess is what I'm getting at.
I've noticed that Roof has did a good job with the linebackers. Believe it or not they did improve over the year. I remember the first game where Holland for example allowed that 3rd and 20 completion because he made a mistake in not getting back into coverage. Several games later he did not make the same mistake. On basically the same play he was back there and made the pick against FAU. Eltoro and Holland both played better down the stretch. Had Holland not been so banged up all year things would have looked better.
But our secondary is terrible. They're constantly out of position. They rarely(other than Bell who was a safety) look for the ball. Our corners blow bump and run assignments like crazy and put our safeties in the tampa 2 in bad positions.
Personally I wished we'd move away from the Tampa 2. People have developed ways to exploit it especially people like McGee at Arkansas. I'd rather run a 4-2-5. It's harder to exploit and easier to bring pressure at any time and be multiple.
Fire Lolley. Move Thigpen to LB coach(which is his forte anyways) and let Roof run his defense from the press box.
Looking at post game interviews, it looks like Roof is staying based on his comments. OK fine. At least let him run his defense next year and find us a better position coach for our Dbacks.
-
really...zookie is available.
-
really...zookie is available.
Nookie's available?
-
tl;dr
dc
fo
-
Roof must go. The stats are mind boggling.
Oh, and you might want to cover the tight end.
-
For the record...I believe from now until whatever bowl game we end up in Kiehl Frazier should take all the snaps.
He should play the full game beginning to end.
Fuck it... we cant look any worse.
-
For the record...I believe from now until whatever bowl game we end up in Kiehl Frazier should take all the snaps.
He should play the full game beginning to end.
Fuck it... we cant look any worse.
Agree
-
Agree
Agree x2
At this point, I think it would be foolish not to let him take all the snaps. Auburn will have several weeks to prepare for whatever team which should be a decent amount of time for Frazier to get reps with Blake and Lutz. I think he has the run part of the offense down. There really is no other solution at this point. The bowl game should be a serious look at what next years offense will resemble.
-
Agree
Agree as well.
Damn, I think we all agree on something finally.
Whether its player development, lack of talent, etc - we know Trotter and Moseley just aren't working out. Time to try something bold, something different. At least with Kiehl we build into next year and get him reps. We need to see what the kid can do in a rhythm, start to finish in a game.
-
I don't claim to be an expert, but isn't this whole "Tampa 2" thing predicated on giving up short plays and making teams work the entire field in hopes they'll fuck up somewhere along the line?
If that's the philosophy, I hate it.
-
Pissed that it is 10:30 the Monday after last regular season game and Roof's firing has not been announced.
-
Pissed that it is 10:30 the Monday after last regular season game and Roof's firing has not been announced.
My birds are not as entrenched as they were before, but the chirping I hear is that you can wait until 10:30 the Monday after the last regular season game of 2012 and possibly still not hear it. Not going anywhere. Continuity is valued over results. The whispers I hear is that everybody who came on was given a five year pass unless they elect to go somewhere else on their own. Probably BS, but I've heard the same thing twice.
-
My birds are not as entrenched as they were before, but the chirping I hear is that you can wait until 10:30 the Monday after the last regular season game of 2012 and possibly still not hear it. Not going anywhere. Continuity is valued over results. The whispers I hear is that everybody who came on was given a five year pass unless they elect to go somewhere else on their own. Probably BS, but I've heard the same thing twice.
Did a guy named Prowler give you those "skreets"?
-
My birds are not as entrenched as they were before, but the chirping I hear is that you can wait until 10:30 the Monday after the last regular season game of 2012 and possibly still not hear it. Not going anywhere. Continuity is valued over results. The whispers I hear is that everybody who came on was given a five year pass unless they elect to go somewhere else on their own. Probably BS, but I've heard the same thing twice.
That had better be BS, or the next two years will be worse than this one. I am fucking sick of watching 11 guys on defense that can't tackle, can't put pressure on a QB and can't turn to look for a fucking ball in the air. It makes me want to fucking vomit. I want to see guys knocking the shit out of the other side of the ball until they want to quit, I miss the likes of Spikes.
-
I really don't think that there will be any staff changes. Call me crazy but I still think we should wait till hopefully after Frazier gets the full throttle for the bowl game to suggest changes in the offensive philosophy. Gus has made mistakes yes but what coach hasn't? The D has grown enough to really make me halt my fire Ted Roof march; although, I am still on the verge here. Am I gonna be pissed if some changes are made on staff? No, but they'd better be an upgrade and not some sort of lateral move because with any staff change you have to expect a step back in production.
-
I really don't think that there will be any staff changes. Call me crazy but I still think we should wait till hopefully after Frazier gets the full throttle for the bowl game to suggest changes in the offensive philosophy. Gus has made mistakes yes but what coach hasn't? The D has grown enough to really make me halt my fire Ted Roof march; although, I am still on the verge here. Am I gonna be pissed if some changes are made on staff? No, but they'd better be an upgrade and some sort of lateral move because with any staff change you have to expect a step back in production.
Guys, I think you are pipe dreaming to think they are going to hand the bowl game to a freshman they just started trusting to throw the ball. I expect the same mish-mash of offense we've seen the back half of the season.
-
Guys, I think you are pipe dreaming to think they are going to hand the bowl game to a freshman they just started trusting to throw the ball. I expect the same mish-mash of offense we've seen the back half of the season.
Hey, don't be knocking my dreams! I have to hope for something.
-
Guys, I think you are pipe dreaming to think they are going to hand the bowl game to a freshman they just started trusting to throw the ball. I expect the same mish-mash of offense we've seen the back half of the season.
If they are going to do this, I say open up the competition...give Trotter another chance. Before the Clemson game, he was by far the best option. Something screwed with his mind that afternoon, and he hasn't been right since. If he can get it back mentally, he is a much better QB than Moseley.
-
I don't claim to be an expert, but isn't this whole "Tampa 2" thing predicated on giving up short plays and making teams work the entire field in hopes they'll fuck up somewhere along the line?
If that's the philosophy, I hate it.
FWIW, if you put any stock in to what Tony Dungy says about it, and his philosophy, it's an adaptation of the 75 Steelers Steel Curtain Defense, and is supposed to be an aggressive defense.
-
Guys, I think you are pipe dreaming to think they are going to hand the bowl game to a freshman they just started trusting to throw the ball. I expect the same mish-mash of offense we've seen the back half of the season.
Unfortunately, you are probably right.
I just don't see any advantage though to starting Moseley or Trotter. Let Kiehl shake that green off, win or lose. We have to get him seasoned somewhat for next year. If we are relying on Pike alone to save our entire season next year, then we are screwed more than likely and have other issues.
-
Unfortunately, you are probably right.
I just don't see any advantage though to starting Moseley or Trotter. Let Kiehl shake that green off, win or lose. We have to get him seasoned somewhat for next year. If we are relying on Pike alone to save our entire season next year, then we are screwed more than likely and have other issues.
I hope I'm wrong, but my gut tells me, as bad as the QB play has been all season, that it wasn't his "youth" that kept him from playing more. Fuck sakes, how much worse could he be? Unfortunately, I think IF they do decide to let him be "the guy" we're going to find out why. Seriously, I mean, they burned his redshirt early...we've seen QB play that would make Daniel Cobb look like an All American by comparison, and he's still only played sparingly at Wildcat? Come on. I really hope I'm wrong. And maybe I am, I mean clearly these coaches don't know jack shit about football. Or maybe Gus was just too busy this season to draw up the Frazier Offense and get a copy to Kiehl. Wonder what he did with the Cam Offense playbook?
-
I hope I'm wrong, but my gut tells me, as bad as the QB play has been all season, that it wasn't his "youth" that kept him from playing more. Fuck sakes, how much worse could he be? Unfortunately, I think IF they do decide to let him be "the guy" we're going to find out why. Seriously, I mean, they burned his redshirt early...we've seen QB play that would make Daniel Cobb look like an All American by comparison, and he's still only played sparingly at Wildcat? Come on. I really hope I'm wrong. And maybe I am, I mean clearly these coaches don't know jack shit about football. Or maybe Gus was just too busy this season to draw up the Frazier Offense and get a copy to Kiehl. Wonder what he did with the Cam Offense playbook?
I dont see anything to lose by letting it ride with him for a bowl game. We will lose to a superior team with the status quo. If we put Kiehl in and he flops, then what did we lose?
-
My birds are not as entrenched as they were before, but the chirping I hear is that you can wait until 10:30 the Monday after the last regular season game of 2012 and possibly still not hear it. Not going anywhere. Continuity is valued over results. The whispers I hear is that everybody who came on was given a five year pass unless they elect to go somewhere else on their own. Probably BS, but I've heard the same thing twice.
I believe it...I don't like it, but I believe it.
-
I dont see anything to lose by letting it ride with him for a bowl game. We will lose to a superior team with the status quo. If we put Kiehl in and he flops, then what did we lose?
We agree, just saying, I bet we figure out real quick why he's not gotten more playing time. And, too, if he sets the world on fire, you know what you'll be hearing don't you? This is one thing I would agree with people on if they were saying it, but I haven't heard it...the coaches fucked up burning his redshirt for as little contribution as he's made, and as little experience as he's gotten.
-
Thoughts on Frazier and the future. As I said before, I went to a scrimmage the week before the season where Frazier took all the snaps. It was obvious then why he was #3 on the depth chart. Granted, they were resting the starters and seeing who would give them depth that day, but it was apparent that KF just wasn't a very accurate passer. Maybe it was just that day, but with the play of Trotter and Moseley this year and Frazier being so limited in what they allow him to do, it's probably the most likely reason.
Now, having said that, I place zero faith in Fro-Throw or Moseley being Auburn's future at QB. I think you have to focus your attention on getting Frazier as many reps as possible between now and the spring game. And since Pike is to enroll early, find out what he's all about as soon as possible. Frazier is a weapon running the ball. He's fast and athletic and surprisingly strong running up the middle. I think the way to go is Frazier at the helm using a steady diet of option plays with him and Dyer in the middle with an occasional speed rush with MacProne.
How many times this year have we been arguing that Dyer could have ground out 150 yards regardless if you just give him the damn ball. Well, how much more would they have to respect Dyer if they had to account for both he and Frazier. You work in enough safe, play action passes to Lutz and others and never put Frazier in the situation of having to stand in the pocket and make decisions. Let him and Dyer pound it like Sandusky up the middle until the kid feels comfortable. Unless they do sign an all world JUCO QB, it's Frazier and Pike as the future. Use them.
-
We agree, just saying, I bet we figure out real quick why he's not gotten more playing time. And, too, if he sets the world on fire, you know what you'll be hearing don't you? This is one thing I would agree with people on if they were saying it, but I haven't heard it...the coaches fucked up burning his redshirt for as little contribution as he's made, and as little experience as he's gotten.
Right. And again, who's to say this isnt a player development problem? Keihl has had no issues until now. Neither did the other 2. There is a disconnect at developing our QB's aside from Cam and Todd. And what I am getting at is that this is ultimately the coaches responsibility. I want improvement, development, etc.
-
Right. And again, who's to say this isnt a player development problem? Keihl has had no issues until now. Neither did the other 2. There is a disconnect at developing our QB's aside from Cam and Todd. And what I am getting at is that this is ultimately the coaches responsibility. I want improvement, development, etc.
Would you agree with this statement? "Not everybody can play QB in the SEC."
Since I'm going to assume you do agree, then you might consider that they've been "tutored" and "developed" as much as their talents will allow. In other words, we just don't have a QB on the roster that can play in the SEC. Frazier may grow in to it, I don't know.
And yes, I understand Gus is paid well to "develop" them. It's ultimately his responsibility, though it may not be within his control or power to make them any better than their talents will allow.
-
Would you agree with this statement? "Not everybody can play QB in the SEC."
Since I'm going to assume you do agree, then you might consider that they've been "tutored" and "developed" as much as their talents will allow. In other words, we just don't have a QB on the roster that can play in the SEC. Frazier may grow in to it, I don't know.
And yes, I understand Gus is paid well to "develop" them. It's ultimately his responsibility, though it may not be within his control or power to make them any better than their talents will allow.
He would obviously get a pass on Trotsky and Mosebarandgrill, but Frazier was to be his prodigy. Played at the school he coached at prior, running the same offense.
-
How do you guys feel about Pike? I don't get a warm and fuzzy about him coming in and being much better that what we already have. He's immature (which is to be expected from a 17/18 yo), and looking at his stats, he really didn't set the world on fire in his Sr season of HS football.
-
How do you guys feel about Pike? I don't get a warm and fuzzy about him coming in and being much better that what we already have. He's immature (which is to be expected from a 17/18 yo), and looking at his stats, he really didn't set the world on fire in his Sr season of HS football.
I've never fished for them but I hear they put up one hell of a fight.
-
I've never fished for them but I hear they put up one hell of a fight.
Please be quite and let the grown ups talk.
-
Please be quite and let the grown ups talk.
That's quiet big talk.
-
How do you guys feel about Pike? I don't get a warm and fuzzy about him coming in and being much better that what we already have. He's immature (which is to be expected from a 17/18 yo), and looking at his stats, he really didn't set the world on fire in his Sr season of HS football.
I am excited about the possibility of him, but again not as a true freshman running our offense.
-
He would obviously get a pass on Trotsky and Mosebarandgrill, but Frazier was to be his prodigy. Played at the school he coached at prior, running the same offense.
I don't really give him a full pass on Trotter. Trotter should get it. I even think there's a way to salvage him because his problems are largely mental.
Frazier, as stated, jury still out. True Fr., has had little playing time, and gets very few practice reps. I have concerns, but still hold out hope.
-
I've never fished for them but I hear they put up one hell of a fight.
Kinda like those killa mackerals eh?
-
That's quiet big talk.
Just quit already.
-
Would you agree with this statement? "Not everybody can play QB in the SEC."
Since I'm going to assume you do agree, then you might consider that they've been "tutored" and "developed" as much as their talents will allow. In other words, we just don't have a QB on the roster that can play in the SEC. Frazier may grow in to it, I don't know.
And yes, I understand Gus is paid well to "develop" them. It's ultimately his responsibility, though it may not be within his control or power to make them any better than their talents will allow.
See I disagree again. AJ McJackass I don't think is anything special either. I would make the statement that put Trotts or Moosely behind the bama line then there probably isn't significant drop off.
-
How do you guys feel about Pike? I don't get a warm and fuzzy about him coming in and being much better that what we already have. He's immature (which is to be expected from a 17/18 yo), and looking at his stats, he really didn't set the world on fire in his Sr season of HS football.
FWIW, he's the #4 Pro Style QB on rivals. But I do have concerns about his maturity, and character.
-
FWIW, he's the #4 Pro Style QB on rivals. But I do have concerns about his maturity, and character.
So basically Fraziers role as the Wildcat QB is in no danger.
-
I've never fished for them but I hear they put up one hell of a fight.
round these parts we figure we're doing folks a favor when we kill a carp
-
See I disagree again. AJ McJackass I don't think is anything special either. I would make the statement that put Trotts or Moosely behind the bama line then there probably isn't significant drop off.
Trotter? Maybe. Mosley, no fucking way.
-
round these parts we figure we're doing folks a favor when we kill a carp
They're a awful nuisance.
-
With any defenses, it helps tremendously to have 11 players that know how to tackle properly.
-
With any defenses, it helps tremendously to have 11 players that know how to tackle properly.
Tampa 2 is about containment not tackling. It's by design.
-
Tampa 2 is about containment not tackling. It's by design.
Everyone knows tackling gets in the way of them making their own mistakes.
Why tackle when you can wait for the running back to spontaneously combust?
-
Everyone knows tackling gets in the way of them making their own mistakes.
Why tackle when you can wait for the running back to spontaneously combust?
Auburn form tackling = diving at ball carrier's feet.