Tigers X - Number one Source to Talk Auburn Tigers Sports
The Library => Haley Center Basement => Topic started by: Townhallsavoy on June 25, 2014, 12:32:19 PM
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A Texas man is under arrest after gunning down a SWAT team member as the officer quietly tried to climb in through the apartment’s window during predawn hours.
Police State USA reports that a resident fatally shot Detective Charles “Chuck†Dinwiddie as the officer climbed in through a ground level window as part of a “no knock†raid. The officers were there due to suspicion that residents were in possession of controlled substances.
Upon hearing a noise, resident Marvin Louis Guy, 50, opened fire on the unidentified officers, shooting three others as well, although only one fatally.
Guy is currently being held on capital murder charges in connection with Dinwiddie’s death, even though it’s unclear how Guy was supposed to know that the men crawling in through the window were police officers since they hadn’t identified themselves.
The evidence sheet lists a laptop, a safe, a pistol, and a glass pipe, but no drugs were found. Given the evidence, why did police deem it necessary to seek a “no knock†warrant and why did a judge sign off on it?
Very little is known about Mr. Guy, but Dinwiddie left behind two children, all because his SWAT team went creeping into a home where the residents didn’t even have any drugs. Is that the best use of law enforcement tax dollars?
Guy’s bond has been set at $3 million dollars.
http://breakingbrown.com/2014/06/man-arrested-for-gunning-down-cop-who-climbed-in-through-his-window/ (http://breakingbrown.com/2014/06/man-arrested-for-gunning-down-cop-who-climbed-in-through-his-window/)
A less opinionated link if you want it:
http://www.kwtx.com/news/local/headlines/Documents-Detail-Crime-Scene-Search-After-Killeen-Officers-Shot-259291891.html (http://www.kwtx.com/news/local/headlines/Documents-Detail-Crime-Scene-Search-After-Killeen-Officers-Shot-259291891.html)
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I would say the term "gunning down" is not the correct choice of words. It sound like the man shot people who he thought were breaking into his property. I have a faint feeling he about to bring a big ass lawsuit against the city.
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Based on what I've read so far, this is another example of law gone wrong. Completely ridiculous. What do they expect to happen if they sneak in someone's window?
I'm not pulling for the bad guy and he very well may be a thug. Just saying, it's not smart to do this and they shouldn't be able to charge the guy with murder.
What are you going to do if you find a man sneaking through your window in the middle of the night? Well, I'm sure that happens relatively often for AUChizad and Vandy but I mean the rest of you.
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If you are the SWAT officer that get this assignment are you not voicing a concern or two beforehand?
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Based on what I've read so far, this is another example of law gone wrong. Completely ridiculous. What do they expect to happen if they sneak in someone's window?
I'm not pulling for the bad guy and he very well may be a thug. Just saying, it's not smart to do this and they shouldn't be able to charge the guy with murder.
What are you going to do if you find a man sneaking through your window in the middle of the night? Well, I'm sure that happens relatively often for AUChizad and Vandy but I mean the rest of you.
(http://www.policestateusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/marvin-louis-guy-1-1024x576.jpg)
Yes, I'm sure the big bad police was just sneaking around. Being all sneaky. Not making a sound.
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If you are the SWAT officer that get this assignment are you not voicing a concern or two beforehand?
Honestly, if you are the type to voice your concern over tactics about entering a residence through a secondary entry when multiple strikes from a battering ram didn't work at initial point of entry, you probably aren't cut out for the SWAT team.
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Honestly, if you are the type to voice your concern over tactics about entering a residence through a secondary entry when multiple strikes from a battering ram didn't work at initial point of entry, you probably aren't cut out for the SWAT team.
You know what you are exactly right. I knew a couple of guys from the Corps that went into SWAT and they were freaking crazy to begin with.
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(http://www.policestateusa.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/marvin-louis-guy-1-1024x576.jpg)
Yes, I'm sure the big bad police was just sneaking around. Being all sneaky. Not making a sound.
Yep. Probably there to steal donut money under the guise of a warrant. Pigs.
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I was told to not check this but I had to. For the uneducated:
1: a no knock warrant does not authorize police to "sneak" into anyone's house. You are required to "announce loudly and repetitively upon entry". A no-knock warrant simply means that you don't have to stand around like an asshole after knocking on the door while you wait for the suspects to destroy the evidence you are seeking and/or shoot you.
2: going through the window, as alluded to by someone else, is a secondary entry almost always for several really good reasons. That means that someone banged on his door with a ram for 10 or 20 good licks, long enough to wear a breacher out.
3: In Alabama no-knock warrants must be served during the day unless otherwise specified
4: there is no excuse for not properly identifying your target, so saying "someone was coming in my window and I shot him before I was able to determine he was a heavily marked swat member" is the same thing as saying "I'm a murderer". If smooth_operator, firearms instructor/swat member extraordinaire shot someone before identifying his target you sonsofbitches would stone me to death.
If anyone, ever, thinks to himself "that asshole deserved it" when informed of the murder of a law enforcement officer fuck you, I hope you die too. And I hope I investigate it.
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I was told to not check this but I had to. For the uneducated:
1: a no knock warrant does not authorize police to "sneak" into anyone's house. You are required to "announce loudly and repetitively upon entry". A no-knock warrant simply means that you don't have to stand around like an asshole after knocking on the door while you wait for the suspects to destroy the evidence you are seeking and/or shoot you.
2: going through the window, as alluded to by someone else, is a secondary entry almost always for several really good reasons. That means that someone banged on his door with a ram for 10 or 20 good licks, long enough to wear a breacher out.
3: In Alabama no-knock warrants must be served during the day unless otherwise specified
4: there is no excuse for not properly identifying your target, so saying "someone was coming in my window and I shot him before I was able to determine he was a heavily marked swat member" is the same thing as saying "I'm a murderer". If smooth_operator, firearms instructor/swat member extraordinaire shot someone before identifying his target you sonsofbitches would stone me to death.
If anyone, ever, thinks to himself "that asshole deserved it" when informed of the murder of a law enforcement officer fuck you, I hope you die too. And I hope I investigate it.
Hey...Hey ...Hey lets be honest, the cops didn't have donuts in their hands, it was an honest mistake.
I mean look clearly I would have shot first as well.
(http://www.tigersx.com/images/burglar_swat.jpg)
PS the guy on the left is SWAT...I think.
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Hey...Hey ...Hey lets be honest, the cops didn't have donuts in their hands, it was an honest mistake.
I mean look clearly I would have shot first as well.
(http://www.tigersx.com/images/burglar_swat.jpg)
PS the guy on the left is SWAT...I think.
Good point. That object in his hand is the tactical doughnut grabber 2000, made for "sneaking" into awful trailers and shitty apartment buildings because of an intense desire to single out random citizens for baseless arrests
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so saying "someone was coming in my window and I shot him before I was able to determine he was a heavily marked swat member" is the same thing as saying "I'm a murderer".
Great comment all around, but I don't think this is accurate.
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I was told to not check this but I had to. For the uneducated:
1: a no knock warrant does not authorize police to "sneak" into anyone's house. You are required to "announce loudly and repetitively upon entry". A no-knock warrant simply means that you don't have to stand around like an asshole after knocking on the door while you wait for the suspects to destroy the evidence you are seeking and/or shoot you.
2: going through the window, as alluded to by someone else, is a secondary entry almost always for several really good reasons. That means that someone banged on his door with a ram for 10 or 20 good licks, long enough to wear a breacher out.
3: In Alabama no-knock warrants must be served during the day unless otherwise specified
4: there is no excuse for not properly identifying your target, so saying "someone was coming in my window and I shot him before I was able to determine he was a heavily marked swat member" is the same thing as saying "I'm a murderer". If smooth_operator, firearms instructor/swat member extraordinaire shot someone before identifying his target you sonsofbitches would stone me to death.
If anyone, ever, thinks to himself "that asshole deserved it" when informed of the murder of a law enforcement officer fuck you, I hope you die too. And I hope I investigate it.
Educated I am (now)
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Great comment all around, but I don't think this is accurate.
I'm pretty sure it's the most accurate thing ever because they arrested the guy for murder. In my eyes he's way more culpable than the accidental car baby deaths because he CHOSE to grab a weapon, point it at a target that according to your insinuation he couldn't identify and shoot. I'll never believe he couldn't identify because of the reality of serving a high risk drug warrant and having to make a secondary entry does not lend itself to much confusion on the part of the drug dealer within. Don't chose to be swayed by the lack of recovered narcotics, half the time it gets flushed anyway. Even supposing he didn't flush it your avon lady doesn't always have mascara in her pocket neither do drug dealers.
If the cops were wrong I would be the first to jump on the bandwagon, I hate dirty stupid cops as much as I hate normal state troopers, but this guy got murdered by a drug dealer in the line of duty and I'll defend his honor. When my friend Sollo got killed I heard so many hateful comments it literally changed me for several years. However, in the event that you can't trust my expert opinion as a veteran of high risk warrants that this fucker wasn't confused about who he was shooting read this:
In my home town about 10 years ago a guy shot a "burglar" running down his hallway that turned out to be his 6 year old son who'd apparently had a nightmare or something.
I have personally seen firefighters wake up sleeping residents by breaking into their bedroom windows in order to save them from a fire.
If you do not identify your target you're wrong. There is no excuse. People don't get prosecuted for accidental shootings all the time but that don't make it right.
Okay I'm off my soap box you're all good God fearing auburn fans and I love you.
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I'm pretty sure it's the most accurate thing ever because they arrested the guy for murder. In my eyes he's way more culpable than the accidental car baby deaths because he CHOSE to grab a weapon, point it at a target that according to your insinuation he couldn't identify and shoot. I'll never believe he couldn't identify because of the reality of serving a high risk drug warrant and having to make a secondary entry does not lend itself to much confusion on the part of the drug dealer within. Don't chose to be swayed by the lack of recovered narcotics, half the time it gets flushed anyway. Even supposing he didn't flush it your avon lady doesn't always have mascara in her pocket neither do drug dealers.
If the cops were wrong I would be the first to jump on the bandwagon, I hate dirty stupid cops as much as I hate normal state troopers, but this guy got murdered by a drug dealer in the line of duty and I'll defend his honor. When my friend Sollo got killed I heard so many hateful comments it literally changed me for several years. However, in the event that you can't trust my expert opinion as a veteran of high risk warrants that this fucker wasn't confused about who he was shooting read this:
In my home town about 10 years ago a guy shot a "burglar" running down his hallway that turned out to be his 6 year old son who'd apparently had a nightmare or something.
I have personally seen firefighters wake up sleeping residents by breaking into their bedroom windows in order to save them from a fire.
If you do not identify your target you're wrong. There is no excuse. People don't get prosecuted for accidental shootings all the time but that don't make it right.
Okay I'm off my soap box you're all good God fearing auburn fans and I love you.
The issue is "coming in my window." If it's 3am and my window is smashed and a stranger is entering my home, I'm going to pull the trigger and be judged by a jury of my peers. Maybe the guy was coming in to warn me of the zombie apocalypse, but even then he can ring the doorbell.
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The issue is "coming in my window." If it's 3am and my window is smashed and a stranger is entering my home, I'm going to pull the trigger and be judged by a jury of my peers. Maybe the guy was coming in to warn me of the zombie apocalypse, but even then he can ring the doorbell.
And maybe so, and half the time I agree with the "better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6" sentiment but you're not a drug dealer, and it wasn't 3:30am and in this case I'm willing to bet you he was totally aware of what was going on. I urge you, should you ever feel the need to use your weapon to kill someone you identify your target. Otherwise the 12 will probably judge you harshly.
The only reason a swat team would ever chose to "come though the window" is because they failed to beat through the door because it was barricaded by a criminal concerned that police may break it down.
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The issue is "coming in my window." If it's 3am and my window is smashed and a stranger is entering my home, I'm going to pull the trigger and be judged by a jury of my peers. Maybe the guy was coming in to warn me of the zombie apocalypse, but even then he can ring the doorbell.
Well goddamn. I never considered ringing the door bell while attempting to serve a no knock warrant. We've been doing this wrong all along.
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Yep. Probably there to steal donut money under the guise of a warrant. Pigs.
I mean, look at those apartments. There is obviously a lot of donut money in there. Probably a lot of stealing too. And certainly a pile of warrants being served for missing court dates and not paying child support.
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I mean, look at those apartments. There is obviously a lot of donut money in there. Probably a lot of stealing too. And certainly a pile of warrants being served for missing court dates and not paying child support.
...Wait a second... You get donut money?
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...Wait a second... You get donut money?
It's a risky business. But sometimes, if I sneak quietly enough, I can get the donut money before anyone knows what's going on.
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I was told to not check this but I had to. For the uneducated:
1: a no knock warrant does not authorize police to "sneak" into anyone's house. You are required to "announce loudly and repetitively upon entry". A no-knock warrant simply means that you don't have to stand around like an asshole after knocking on the door while you wait for the suspects to destroy the evidence you are seeking and/or shoot you.
2: going through the window, as alluded to by someone else, is a secondary entry almost always for several really good reasons. That means that someone banged on his door with a ram for 10 or 20 good licks, long enough to wear a breacher out.
3: In Alabama no-knock warrants must be served during the day unless otherwise specified
4: there is no excuse for not properly identifying your target, so saying "someone was coming in my window and I shot him before I was able to determine he was a heavily marked swat member" is the same thing as saying "I'm a murderer". If smooth_operator, firearms instructor/swat member extraordinaire shot someone before identifying his target you sonsofbitches would stone me to death.
If anyone, ever, thinks to himself "that asshole deserved it" when informed of the murder of a law enforcement officer fudge you, I hope you die too. And I hope I investigate it.
Points 1-3 have educated me on no knock warrants and it makes much more sense. I agree on those 3. However, I totally disagree on 4. Not saying that someone shouldn't try to identify said target. Just saying that if I shoot someone coming through my window, it doesn't make me a murder. I will be trying to protect my family and am likely in fear. It wouldn't be to try and murder someone.
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It's a risky business. But sometimes, if I sneak quietly enough, I can get the donut money before anyone knows what's going on.
We call that "serving no-knock warrants"
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Points 1-3 have educated me on no knock warrants and it makes much more sense. I agree on those 3. However, I totally disagree on 4. Not saying that someone shouldn't try to identify said target. Just saying that if I shoot someone coming through my window, it doesn't make me a murder. I will be trying to protect my family and am likely in fear. It wouldn't be to try and murder someone.
And a fine and reasonable stance for an educated, gainfully employed person to think if he's unexpectedly accosted in the middle of the night. I agree, and I wish every burglar got shot to death.
However, that's not an apples to apples comparison.
In light of just this situation, a situation where it is reasonable to believe that the person involved was a criminal, and it is reasonable to believe that it was daylight (5:30 AM is daylight in June) and it is unreasonable to believe that the person inside was unaware of the 30 guys in 6 trucks and 2 vans who are covered head to toe in gear that says police on it everywhere who, before choosing to try the window fumbled and cursed and repeatedly rammed the front door , HAD to have been aware that the persons attempting to gain entry were law enforcement. I cannot and do not believe that this fellow did not chose to shoot a policeman.
If it is just the opinion of the public that cops shouldn't try to arrest people who are hard to arrest I agree it's easier when they come to the office.
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I was alluding to someone "sneaking" in my window. Not a scenario like you described. I should have clarified.
If law enforcement doesn't "sneak" in like the article suggested and did announce themselves, I really don't understand why the guy is even alive to be prosecuted.
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I was alluding to someone "sneaking" in my window. Not a scenario like you described. I should have clarified.
If law enforcement doesn't "sneak" in like the article suggested and did announce themselves, I really don't understand why the guy is even alive to be prosecuted.
I knew I liked you. Looks to me like the miscreant decided he didn't want to play anymore, took his ball and headed home. The rest of the team evidently are big law followers or didn't feel they could get away with plugging the guy.
If you're interested, all drug search warrants are served using "dynamic" tactics. This means loud and fast, using "speed, surprise and violence of action" to keep from getting your dick shot off. The idea is to be upon the villains before they know what's happening.
The only time SWAT guys try to "sneak" (which is hard in gear, by the way) its called "slow and deliberate". Those tactics are used when there's a violent armed offender in an area and the idea is to sneak up and bust..err.. arrest his ass before he shoots you. If they had been using "slow and deliberate" the handsome hero would've waited outside the window and would've attempted to communicate to the scoundrel how many holes he's going to have in his chest area if he doesn't come to Jesus' ways.
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I was alluding to someone "sneaking" in my window. Not a scenario like you described. I should have clarified.
If law enforcement doesn't "sneak" in like the article suggested and did announce themselves, I really don't understand why the guy is even alive to be prosecuted.
The problem is the article and the reaction from places like Reddit. It says "sneaking" inside the window quietly at 530am while this wrongfully accused upstanding young man was getting ready for his whiteAfrican American collar business job. That's why I reacted to it.
Obviously if the police kick in your door and say hands up, you throw your hands up. Someone sneaking or busting into my window unannounced? With my criminal history? I'm going Django.
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The problem is the article and the reaction from places like Reddit. It says "sneaking" inside the window quietly at 530am while this wrongfully accused upstanding young man was getting ready for his whiteAfrican American collar business job. That's why I reacted to it.
Obviously if the police kick in your door and say hands up, you throw your hands up. Someone sneaking or busting into my window unannounced? With my criminal history? I'm going Django.
I thought that you were successful in getting that sodomy charge reduced to tailgating.
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Exactly what TH said. Come through the front door and say, "police hands up" or something to that effect, I'm throwing up my hands and pointing towards the money jar so they can have donut money. Climb in through the back window, in the early morning hours? I'm shooting someone in the face.
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I thought no drugs were found?
No-knock warrants should only be issued for known violent criminals.
The war on drugs has been a failure and has cost too many officers their lives.
And if you are climbing in my window at night, you are my target.
Shit. This is America. Too many cops been sent to break down too many doors here lately.
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I thought no drugs were found?
No-knock warrants should only be issued for known violent criminals.
The war on drugs has been a failure and has cost too many officers their lives.
And if you are climbing in my window at night, you are my target.
Shit. This is America. Too many cops been sent to break down too many doors here lately.
When a shit bag meth addict breaks into your residence and takes your personal belongings that you've worked for, while you are at work, don't bother your local law enforcement with a report. Just take your losses and continue to talk about how the war on drugs is a waste of money.
But you wouldn't. You're the type that would call the investigator everyday and bitch about why he hasn't found your stolen shit. Then you'd probably start a neighborhood watch, do some investigation yourself, and probably get a pretty good idea about who stole your shit and where they were keeping it. Then you'd call the investigator, his chief, and maybe even fox 6 on your side to bitch about how you know where your shit is, but they wont get a warrant to go in and get the stolen property.
I talk to you every fucking day of my life. Unreasonable people are ruining this great country. I feel sad for the world my grandchildren will be forced to grow up in.
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When a shit bag meth addict breaks into your residence and takes your personal belongings that you've worked for, while you are at work, don't bother your local law enforcement with a report. Just take your losses and continue to talk about how the war on drugs is a waste of money.
But you wouldn't. You're the type that would call the investigator everyday and bitch about why he hasn't found your stolen shit. Then you'd probably start a neighborhood watch, do some investigation yourself, and probably get a pretty good idea about who stole your shit and where they were keeping it. Then you'd call the investigator, his chief, and maybe even fox 6 on your side to bitch about how you know where your shit is, but they wont get a warrant to go in and get the stolen property.
I talk to you every fucking day of my life. Unreasonable people are ruining this great country. I feel sad for the world my grandchildren will be forced to grow up in.
Damn you have grandchildren? I knew you turds laid into your sisters/cousins early but Jesus get some grass on the playing field.
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When a shit bag meth addict breaks into your residence and takes your personal belongings that you've worked for, while you are at work, don't bother your local law enforcement with a report. Just take your losses and continue to talk about how the war on drugs is a waste of money.
But you wouldn't. You're the type that would call the investigator everyday and bitch about why he hasn't found your stolen shit. Then you'd probably start a neighborhood watch, do some investigation yourself, and probably get a pretty good idea about who stole your shit and where they were keeping it. Then you'd call the investigator, his chief, and maybe even fox 6 on your side to bitch about how you know where your shit is, but they wont get a warrant to go in and get the stolen property.
I talk to you every fucking day of my life. Unreasonable people are ruining this great country. I feel sad for the world my grandchildren will be forced to grow up in.
Yeah dumbass, I would want SWAT to go get that sumbitch in the middle of the night.
You totally twisted that to suit your butthurt life!
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:move:
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You guys should be ashamed of yourselves, some of my best friends are meth dealers.
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I thought no drugs were found?
No-knock warrants should only be issued for known violent criminals.
The war on drugs has been a failure and has cost too many officers their lives.
And if you are climbing in my window at night, you are my target.
shoot. This is America. Too many cops been sent to break down too many doors here lately.
Wait.. are you just talking about random stuff right now or are we still talking about the incident?
Cause the cop didn't make the law, or the policy, or sign the warrant. All of those things were done by elected officials, so maybe you just vote for elected officials who want to legalize cocaine or whatever and stop cheering for cops to get shot. You guys keep talking about "sneaking" in through the window at "night". That is not what happened here. The article that was posted worded things in the most inflammatory way possible to generate controversy and hits. Read the comments at the bottom of the article to see why I'm upset.
What would you have law enforcement to do? Using what methods are they to arrest persons who break laws? Why is no drugs being found relevant?
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Wait.. are you just talking about random stuff right now or are we still talking about the incident?
Cause the cop didn't make the law, or the policy, or sign the warrant. All of those things were done by elected officials, so maybe you just vote for elected officials who want to legalize cocaine or whatever and stop cheering for cops to get shot. You guys keep talking about "sneaking" in through the window at "night". That is not what happened here. The article that was posted worded things in the most inflammatory way possible to generate controversy and hits. Read the comments at the bottom of the article to see why I'm upset.
What would you have law enforcement to do? Using what methods are they to arrest persons who break laws? Why is no drugs being found relevant?
You are correct. The politicians send good men to do a job that in many cases should not be done in the way mentioned.
Why a no-knock warrant on a guy who is not deemed a violent offender? While (alleged) selling meth is a despicable crime, did it really warrant a no-knock? And in the middle of the night? Using SWAT?
The fact that an officer lost his life because a judge, or politically motivate police chief decided this was necessary, well that is the real issue here.
But as a law abiding citizen who reads about little old ladies being accidentally shot in no-knock raids, it grinds my soul that the laws that are supposed to be there to protect us are the ones that politicians are using a bit liberally.
While it may make law enforcement's job a bit harder, no-knocks should be hard as hell to obtain. And they should only be used against known violent offenders.
That is why many people are upset. (not the idiots who hate police. They are just stupid)
I'm talking about folks like the guy who was purported to be a gun nut prepper that they raided his home and found food stores and five guns in a safe. Who approved that warrant and why?
So when an SWAT officer gets killed in something as meaningless as this, it brings up many questions as to when it is my right to defend my home.
The police are pawns in a game that needs to have restraint applied when issuing no-knocks.
As to what the resident knew at the time of entry, I have no idea. I just know an officer is dead because a no-knock warrant was issued and served in the middle of the night on an alleged meth dealer.
If more information comes out later that the guy was a raging murderous maniac, then I might understand. But at this point in time, it looks a bit odd.
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However, that's not an apples to apples comparison.
WT is pretty good at doing that lately.
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Exactly what TH said. Come through the front door and say, "police hands up" or something to that effect, I'm throwing up my hands and pointing towards the money jar so they can have donut money. Climb in through the back window, in the early morning hours? I'm shooting someone in the face.
And THIS
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WT is pretty good at doing that lately.
Yep. WT's comparisons require rational thought by reasonable persons. Wouldn't make sense to you.
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This is all I gots to say on it. Peace, out. Try and get my donuts, coppers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiX7GTelTPM# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiX7GTelTPM#)
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You are correct. The politicians send good men to do a job that in many cases should not be done in the way mentioned.
Why a no-knock warrant on a guy who is not deemed a violent offender? While (alleged) selling meth is a despicable crime, did it really warrant a no-knock? And in the middle of the night? Using SWAT?
The fact that an officer lost his life because a judge, or politically motivate police chief decided this was necessary, well that is the real issue here.
But as a law abiding citizen who reads about little old ladies being accidentally shot in no-knock raids, it grinds my soul that the laws that are supposed to be there to protect us are the ones that politicians are using a bit liberally.
While it may make law enforcement's job a bit harder, no-knocks should be hard as hell to obtain. And they should only be used against known violent offenders.
That is why many people are upset. (not the idiots who hate police. They are just stupid)
I'm talking about folks like the guy who was purported to be a gun nut prepper that they raided his home and found food stores and five guns in a safe. Who approved that warrant and why?
So when an SWAT officer gets killed in something as meaningless as this, it brings up many questions as to when it is my right to defend my home.
The police are pawns in a game that needs to have restraint applied when issuing no-knocks.
As to what the resident knew at the time of entry, I have no idea. I just know an officer is dead because a no-knock warrant was issued and served in the middle of the night on an alleged meth dealer.
If more information comes out later that the guy was a raging murderous maniac, then I might understand. But at this point in time, it looks a bit odd.
The problem here is the reality of the situation is different than what you're imagining. I assume you're just taking the wording of the original article at face value. Go to the linked report from a news agency.
This warrant was served at 5:30AM in June. Daylight. They suspected this guy could be dangerous. He flippin' was. No-knock warrants are used for drug raids because people exactly like you feel that if no drugs are recovered obviously it was a bad warrant. In reality drugs are easy to destroy, hide or ingest and they don't always have it on them anyway. In my area, search warrants for drugs are only obtained after a signed, proven informant gets VIDEO evidence of a drug deal using agency marked money and the drugs obtained are submitted to evidence.
They're all good warrants, not all good warrants return drugs.
To clear the air again no knock warrants do not mean you "sneak" it just means you don't have to knock on the door and wait till they answer, you bang it down shouting POLICE POLICE and go in shouting POLICE POLICE POLICE POLICE. What happened here was they went to the front door. They attempted to ram the door long enough to declare it a fail. RAMMING A DOOR IS LOUD. Someone in the back yells SECONDARY and they charge over to the window and at some point this guy starts shooting. I can tell you 100% there's no way this guy didn't know who he was shooting. Defending your home and shooting cops are two different things. IF COPS BREAK INTO YOUR HOUSE UNLAWFULLY SUE THEM LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DOES. ITS FREE MONEY.
I'm not a cop, or a swat member because I give one flying shit about drugs. Shoot heroin into your eyeballs if you want. I do what I do because when evil people do evil things I enjoy stopping them. Being a swat member requires me to serve drug warrants at 5:30AM and you fuckers think its okay if I get shot in the face because you don't agree with the "war on drugs" then maybe you should consider rooting for the crimson tide.
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The problem here is the reality of the situation is different than what you're imagining. I assume you're just taking the wording of the original article at face value. Go to the linked report from a news agency.
This warrant was served at 5:30AM in June. Daylight. They suspected this guy could be dangerous. He flippin' was. No-knock warrants are used for drug raids because people exactly like you feel that if no drugs are recovered obviously it was a bad warrant. In reality drugs are easy to destroy, hide or ingest and they don't always have it on them anyway. In my area, search warrants for drugs are only obtained after a signed, proven informant gets VIDEO evidence of a drug deal using agency marked money and the drugs obtained are submitted to evidence.
They're all good warrants, not all good warrants return drugs.
To clear the air again no knock warrants do not mean you "sneak" it just means you don't have to knock on the door and wait till they answer, you bang it down shouting POLICE POLICE and go in shouting POLICE POLICE POLICE POLICE. What happened here was they went to the front door. They attempted to ram the door long enough to declare it a fail. RAMMING A DOOR IS LOUD. Someone in the back yells SECONDARY and they charge over to the window and at some point this guy starts shooting. I can tell you 100% there's no way this guy didn't know who he was shooting. Defending your home and shooting cops are two different things. IF COPS BREAK INTO YOUR HOUSE UNLAWFULLY SUE THEM LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DOES. ITS FREE MONEY.
I'm not a cop, or a swat member because I give one flying shit about drugs. Shoot heroin into your eyeballs if you want. I do what I do because when evil people do evil things I enjoy stopping them. Being a swat member requires me to serve drug warrants at 5:30AM and you fuckers think its okay if I get shot in the face because you don't agree with the "war on drugs" then maybe you should consider rooting for the crimson tide.
You obviously have not had your:
1. Morning Donut
2. Morning blowies from Token
Listen dude was sneaking in the house at 2 am trying to get some of those drugs, he was obviously a bad cop.
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You obviously have not had your:
1. Morning Donut
2. Morning blowies from Token
Listen dude was sneaking in the house at 2 am trying to get some of those drugs, he was obviously a bad cop.
I just have him a hug, he's earned it this morning. And I did tell him not to read this thread. Because some of you motherfuckers are trolls. And some of you are goddamn idiots.
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I just have him a hug, he's earned it this morning. And I did tell him not to read this thread. Because some of you motherfuckers are trolls. And some of you are goddamn idiots.
HEY!!!
I resemble that remark.
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I can't believe smooth op and Token just let CCTAU get away with winning this argument. I would hang around but I'm doing bong hits and getting sleepy.
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I just have him a hug, he's earned it this morning. And I did tell him not to read this thread. Because some of you motherfuckers are trolls. And some of you are goddamn idiots.
Token, your words are hurtful! I am taking the bus and you will not see me at the pancake social tomorrow!
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I've done some extensive research on this. After reviewing the video, I believe Clark Griswold was well within his rights to open fire on the goons who shattered every window in his house. Ellen should have pulled out the uzi, Clark should have grabbed both pistols, Rusty should have laid down some shotgun fire and Audrey should probably have gone for the crossbow (since she used it so well when killing vampires later in her life).
Christmas Vacation would have had a very different ending; one that did not include Ellen cupping Clark's balls.
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I've done some extensive research on this. After reviewing the video, I believe Clark Griswold was well within his rights to open fire on the goons who shattered every window in his house. Ellen should have pulled out the uzi, Clark should have grabbed both pistols, Rusty should have laid down some shotgun fire and Audrey should probably have gone for the crossbow (since she used it so well when killing vampires later in her life).
Christmas Vacation would have had a very different ending; one that did not include Ellen cupping Clark's balls.
Some idiot in a leisure suit kidnapped my husband!
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Andy Griffith would have waited outside for a lengthy period of time and hollered into the dwelling for the gent to put his gun down. Even if the gent would've shot and hit the gate post as Andy entered into the fenced yard, he would've approached the house unarmed and brought the gent in for questioning. They would've worked things out without having to go into the judicial system and waste taxpayer money.
Andy and Barn didn't need all this fancy equipment and bullshit training.
It is because he was unafraid. All the donut eaters of today are just too cowardly to approach these situations in this manner.
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The problem here is the reality of the situation is different than what you're imagining. I assume you're just taking the wording of the original article at face value. Go to the linked report from a news agency.
This warrant was served at 5:30AM in June. Daylight. They suspected this guy could be dangerous. He flippin' was. No-knock warrants are used for drug raids because people exactly like you feel that if no drugs are recovered obviously it was a bad warrant. In reality drugs are easy to destroy, hide or ingest and they don't always have it on them anyway. In my area, search warrants for drugs are only obtained after a signed, proven informant gets VIDEO evidence of a drug deal using agency marked money and the drugs obtained are submitted to evidence.
They're all good warrants, not all good warrants return drugs.
To clear the air again no knock warrants do not mean you "sneak" it just means you don't have to knock on the door and wait till they answer, you bang it down shouting POLICE POLICE and go in shouting POLICE POLICE POLICE POLICE. What happened here was they went to the front door. They attempted to ram the door long enough to declare it a fail. RAMMING A DOOR IS LOUD. Someone in the back yells SECONDARY and they charge over to the window and at some point this guy starts shooting. I can tell you 100% there's no way this guy didn't know who he was shooting. Defending your home and shooting cops are two different things. IF COPS BREAK INTO YOUR HOUSE UNLAWFULLY SUE THEM LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DOES. ITS FREE MONEY.
I'm not a cop, or a swat member because I give one flying shit about drugs. Shoot heroin into your eyeballs if you want. I do what I do because when evil people do evil things I enjoy stopping them. Being a swat member requires me to serve drug warrants at 5:30AM and you fuckers think its okay if I get shot in the face because you don't agree with the "war on drugs" then maybe you should consider rooting for the crimson tide.
Look. Your department may do their due diligence in this area. But not all departments are that careful.
Here in the Atlanta area, there have been several incidents where the no-knock was served on the wrong house, even. So forgive me if I don't have full faith.
And you getting shot in the face would be a tragedy, such as this is. I cannot fault the officer. He was doing his job. It is the state of current management in many departments that should carry a lot of the blame. The cop on the street is stuck between his bosses and the public. And the two bookends seem not to trust each other. I do not envy your position.
And really, why push for a quick secondary entry if you have already alerted the dealer and he has had time to dispose of the drugs (as you say it is easy to do)?
Plenty of blame to go around. As you can look back and see, I never said the guy was right or justified in his shooting. I am just wary of the overuse of rampant no knock warrants. Not all are applied with equal deference.
But what do I know. I am just full of cogenital disabilty. Or what ever the little twit said.
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The problem here is the reality of the situation is different than what you're imagining. I assume you're just taking the wording of the original article at face value. Go to the linked report from a news agency.
This warrant was served at 5:30AM in June. Daylight. They suspected this guy could be dangerous. He flippin' was. No-knock warrants are used for drug raids because people exactly like you feel that if no drugs are recovered obviously it was a bad warrant. In reality drugs are easy to destroy, hide or ingest and they don't always have it on them anyway. In my area, search warrants for drugs are only obtained after a signed, proven informant gets VIDEO evidence of a drug deal using agency marked money and the drugs obtained are submitted to evidence.
They're all good warrants, not all good warrants return drugs.
To clear the air again no knock warrants do not mean you "sneak" it just means you don't have to knock on the door and wait till they answer, you bang it down shouting POLICE POLICE and go in shouting POLICE POLICE POLICE POLICE. What happened here was they went to the front door. They attempted to ram the door long enough to declare it a fail. RAMMING A DOOR IS LOUD. Someone in the back yells SECONDARY and they charge over to the window and at some point this guy starts shooting. I can tell you 100% there's no way this guy didn't know who he was shooting. Defending your home and shooting cops are two different things. IF COPS BREAK INTO YOUR HOUSE UNLAWFULLY SUE THEM LIKE EVERYONE ELSE DOES. ITS FREE MONEY.
I'm not a cop, or a swat member because I give one flying shoot about drugs. Shoot heroin into your eyeballs if you want. I do what I do because when evil people do evil things I enjoy stopping them. Being a swat member requires me to serve drug warrants at 5:30AM and you fudgeers think its okay if I get shot in the face because you don't agree with the "war on drugs" then maybe you should consider rooting for the crimson tide.
For the record, as I hope you know, most of us on here are not full time members of the militia and appreciate you donut eaters regardless of the banter. And I do not wish for you to get shot in the face, except with my super soaker if you climb through my window in the middle of the night unannounced.
Token, on the other hand is a different story. Let's just say that there is no way that he could bring me in alone and I know this for fact. There may be some men that are man enough in that area to do it with back up but it definitely ain't him.
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For the record, as I hope you know, most of us on here are not full time members of the militia and appreciate you donut eaters regardless of the banter. And I do not wish for you to get shot in the face, except with my super soaker if you climb through my window in the middle of the night unannounced.
Token, on the other hand is a different story. Let's just say that there is no way that he could bring me in alone and I know this for fact. There may be some men that are man enough in that area to do it with back up but it definitely ain't him.
Is it because he is a bammer?
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Is it because he is a bammer?
I don't want to go into too much detail but it has more to do with my martial arts skills.
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Yep. WT's comparisons require rational thought by reasonable persons. Wouldn't make sense to you.
Comparing apples and oranges is rational? I think I need to buy you a drink friend.
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For the record, as I hope you know, most of us on here are not full time members of the militia and appreciate you donut eaters regardless of the banter. And I do not wish for you to get shot in the face, except with my super soaker if you climb through my window in the middle of the night unannounced.
Token, on the other hand is a different story. Let's just say that there is no way that he could bring me in alone and I know this for fact. There may be some men that are man enough in that area to do it with back up but it definitely ain't him.
I feel better now. Can I call you first and still have some super soaker action? I'll act real sneaky if you're into that.
Hindsight being 20/20 I took that way too personal. On the other hand, if someone died in a horrible dick sucking accident or whatever it is that CC does I wouldn't question his grasp on the hows and the whys because undeniably he knows more about how a fatal dick sucking accident could occur.
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I feel better now. Can I call you first and still have some super soaker action? I'll act real sneaky if you're into that.
Hindsight being 20/20 I took that way too personal. On the other hand, if someone died in a horrible dick sucking accident or whatever it is that CC does I wouldn't question his grasp on the hows and the whys because undeniably he knows more about how a fatal dick sucking accident could occur.
I didn't say anything about sucking dick. That is VV and WT's territory there.
And if you feel better calling me a dick sucker, go ahead. Just don't come no-knocking on my door and we'll get along fine.
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I didn't say anything about sucking richard. That is VV and WT's territory there.
And if you feel better calling me a richard sucker, go ahead. Just don't come no-knocking on my door and we'll get along fine.
No qualms there boss. We don't come after people for going to sunday school too much.
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I didn't say anything about sucking dick. That is VV and WT's territory there.
And if you feel better calling me a dick sucker, go ahead. Just don't come no-knocking on my door and we'll get along fine.
What about your window?
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I haven't sucked any cock since I slipped a disc in my neck.
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No qualms there boss. We don't come after people for going to sunday school too much.
Funny you mention that.
I see people that have been in prison a long time get acquitted of their crime for whatever reason and people are outraged. But if you look t the person's life up until the time they were incarcerated, it's not like the police broke up into a Wednesday night prayer meeting to arrest the guy. People ARE their record. To quote a football analogy.
I never want to see anyone erroneously imprisoned, but like I tell my kids, if you are living right and doing the right things, your character will not be questioned for long.
Conversely, if you are always in the wrong place with the wrong people, you might want to reevaluate your life.
And as an officer of the law, you see both side and have to walk the line between what you know and what is the law.
Like I said, I do not envy your position. And I hate to ever hear of an officer shot or killed. Here in the Atlanta area, we have had a lot of that lately.
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Hell they're killin themselves and each other over there.
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Random observations:
1.) Policies aren't always followed. I don't know what the facts are in this case because I wasn't standing behind the officer who was shot, but just because the rules dictate what should happen in a no-knock warrant doesn't mean that it happened that way.
2.) Stating that it's daylight at 5:30AM in June is slightly misleading, considering that the sun rises at approximately 5:40AM in Birmingham in June. But, oh...wait...this is Killeen, Texas, where the sun rises at 6:30AM local time in June.
3.) Self defense laws in Texas and the vast majority of states don't require you to identify your target. Good advice to identify your target? Sure. Legally required to identify your target? No.
It's a sad situation, but there are a lot of assumptions being made about the conditions of the incident, some of which have been shown to be incorrect. I appreciate what police officers do in their line of work, but it shouldn't just be assumed that they're always in the right.
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Random observations:
1.) Policies aren't always followed. I don't know what the facts are in this case because I wasn't standing behind the officer who was shot, but just because the rules dictate what should happen in a no-knock warrant doesn't mean that it happened that way.
2.) Stating that it's daylight at 5:30AM in June is slightly misleading, considering that the sun rises at approximately 5:40AM in Birmingham in June. But, oh...wait...this is Killeen, Texas, where the sun rises at 6:30AM local time in June.
3.) Self defense laws in Texas and the vast majority of states don't require you to identify your target. Good advice to identify your target? Sure. Legally required to identify your target? No.
It's a sad situation, but there are a lot of assumptions being made about the conditions of the incident, some of which have been shown to be incorrect. I appreciate what police officers do in their line of work, but it shouldn't just be assumed that they're always in the right.
Speaking of incorrect Sunrise is the time in the morning when the sun appears or full daylight arrives, whereas dawn is the first appearance of light in the sky before sunrise and is recognized by the presence of weak sunlight. Again, I wasn't there but I know we aren't allowed to serve search warrants in the dark and I think that's a SCOTUS thing rather than agency policy.
And you're right, none of us were there. With that said not a single fact listed in either article provides one single bit of evidence that the officers that were shot were in the wrong. The fact that a warrant for murder was obtained provides plenty of evidence they were right.
And you can say that in self defense laws identifying your target isn't a stated requirement BUT many a man had been convicted for not properly identifying the target. Perhaps the law makers of most states simply assume that knowing what you're killing is an obvious criteria.
Anyone can be of the opinion that the laws, policies and constitutional rulings are unfair but to me, a person who has a tracing from the LEO memorial wall of a college friend's name, I can tell you that fair doesn't mean shit when people get killed. The reason I'm offended and the reason I've defended these men so fiercely is until you or someone else can prove I'm wrong they are fallen heros and you being disrespectful to them behind the safety of a message board is offensive, crude and frankly a pussy move. You can armchair quarterback coaching decisions, judges decisions, presidential decisions and policy but none of those men died attempting to preserve the safety, security and peace of our country.
In conclusion, I also agree that you're a smart man, and I agree I take this personally. If evidence is submitted that the shooter was innocently defending his home rather than killing cops I'll admit I was wrong and call it a tragedy rather than murder.
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smooth_operator, I love it when you go off for cause. Token, give him the day off. He sounds stressed. The east side will be fine without him for one day.
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There are several LEO's out there that will tell you this and that about tactical situations, law, and what not. I have had the opportunity to work with smooth_operator, and token both. I KNOW they are 100% right in this case. The article is geared to the average citizen that knows nothing about about law, and is siding with the government housing resident, that thinks every "cop" is violating their rights. The underlying facts are unknown to any of us, but to those of us that do this kind of work everyday, we can tell you that those officers were doing their job, and were gunned down by some POS. Just because drugs were not found means absolutely nothing at all. They had sufficient evidence to gain a search/arrest warrant. That alone tells me the guy was selling dope. As for saving the no knock warrants for "violent offenders", show me someone strung out on, and or selling dope, and I will show you someone that is a potentially "violent offender". Instead of second guessing the officers involved tactical decisions, we should mourn the loss of life of someone that was willing to put his on the line to protect yours.
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That alone tells me the guy was selling dope. As for saving the no knock warrants for "violent offenders", show me someone strung out on, and or selling dope, and I will show you someone that is a potentially "violent offender". Instead of second guessing the officers involved tactical decisions, we should mourn the loss of life of someone that was willing to put his on the line to protect yours.
Who second-guessed the officer? Not me. I do not like no-knock warrants unless the person has proven to be violent. This is not a cop issue, but an administrative one.
We do not have pre-cogs. This is not Minority Report. If we arrested every person on the premise of what they "might" do, we would have some really busy LEOs.
The fact that this officer died performing his duty is a tragedy. The fact that he was put into this situation by his superiors is a travesty.
I hate seeing officers used as political pawns. And this one reeks of that.
So no drugs were found and we lost another officer. Was there really a good enough reason to get a no-knock and send officers after this guy? That is the question that needs to be asked. It used to be that we hardly ever saw anything about these types of raids. Now we are seeing them used a lot more and the results are interesting to say the least.
My heart breaks for the officer's family and his department.
Everyone is calling the guy that shot him scum (he most likely is). But we have seen here in the ATL that these raids are so easily obtained, that the officers are sent based in incorrect information. They break in and a little old lady is sitting there with her pistol thinking she is being robbed.
This is what we the public are wary about. Make sure the no-knock is warranted. Was it truly warranted in this current case?
http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/16/georgia.botched.raid/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/16/georgia.botched.raid/index.html)
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Hey Lee. I'm bored today. Think we have time to get a no knock warrant before lunch? I have a few reparations I'd like to hand out in the bricks.
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Hey Lee. I'm bored today. Think we have time to get a no knock warrant before lunch? I have a few reparations I'd like to hand out in the bricks.
HAHAHA!!!!
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So no drugs were found and we lost another officer. Was there really a good enough reason to get a no-knock and send officers after this guy? That is the question that needs to be asked.
If the guy has a violent past and is also a know dealer or supplier, then yes. You want to come in with the element of surprise so he doesn't have time to ingest, flush or dispose of the drugs somehow and also when there is drugs there is guns. There is that to consider as well. Or at least that is how it was explained to me by my LEO buddy yesterday over a doughnut.
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Who second-guessed the officer? Not me. I do not like no-knock warrants unless the person has proven to be violent. This is not a cop issue, but an administrative one.
We do not have pre-cogs. This is not Minority Report. If we arrested every person on the premise of what they "might" do, we would have some really busy LEOs.
The fact that this officer died performing his duty is a tragedy. The fact that he was put into this situation by his superiors is a travesty.
I hate seeing officers used as political pawns. And this one reeks of that.
So no drugs were found and we lost another officer. Was there really a good enough reason to get a no-knock and send officers after this guy? That is the question that needs to be asked. It used to be that we hardly ever saw anything about these types of raids. Now we are seeing them used a lot more and the results are interesting to say the least.
My heart breaks for the officer's family and his department.
Everyone is calling the guy that shot him scum (he most likely is). But we have seen here in the ATL that these raids are so easily obtained, that the officers are sent based in incorrect information. They break in and a little old lady is sitting there with her pistol thinking she is being robbed.
This is what we the public are wary about. Make sure the no-knock is warranted. Was it truly warranted in this current case?
http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/16/georgia.botched.raid/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/16/georgia.botched.raid/index.html)
Hey man, preaching to the choir. As someone that actually serves the flippin' things the last thing I want is to get killed or have to kill over something meaningless like a chemical substance. Half the time I think we should legalize everything as long as you sign a healthcare waiver stating you refuse treatment for any ill effects from drugs. Then those predisposed to abuse or flip out on the stuff will die off and we can move on as a society. That said, the purpose of the no-knock warrant (again, doesn't mean sneaking) for drug seizures is to preserve evidence. Otherwise serving a search warrant would be a totally worthless endeavor because the drug dealers/users/manufacturers/enthusiasts would simply saunter to the nearest toilet, flush until they get it all down and open the door. The simple fact is law makers and society in general have evidently determined that they are willing to take some losses in order to appear to be combating the use of drugs. Is it right? Not my call to make. Is there a better way? I think so but I don't get paid enough to make those decisions.
I'm aware of that event you cited there, and it was indeed a tragedy. Heck, the same thing could've happened at the right residence with someone's folks visiting. Lots of bad things can happen, and we do it anyway.
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So no drugs were found and we lost another officer. Was there really a good enough reason to get a no-knock and send officers after this guy? That is the question that needs to be asked. It used to be that we hardly ever saw anything about these types of raids. Now we are seeing them used a lot more and the results are interesting to say the least.
Everyone is calling the guy that shot him scum (he most likely is). But we have seen here in the ATL that these raids are so easily obtained, that the officers are sent based in incorrect information. They break in and a little old lady is sitting there with her pistol thinking she is being robbed.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/16/georgia.botched.raid/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/08/16/georgia.botched.raid/index.html)
The fact that someone is potientially a violent offender is a very good reason to get a no knock. If someone has the potential of shooting it out with the cops, then officer saftey is paramount. The fact that this officer died in the line of duty is tragic, but he just like every SWAT team member across the country knows the risk of the job and they do it anyway. Just like the dealer knows that there is a strong possibility that the cops are gonna raid his residence with a no knock warrant one day, and yet he still takes the risk. There are examples of serving warrants gone bad because that's what the media wants you to see. What you don't see are the countless times it goes off without a hitch, because who cares about that. You also don't see the times when officers have to go into places like this, and children are there living in filth, and breathing in the crap their so called parents cook or use. I don't know the circumstances behind the article you have posted, but according to the article several officers are now in prison for their actions, which is more than the dealer would have gotten had he been arrested.
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I do dope all over the great state of Alabama. Ain't no lawman big enough to take me in.
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Speaking of incorrect Sunrise is the time in the morning when the sun appears or full daylight arrives, whereas dawn is the first appearance of light in the sky before sunrise and is recognized by the presence of weak sunlight.
Depends on the term you're using, I guess. I'm not a meteorologist, so I don't know what definition they use, but you can find two different definitions for sunrise. One is the full daylight definition you reference, and the other is when the upper edge of the sun first appears over the eastern horizon.
However, considering that it takes about 3 minutes for the sun to rise so that it's fully visible after first peeking over the horizon, it could not have been daylight at 5:30AM in Killeen, TX if the sunrise (either definition) does not occur for another hour.
Again, I wasn't there but I know we aren't allowed to serve search warrants in the dark and I think that's a SCOTUS thing rather than agency policy.
Arrest warrants are allowed to be served at any time; only search warrants are limited to daytime. But there are a couple of things to note here.
The first is that this was a search warrant (at least according to the article), and as mentioned above, it's not daylight in any way at 5:30AM in Killeen, TX.
The second is that the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center, a branch of Homeland Security, actually defines "daytime" for search warrants as between 6:00AM and 10:00PM. So a 5:30AM execution of a search warrant goes against that federal policy, which I would assume applies to local enforcement agencies as well.
And you can say that in self defense laws identifying your target isn't a stated requirement BUT many a man had been convicted for not properly identifying the target. Perhaps the law makers of most states simply assume that knowing what you're killing is an obvious criteria.
Nothing is assumed in law. It's either codified clearly in the statute, or it has been expounded upon by a court of competent jurisdiction. If neither of those are present, then a court has a case of first impression, and it must create precedent that expounds upon the statute. But we never rely upon an assumption that lawmakers meant something that's not in the statute in the slightest.
Aside from that, I'm not aware of any self defense cases in which someone was convicted because they didn't identify their target. If that was the sole reason for conviction, then they should have appealed and probably would have won on appeal, because self defense laws typically only require that you have a reasonable fear for your life or that a forcible felony will occur.
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I'm glad I don't need a meteorologist to tell me when it's sunrise. You mofos kill me.
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I'm glad I don't need a meteorologist to tell me when it's sunrise. You mofos kill me.
I bet you will also know when you get mooned.
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I bet you will also know when you get mooned.
You wanna see a black moon?
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You wanna see a black moon?
(http://blog.cleveland.com/top_entertainment/2007/09/medium_paul.jpg)
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(http://blog.cleveland.com/top_entertainment/2007/09/medium_paul.jpg)
Man, he did NOT age well since his days with the Oilers.
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Man, he did NOT age well since his days with the Oilers.
I can't wait to get black when I get old.
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Depends on the term you're using, I guess. I'm not a meteorologist, so I don't know what definition they use, but you can find two different definitions for sunrise. One is the full daylight definition you reference, and the other is when the upper edge of the sun first appears over the eastern horizon.
However, considering that it takes about 3 minutes for the sun to rise so that it's fully visible after first peeking over the horizon, it could not have been daylight at 5:30AM in Killeen, TX if the sunrise (either definition) does not occur for another hour.
Arrest warrants are allowed to be served at any time; only search warrants are limited to daytime. But there are a couple of things to note here.
The first is that this was a search warrant (at least according to the article), and as mentioned above, it's not daylight in any way at 5:30AM in Killeen, TX.
The second is that the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center, a branch of Homeland Security, actually defines "daytime" for search warrants as between 6:00AM and 10:00PM. So a 5:30AM execution of a search warrant goes against that federal policy, which I would assume applies to local enforcement agencies as well.
Nothing is assumed in law. It's either codified clearly in the statute, or it has been expounded upon by a court of competent jurisdiction. If neither of those are present, then a court has a case of first impression, and it must create precedent that expounds upon the statute. But we never rely upon an assumption that lawmakers meant something that's not in the statute in the slightest.
Aside from that, I'm not aware of any self defense cases in which someone was convicted because they didn't identify their target. If that was the sole reason for conviction, then they should have appealed and probably would have won on appeal, because self defense laws typically only require that you have a reasonable fear for your life or that a forcible felony will occur.
Well if you're right then the entire thing will be thrown out immediately. If the police were conducting an unlawful search the under the fruits of the poisoned tree doctrine any and all evidence obtained is inadmissible, including the dead cop. However, in the spirit of rebuttal:
http://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/dallas (http://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/dallas)
This shows the twilight hours...
actually, know what, fudge it. The cops are guilty of conducting doughnut raids, the guy's innocent. It takes 3 minutes from the time you can see clearly until the sun has fully risen and all LEOs are required to follow FLETC guidelines at all times. According to self defense law you're reasonably in fear for your doughnuts safety if you even see a cop. This arrest is a travesty and I'm totally against it.
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Well if you're right then the entire thing will be thrown out immediately. If the police were conducting an unlawful search the under the fruits of the poisoned tree doctrine any and all evidence obtained is inadmissible, including the dead cop. However, in the spirit of rebuttal:
http://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/dallas (http://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/dallas)
This shows the twilight hours...
actually, know what, fudge it. The cops are guilty of conducting doughnut raids, the guy's innocent. It takes 3 minutes from the time you can see clearly until the sun has fully risen and all LEOs are required to follow FLETC guidelines at all times. According to self defense law you're reasonably in fear for your doughnuts safety if you even see a cop. This arrest is a travesty and I'm totally against it.
I'm glad you are finally starting to see things our way. Now, let's get started on that Sovereign Citizen paperwork.
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I'm glad you are finally starting to see things our way. Now, let's get started on that Sovereign Citizen paperwork.
Is there paperwork? I can barely read.
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Well if you're right then the entire thing will be thrown out immediately. If the police were conducting an unlawful search the under the fruits of the poisoned tree doctrine any and all evidence obtained is inadmissible, including the dead cop. However, in the spirit of rebuttal:
http://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/dallas (http://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/dallas)
This shows the twilight hours...
actually, know what, fudge it. The cops are guilty of conducting doughnut raids, the guy's innocent. It takes 3 minutes from the time you can see clearly until the sun has fully risen and all LEOs are required to follow FLETC guidelines at all times. According to self defense law you're reasonably in fear for your doughnuts safety if you even see a cop. This arrest is a travesty and I'm totally against it.
Twilight is a bit different from full daylight, which is what you were initially stating. And at 5:30AM, the light produced during twilight is right between "astronomical twilight" and "nautical twilight." Astronomical twilight is when it goes from completely dark to light just starting to be visible on the horizon, and nautical twilight is when only vague outline of objects are visible (according to the National Weather Service Weather Forecast Office). So there's still not an argument to be made that this was in clear daylight and everyone was easily identifiable.
I think we've both already stated that none of us were there and know what happened for sure. And in case I haven't made it clear, I'm not defending the guy or shitting on police. I'm just pointing out that until we know more concrete facts, we don't know who was in the right and who was in the wrong.
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actually, know what, fudge it. The cops are guilty of conducting doughnut raids, the guy's innocent. It takes 3 minutes from the time you can see clearly until the sun has fully risen and all LEOs are required to follow FLETC guidelines at all times. According to self defense law you're reasonably in fear for your doughnuts safety if you even see a cop. This arrest is a travesty and I'm totally against it.
I already told you, and I can't believe it's taken you this long to figure shit out.
You obtain and execute warrants everyday, have been assigned to the US Marshall's task force for a number of years, and are a member of one of the largest SWAT details in northeast Alabama. He's a tax lawyer. He obviously knows more than you on this subject.
Now can we please turn the lights off in this thread?
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I already told you, and I can't believe it's taken you this long to figure shit out.
You obtain and execute warrants everyday, have been assigned to the US Marshall's task force for a number of years, and are a member of one of the largest SWAT details in northeast Alabama. He's a tax lawyer. He obviously knows more than you on this subject.
Now can we please turn the lights off in this thread?
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to read...
https://www.fletc.gov/training/programs/legal-division/podcasts/4th-amendment-roadmap-podcasts/4th-amendment-transcripts/execution-of-a-search-warrant-i.html (https://www.fletc.gov/training/programs/legal-division/podcasts/4th-amendment-roadmap-podcasts/4th-amendment-transcripts/execution-of-a-search-warrant-i.html)
Tim: When is it reasonable to execute a search?
Jenna: First I need to make a distinction between arrests warrants and search warrants. Arrest warrants can be served anytime - night or day. If the agents have an arrest warrant for suspect, they can enter that suspects residence to serve the warrant any time - night or day - as long as they have a reasonable belief that the suspect is home. Search warrants are different. They are generally executed in the daytime; the daytime is defined between 6am and 10pm.
Not to mention that, you know...police actions are governed by laws, and lawyers deal with law...and stuff.
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Not to mention that, you know...police actions are governed by laws, and lawyers deal with law...and stuff.
Great. There is a guy in Texas who needs your help. I'll follow the case to see how you do.
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It doesn't take a rocket scientist to read...
https://www.fletc.gov/training/programs/legal-division/podcasts/4th-amendment-roadmap-podcasts/4th-amendment-transcripts/execution-of-a-search-warrant-i.html (https://www.fletc.gov/training/programs/legal-division/podcasts/4th-amendment-roadmap-podcasts/4th-amendment-transcripts/execution-of-a-search-warrant-i.html)
Not to mention that, you know...police actions are governed by laws, and lawyers deal with law...and stuff.
Tax lawyer huh?
Okay look. FLETC is an academy. What they say isn't legally binding for anyone, certainty not a state agency. And I get it. Really, I understand. I'll stop.
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Okay look. FLETC is an academy. What they say isn't legally binding for anyone, certainty not a state agency. And I get it. Really, I understand. I'll stop.
So a government academy that is training people in an official capacity on how to execute the law doesn't know what they're talking about?
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It doesn't take a rocket scientist to read...
https://www.fletc.gov/training/programs/legal-division/podcasts/4th-amendment-roadmap-podcasts/4th-amendment-transcripts/execution-of-a-search-warrant-i.html (https://www.fletc.gov/training/programs/legal-division/podcasts/4th-amendment-roadmap-podcasts/4th-amendment-transcripts/execution-of-a-search-warrant-i.html)
By the way, great website.
Jenna: It can be, yes, agents can dispense with “knock and announce†when they have reasonable suspicion that exigent circumstances exist. So agents have to have some facts that allow them to reasonably conclude that to knock and announce will be dangerous, futile, pointless, or inhibit their investigation by facilitating the destruction evident.
Judges can issue no knock warrants from the “get go†when agents can articulate reasonable suspicious that to knock and announce will be dangerous, futile or inhibit that investigation. So for example, agents might decide they might either go to the judge with this information or they may find this information at the scene and make the decision themselves.
They might make it a no knock entry in a case like this. Say the agents are going to execute a drug warrant. Since it’s a drug warrant, we know that agents can execute it either in the day or night. The agents know that the suspect who’s house they are going to has previously told friends he’ll go down shooting if the cops every come to his house. And, the agents were told by a reliable informant of theirs that the suspect always answers the door with a gun in his hand. And their surveillance has revealed that the suspect has posted lookouts on the corners in the neighborhood, so someone can signal him or call him on his cell phone or something like that when they think the police are approaching. Articulation of those facts would probably support a no-knock entry, since the suspect appears from those facts he’s already made plans to destroy evidence and assault police officers if he finds out they are coming to his house.
But seriously though, fuck cops. That one deserved to be shot in the face.
And fuck this thread. That officer went into that residence knowing it may be his last, and he did it anyway. Very few of you would do that exact thing, regardless of circumstances.
And many of you don't get it. I understand that. Because you are decent people, who have good educations and go to work every day of your life. If someone is coming into your residence at anytime of the day, they are a burglar trying to steal your shit. Because you aren't dope dealers. And you haven't been convicted of armed robbery. And you aren't a piece of shit. Until you deal with these people on a daily basis, you'll never truly understand. That's fine too. And there are bad cops. Specifically, every single state trooper I know. And there are asshole cops. Ones who write tickets to decent people who are simply trying to get through the day. Fuck everyone of those guys. But fuck that convicted felon, accused of selling dope, even harder. And fuck anyone who reads that press release and doesn't immediately believe that he didn't know the cops were trying to beat his door down, and then decided to shoot the first one through the window.
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By the way, great website.
But seriously though, fuck cops. That one deserved to be shot in the face.
I never argued that the no-knock aspect of the search warrant was invalid, nor do I really care whether the warrants can be executed in the day or night. In fact, it was smooth_operator, the guy you're defending as knowing what he's talking about, who stated that this had to have been considered as served in the daytime because you don't serve search warrants at night.
Rather, I was stating that you can't argue that it was broad daylight and the officers were readily identifiable visibly, and that it's possible that the resident had a reasonable fear for his life without knowing who was breaking in.
If the warrant was executed properly and they were identifying themselves as police after already having tried to bang down the door with 10 hits, then it would be highly unlikely that this guy didn't know it was the police.
My only stance has been that without knowing exactly what happened, when it happened, and how it happened, we don't know who's in the wrong.
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Twilight is a bit different from full daylight, which is what you were initially stating. And at 5:30AM, the light produced during twilight is right between "astronomical twilight" and "nautical twilight." Astronomical twilight is when it goes from completely dark to light just starting to be visible on the horizon, and nautical twilight is when only vague outline of objects are visible (according to the National Weather Service Weather Forecast Office). So there's still not an argument to be made that this was in clear daylight and everyone was easily identifiable.
This is why people hate lawyers.
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This is why people hate lawyers.
Because we point out that there are proper definitions for terms that come from the appropriate authorities on the subject?
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I never argued that the no-knock aspect of the search warrant was invalid, nor do I really care whether the warrants can be executed in the day or night. In fact, it was smooth_operator, the guy you're defending as knowing what he's talking about, who stated that this had to have been considered as served in the daytime because you don't serve search warrants at night.
Rather, I was stating that you can't argue that it was broad daylight and the officers were readily identifiable visibly, and that it's possible that the resident had a reasonable fear for his life without knowing who was breaking in.
If the warrant was executed properly and they were identifying themselves as police after already having tried to bang down the door with 10 hits, then it would be highly unlikely that this guy didn't know it was the police.
My only stance has been that without knowing exactly what happened, when it happened, and how it happened, we don't know who's in the wrong.
Tax Lawyer eh?
I bet you also drink skunky beer at tailgating events and touch little kids in attendance - ya big pervert.
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This is why people hate lawyers.
They also hate Twilight! Ghey assed vampires.
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Tax Lawyer eh?
I bet you also drink skunky beer at tailgating events and touch little kids in attendance - ya big pervert.
I drink moonshine and touch the grown men. Get that shit right!
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I amended my last post, and I'm finished with this thread. Fuck dirty cops, felons, and lawyers.
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I never argued that the no-knock aspect of the search warrant was invalid, nor do I really care whether the warrants can be executed in the day or night. In fact, it was smooth_operator, the guy you're defending as knowing what he's talking about, who stated that this had to have been considered as served in the daytime because you don't serve search warrants at night.
Rather, I was stating that you can't argue that it was broad daylight and the officers were readily identifiable visibly, and that it's possible that the resident had a reasonable fear for his life without knowing who was breaking in.
If the warrant was executed properly and they were identifying themselves as police after already having tried to bang down the door with 10 hits, then it would be highly unlikely that this guy didn't know it was the police.
My only stance has been that without knowing exactly what happened, when it happened, and how it happened, we don't know who's in the wrong.
I've re-read everything and I've decided you're just trolling.
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My only stance has been that without knowing exactly what happened, when it happened, and how it happened, we don't know who's in the wrong.
We know they had a warrant. We know they attempted to execute the warrant. As I said many pages ago, UNLESS THEY WERE AT THE WRONG ADDRESS, it is very clear who was in the wrong.
Seriously, now I'm finished.
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Tax Lawyer eh?
I bet you also drink skunky beer at tailgating events and touch little kids in attendance - ya big pervert.
He's not very good at the taxes. Doesn't even understand the "monopoly money" concept or that "profits" are not "cash in hand"
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Just because you're a dope dealer doesn't mean you lose self defense rights. If someone who is not a cop breaks into their house, self defense still applies. And, unfortunately, if a police officer is shot because he did not identify himself and was not readily identifiable for any reason, self defense applies.
Thank God you guys do what you do. Seriously. I don't envy you, and I respect you. But just because you're a cop and someone is a criminal doesn't give you free reign to do whatever. And I am not, I repeat, AM NOT stating that the police in this instance did anything wrong. They may have done everything right, and if so, fuck the guy who shot him. But we can't just assume that because procedure says X, then X was done. We don't start shouting inaccuracies about how it was broad daylight to defend a cop just because he's a cop. We should be defending who was in the right, not who had what profession.
Again, if what the cops did was done correctly (and as you alluded to, in most instances they are), then fuck that guy. Even if a procedural step was missed, but it can be shown that he did know it was the cops, fuck that guy. But I'm not going to prematurely decide who's in the wrong when there are unknown facts that may decide the issue.
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This is why people hate lawyers.
I hate cops and lawyers. Fuck em all.
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See what I mean? This dude had a double dose. Sovereign Citizens Unite!
http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/alabaster_attorney_sentenced_f_1.html (http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/alabaster_attorney_sentenced_f_1.html)
Alabaster attorney sentenced for investor fraud, used $2.5 million to buy house, travel to Cam Newton's Heisman ceremony
Print
Kent Faulk | kfaulk@al.com By Kent Faulk | kfaulk@al.com
Email the author | Follow on Twitter
on June 26, 2014 at 7:33 PM, updated June 27, 2014 at 1:03 PM
BIRMINGHAM, Alabama – A former Alabaster attorney on Thursday was sentenced to nearly six years in federal prison for his guilty plea to charges that he bilked investors out of $2.5 million.
Instead of investing the money he bought a house, luxury items, and trips, including one to Auburn University quarterback Cam Newton's Heisman Trophy ceremony.
Christopher Shawn Linton, 34, was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Virginia Hopkins to 71 months in prison and ordered to pay $2.5 million restitution to 12 investors. Linton also was ordered to serve five years under the supervision of the U.S. Probation Office once he is released.
Linton is to report to the designated federal prison on Sept. 22, Hopkins said. The judge is recommending that Linton be sent to a prison that has the ability to deal with mental health issues.
Hopkins called Linton a "robber baron, because you are a robber and you lived like a baron."
Linton pleaded guilty earlier this year to frauds and swindles, wire fraud, bank fraud, and illegal money transactions.
According to a sentencing memorandum from Assistant U.S. Attorney Robin Mark and other documents, the charges against Linton related to a scheme that went like this:
Linton purchased company stock and became an officer, partner and part owner of a business called Integrity Capital, Inc. in 2007. The business made advance payments to lawyers who submitted vouchers for work performed for the state, then received voucher payments from the state and kept a percentage as a service fee.
Linton formed Integrity Capital LLC in 2009 and, in August of that year, and began recruiting advisers to solicit investments in order to buy the assets and capital stock of Integrity Capital Inc., prosecutors said.
Between September 2009 and December 2011 Linton received nearly $2.8 million in investment funds from the investors. The money was paid to Linton's law firm and the majority of the funds were deposited in to Linton's Interest on Lawyers Trust Account (IOLTA).
Linton induced the investors to sign a loan and promissory note that falsely stated the purpose of the loan. The loan and agreement misrepresented to investors that the funds would be used for either the purchase of assets or capital stock of Integrity Capital Inc., or the purchase of government back vouchers and other commercial loans.
Linton mailed fraudulent letters with false account statements and sent checks that purported to be quarterly interest payments in attempt to convince the investors that the investments were legitimate.
"As soon as Linton received the investor funds, Linton began exhausting the funds for personal use," according to Mark's memo.
The most egregious example was the $560,000 purchase of a home in Alabaster in September 2009, Mark stated.
Linton also used the money for construction projects at his home, trips on private jets, the purchase of recreational vehicles and jewelry, according to Mark's memo. He also took "extravagant" vacations for him and his family to St. Lucia, St. Thomas, the SEC Championship football game in Atlanta, the BCS National Championship game in Arizona, and to New York for the Heisman Trophy ceremony.
Marks told Hopkins that even today Linton's Facebook page still had a photo of him and his son with Cam Newton at the ceremony, along with other vacation photos.
"In some instances, Linton made personal representations to the victims and immediately turned his back and took the money and lived a fantasy life of luxury," Mark said in the memo.
Some of the investors Linton bilked had planned to use the investments for small renovations to their homes, as money for assisted living and medical conditions or simply to take their grandchildren on vacation, Mark stated.
Hopkins listened to three victims, including a retired Birmingham firefighter, who were swindled out of nearly $750,000. The retired firefighter said that after losing $300,000 of his retirement, he is now faced with the possibility of having to get a part-time job at the age of 70.
Assistant federal public defender Rick Burgess had asked for probation in the case so Linton could work to start paying back the money. He said that Linton was bi-polar, which would explain his behavior.
Linton in a written speech he read to the judge, apologized to the investors. He said at one point he tried to commit suicide. Linton also asked the judge not to put him in prison so he could continue mental health treatment.
Linton, who already has surrendered his law license, said he also has lost almost all his worldly possessions and his reputation.
Mark, however, told the judge that last year Linton was fired from a finance company for lying to clients and asking them to send him the money directly to him. She said if it had been successful, it would have been the same type of scheme he is charged with committing.
The FBI and Alabama Securities Commission investigated the case.
"Mr. Linton risked his clients' retirement funds, money for their children's education, and for their livelihood. His actions are a dishonor to those who practice law with the utmost commitment and integrity and the sentence handed down today recognizes his deplorable conduct," FBI Special Agent in Charge Richard Schwein said Friday morning in a prepared statement.
U.S. Attorney Joyce White Vance also said the victims in this case trusted would protect their investments. "Instead, he robbed them of their savings so he could live a fantasy life of luxury," she said.
Alabama Securities Commission Director Joe Borg said the commission expects the sentence "to send a powerful message that professional misconduct that causes damage to our citizens' financial security, and to public confidence in the integrity of the practice of law, will be dealt with swiftly and appropriately."
Linton is a former police officer who graduated from Troy University and the Birmingham School of Law. In 2008 he represented an Alabama booster, along with several other attorneys, and subpoenaed then-Tennessee head coach Phillip Fulmer during the Southeastern Conference's annual media days in Birmingham. In 2009 ran for the Alabama House of Representatives.
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Good grief you can't expect me to read all that. Fortunately, I have an opinion anyway.
He's a witch, burn him.
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See what I mean? This dude had a double dose. Sovereign Citizens Unite!
http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/alabaster_attorney_sentenced_f_1.html (http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/alabaster_attorney_sentenced_f_1.html)
Alabaster attorney sentenced for investor fraud, used $2.5 million to buy house, travel to Cam Newton's Heisman ceremony
Print
Kent Faulk | kfaulk@al.com By Kent Faulk | kfaulk@al.com
Email the author | Follow on Twitter
on June 26, 2014 at 7:33 PM, updated June 27, 2014 at 1:03 PM
BIRMINGHAM, Alabama – A former Alabaster attorney on Thursday was sentenced to nearly six years in federal prison for his guilty plea to charges that he bilked investors out of $2.5 million.
Instead of investing the money he bought a house, luxury items, and trips, including one to Auburn University quarterback Cam Newton's Heisman Trophy ceremony.
Christopher Shawn Linton, 34, was sentenced by U.S. District Judge Virginia Hopkins to 71 months in prison and ordered to pay $2.5 million restitution to 12 investors. Linton also was ordered to serve five years under the supervision of the U.S. Probation Office once he is released.
Linton is to report to the designated federal prison on Sept. 22, Hopkins said. The judge is recommending that Linton be sent to a prison that has the ability to deal with mental health issues.
Hopkins called Linton a "robber baron, because you are a robber and you lived like a baron."
Linton pleaded guilty earlier this year to frauds and swindles, wire fraud, bank fraud, and illegal money transactions.
According to a sentencing memorandum from Assistant U.S. Attorney Robin Mark and other documents, the charges against Linton related to a scheme that went like this:
Linton purchased company stock and became an officer, partner and part owner of a business called Integrity Capital, Inc. in 2007. The business made advance payments to lawyers who submitted vouchers for work performed for the state, then received voucher payments from the state and kept a percentage as a service fee.
Linton formed Integrity Capital LLC in 2009 and, in August of that year, and began recruiting advisers to solicit investments in order to buy the assets and capital stock of Integrity Capital Inc., prosecutors said.
Between September 2009 and December 2011 Linton received nearly $2.8 million in investment funds from the investors. The money was paid to Linton's law firm and the majority of the funds were deposited in to Linton's Interest on Lawyers Trust Account (IOLTA).
Linton induced the investors to sign a loan and promissory note that falsely stated the purpose of the loan. The loan and agreement misrepresented to investors that the funds would be used for either the purchase of assets or capital stock of Integrity Capital Inc., or the purchase of government back vouchers and other commercial loans.
Linton mailed fraudulent letters with false account statements and sent checks that purported to be quarterly interest payments in attempt to convince the investors that the investments were legitimate.
"As soon as Linton received the investor funds, Linton began exhausting the funds for personal use," according to Mark's memo.
The most egregious example was the $560,000 purchase of a home in Alabaster in September 2009, Mark stated.
Linton also used the money for construction projects at his home, trips on private jets, the purchase of recreational vehicles and jewelry, according to Mark's memo. He also took "extravagant" vacations for him and his family to St. Lucia, St. Thomas, the SEC Championship football game in Atlanta, the BCS National Championship game in Arizona, and to New York for the Heisman Trophy ceremony.
Marks told Hopkins that even today Linton's Facebook page still had a photo of him and his son with Cam Newton at the ceremony, along with other vacation photos.
"In some instances, Linton made personal representations to the victims and immediately turned his back and took the money and lived a fantasy life of luxury," Mark said in the memo.
Some of the investors Linton bilked had planned to use the investments for small renovations to their homes, as money for assisted living and medical conditions or simply to take their grandchildren on vacation, Mark stated.
Hopkins listened to three victims, including a retired Birmingham firefighter, who were swindled out of nearly $750,000. The retired firefighter said that after losing $300,000 of his retirement, he is now faced with the possibility of having to get a part-time job at the age of 70.
Assistant federal public defender Rick Burgess had asked for probation in the case so Linton could work to start paying back the money. He said that Linton was bi-polar, which would explain his behavior.
Linton in a written speech he read to the judge, apologized to the investors. He said at one point he tried to commit suicide. Linton also asked the judge not to put him in prison so he could continue mental health treatment.
Linton, who already has surrendered his law license, said he also has lost almost all his worldly possessions and his reputation.
Mark, however, told the judge that last year Linton was fired from a finance company for lying to clients and asking them to send him the money directly to him. She said if it had been successful, it would have been the same type of scheme he is charged with committing.
The FBI and Alabama Securities Commission investigated the case.
"Mr. Linton risked his clients' retirement funds, money for their children's education, and for their livelihood. His actions are a dishonor to those who practice law with the utmost commitment and integrity and the sentence handed down today recognizes his deplorable conduct," FBI Special Agent in Charge Richard Schwein said Friday morning in a prepared statement.
U.S. Attorney Joyce White Vance also said the victims in this case trusted would protect their investments. "Instead, he robbed them of their savings so he could live a fantasy life of luxury," she said.
Alabama Securities Commission Director Joe Borg said the commission expects the sentence "to send a powerful message that professional misconduct that causes damage to our citizens' financial security, and to public confidence in the integrity of the practice of law, will be dealt with swiftly and appropriately."
Linton is a former police officer who graduated from Troy University and the Birmingham School of Law. In 2008 he represented an Alabama booster, along with several other attorneys, and subpoenaed then-Tennessee head coach Phillip Fulmer during the Southeastern Conference's annual media days in Birmingham. In 2009 ran for the Alabama House of Representatives.
TL;DR
I stopped at Cam Newton and said GUILTY, GUILTY, GUILTY!!!!! Hang with a thug, become a thug as my momma always said (she used dogs and fleas, or whatever, I wasn't really paying attention).
Also, I know what Shawn Linton's nickname is..."The Bagman".
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Okay. I've been watching this thread and doing some reading of the affidavit. What both you lawmen a lawyers types keep missing is the fact a known felon has weapons. It's kind of like if I plow into some ones back end(let the jokes begin here) stopped at a stop sign and they have an expired license. It is automatically their fault because they shouldn't be driving. Thus , this man shouldn't have had guns to be able to shoot any one. Murder. Voila!
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Okay. I've been watching this thread and doing some reading of the affidavit. What both you lawmen a lawyers types keep missing is the fact a known felon has weapons. It's kind of like if I plow into some ones back end(let the jokes begin here) stopped at a stop sign and they have an expired license. It is automatically their fault because they shouldn't be driving. Thus , this man shouldn't have had guns to be able to shoot any one. Murder. Voila!
Ahh...simplicity.
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Okay. I've been watching this thread and doing some reading of the affidavit. What both you lawmen a lawyers types keep missing is the fact a known felon has weapons. It's kind of like if I plow into some ones back end(let the jokes begin here) stopped at a stop sign and they have an expired license. It is automatically their fault because they shouldn't be driving. Thus , this man shouldn't have had guns to be able to shoot any one. Murder. Voila!
Ok, ok. I think I get it. It's like when a girl with big boobs wears a skimpy dress in public. She's just asking to be raped. In fact, I'd say she's raping men by forcing them to force her to have sex with them. Yeah. I got it now.
(https://ioneglobalgrind.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/aqnha.gif?w=561&h=561)
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Ok, ok. I think I get it. It's like when a girl with big boobs wears a skimpy dress in public. She's just asking to be raped. In fact, I'd say she's raping men by forcing them to force her to have sex with them. Yeah. I got it know.
(https://ioneglobalgrind.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/aqnha.gif?w=561&h=561)
eggzachery!
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I didn't say anything about sucking dick. That is VV and WT's territory there.
And if you feel better calling me a dick sucker, go ahead. Just don't come no-knocking on my door and we'll get along fine.
What about your window?
I'm quite a bit late to this party, but I think he's saying it is unnecessary to no-knock on the front door in the middle of the night when he can tap his back door all night long (and I'm sure VV will render his expert legal analysis yet again)
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He'll walk due to the stupidity of the police department. A civil suit won't bother him either. He was totally within his rights according to the very laws the police were breaking. Aren't police officers sworn to serve and protect themselves too?
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He'll walk due to the stupidity of the police department. A civil suit won't bother him either. He was totally within his rights according to the very laws the police were breaking. Aren't police officers sworn to serve and protect themselves too?
Well it used to be that a felon with a firearm got five years in the fed pen no matter what.
Once again we have lightened up!
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Finally, the video surfaces showing how it all went down.
http://youtu.be/uW_lZx40MhQ (http://youtu.be/uW_lZx40MhQ)