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The Library => The SGA => Topic started by: AWK on January 19, 2011, 01:09:30 AM
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No pun intended...
Gov.-elect Robert Bentley intends to be governor over all, but says only Christians are his 'brothers and sisters'
MONTGOMERY -- Gov.-elect Robert Bentley in a speech at a Baptist church this afternoon said he plans to be the governor of all Alabamians and be color-blind, but he also said people who aren't ''saved" Christians aren't his brothers and sisters.
Bentley told a big crowd at Dexter Avenue King Memorial Baptist Church, where the late civil rights leader Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. once was pastor, that he believed it was important for Alabamians ''that we love and care for each other."
''I was elected as a Republican candidate. But once I became governor ... I became the governor of all the people. I intend to live up to that. I am color blind," Bentley said in a short speech given about an hour after he took the oath of office as governor.
Then Bentley, who for years has been a deacon at First Baptist Church in Tuscaloosa, gave what sounded like an altar call.
"There may be some people here today who do not have living within them the Holy Spirit," Bentley said. ''But if you have been adopted in God's family like I have, and like you have if you're a Christian and if you're saved, and the Holy Spirit lives within you just like the Holy Spirit lives within me, then you know what that makes? It makes you and me brothers. And it makes you and me brother and sister."
Bentley added, ''Now I will have to say that, if we don't have the same daddy, we're not brothers and sisters. So anybody here today who has not accepted Jesus Christ as their savior, I'm telling you, you're not my brother and you're not my sister, and I want to be your brother."
Asked later if he meant to be insulting to people of other faiths, Bentley replied, ''We're not trying to insult anybody."
Bentley's communications director, Rebekah Caldwell Mason, when asked about Bentley's comments said, ''He is the governor of all the people, Christians, non-Christians alike."
Bentley in his speech also told the crowd, which was celebrating King's birthday, that, ''I think that Dr. Martin Luther King was one of the greatest men that has ever lived."
''I appreciate what he has done for not only the African-American community but for the white community, because he helped everything to change, even though he had to give his life for it," Bentley said.
Bentley then said he would work to help Alabamians whether they live in Wilcox County, where many poor blacks live, or Mountain Brook, where many upper-income whites live.
''You know, (for) a lot of people, it's hard to trust a Republican governor," Bentley said. ''Let me tell you. I want to tell you today that I promise you that I'm going to do everything I can for everybody in this state."
http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2011/01/gov-elect_robert_bentley_inten.html
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:suicide:
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I don't agree with a lot of what he said nor am I a Baptist, but keep in mind where he said this. As long as he doesn't govern with this I'm ok with it.....freedom of speech, religion and all.
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''Now I will have to say that, if we don't have the same daddy, we're not brothers and sisters..."
Probably not the best venue to make THAT statement...
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Those silly ignorant Christians... God forbid he exercise a little of his 1st Amendment Rights... I mean, it's not like he hijacked a plane and flew it into a building or sumpin'.
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Those silly ignorant Christians... God forbid he exercise a little of his 1st Amendment Rights... I mean, it's not like he hijacked a plane and flew it into a building or sumpin'.
You are such a hypocrite. I'm so sureeeeeeeeeeeeeee you would be singing the same tune if it were an Alabama politician saying the same thing about his Muslim brothers and sisters.
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You are such a hypocrite. I'm so sureeeeeeeeeeeeeee you would be singing the same tune if it were an Alabama politician saying the same thing about his Muslim brothers and sisters.
Well there is that whole plane/building thing again.
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Well there is that whole plane/building thing again.
Yeah, exactly. It's ok if one guy does it, but if it were a Jewish or Muslim man. Oh noes....
However, that's not the point. The point is that Bentley is a babbling bible thumper who is shoving his religion in peoples faces. You aren't his brother if you aren't saved. Best convert now or you might not get represented by him.
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You are such a hypocrite. I'm so sureeeeeeeeeeeeeee you would be singing the same tune if it were an Alabama politician saying the same thing about his Muslim brothers and sisters.
Hypocrite... My ass! It was an inappropriate venue for the statement, but he's entitled to his opinions/beliefs. Now, if he was a radical Muslim talking about his 72 virgins for killing infidels, that would be a different story.
Now, back under you rock...
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Hypocrite... My ass! It was an inappropriate venue for the statement, but he's entitled to his opinions/beliefs. Now, if he was a radical Muslim talking about his 72 virgins for killing infidels, that would be a different story.
Now, back under you rock...
Haha, you just proved my point. Good job.
It is a radical statement to say you are not my brothers and sisters if you aren't saved and Christian. I'm sure you would be like, "Ok, it's cool, this guy is just voicing his opinion.", if a politician who was a Muslim gave a speech at a Mosque saying you aren't my brothers and sisters if you don't believe in Mohammad and Islam. :taunt:
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Yeah, exactly. It's ok if one guy does it, but if it were a Jewish or Muslim man. Oh noes....
However, that's not the point. The point is that Bentley is a babbling bible thumper who is shoving his religion in peoples faces. You aren't his brother if you aren't saved. Best convert now or you might not get represented by him.
You know, he's got a good point. Maybe you should start thinking about your future as a brother.
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However, that's not the point. The point is that Bentley is a babbling bible thumper who is shoving his religion in peoples faces. You aren't his brother if you aren't saved. Best convert now or you might not get represented by him.
You might not like the rest, but your last statement didn't show up anywhere in his speech. He said that he would represent everyone. What's the problem? It was obvious the guy was a devout Christian before he was elected, he's saying things that pretty much any deacon would say.
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You know, he's got a good point. Maybe you should start thinking about your future as a brother.
Hah, hahahaha, wow. I might go to hell, but it won't be because I'm not Baptist and I'm not saved. Fuck, if that's the case, Heaven is going to be mighty empty.
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You might not like the rest, but your last statement didn't show up anywhere in his speech. He said that he would represent everyone. What's the problem? It was obvious the guy was a devout Christian before he was elected, he's saying things that pretty much any deacon would say.
Speaking of which, that is what pisses me off the most about what he said. It embarrasses the State of Alabama again.
People of Alabama: No, we are very nice southern state that is comprised of smart and not crazy radical christian conservatives. We can think for ourselves.
Bentley: See Above.
People of Alabama: :facepalm:
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Yeah, exactly. It's ok if one guy does it, but if it were a Jewish or Muslim man. Oh noes....
However, that's not the point. The point is that Bentley is a babbling bible thumper who is shoving his religion in peoples faces. You aren't his brother if you aren't saved. Best convert now or you might not get represented by him.
He was, of course, exercising his 1st Amendment right to free speech which he's entitled to do but it's this exact kind of public remark by a politician that has, in part, turned me completely against another (former) governor, Mike Huckabee. He talks a good line and is probably very personable to meet but to me he's just another closed-minded, bigoted, provincial hayseed when it comes to attitudes about religious beliefs and faiths other than his own. Huckabee made no mistake about how he 'feels' about Mormons when he was playing his fear-mongering games during the Republican Primaries (especially in Southern States where there are a lot of Baptists). He has since denied it at least once that I know of but it was very clear that's what he was doing to Romney.
This guy seems to be no different in his attitude...probably thinks that the people who go to the Second Baptist Church of Tuscaloosa or the First United Methodist Church of Tuscaloosa are all going to hell too...in addition to the Catholics. He really should have stuck to speaking about the work of Rev. Dr. King and not try to proselytize.
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He was, of course, exercising his 1st Amendment right to free speech which he's entitled to do but it's this exact kind of public remark by a politician that has, in part, turned me completely against another (former) governor, Mike Huckabee. He talks a good line and is probably very personable to meet but to me he's just another closed-minded, bigoted, provincial hayseed when it comes to attitudes about religious beliefs and faiths other than his own. Huckabee made no mistake about how he 'feels' about Mormons when he was playing his fear-mongering games during the Republican Primaries (especially in Southern States where there are a lot of Baptists). He has since denied it at least once that I know of but it was very clear that's what he was doing to Romney.
This guy seems to be no different in his attitude...probably thinks that the people who go to the Second Baptist Church of Tuscaloosa or the First United Methodist Church of Tuscaloosa are all going to hell too...in addition to the Catholics. He really should have stuck to speaking about the work of Rev. Dr. King and not try to proselytize.
Completely agree.
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Haha, you just proved my point. Good job.
It is a radical statement to say you are not my brothers and sisters if you aren't saved and Christian. I'm sure you would be like, "Ok, it's cool, this guy is just voicing his opinion.", if a politician who was a Muslim gave a speech at a Mosque saying you aren't my brothers and sisters if you don't believe in Mohammad and Islam. :taunt:
Wrong again... My example of the radical Muslim statement advocated violence against non-Muslims. That's the difference, and that's what you, Rosie O'Donnell and the rest of "your kind" never seem to understand. You equate anything remotely Christian with the most vile and disgusting acts advocated and committed by radical Islam. Your gov was just talking about accepting his religion rather than killing non-Christians. While innappropriate for the venue, the messages are completely different.
Yeah, exactly. It's ok if one guy does it, but if it were a Jewish or Muslim man. Oh noes....
Actually, Jewish and Muslim politicians and leaders do similar all of the time. You just don't have much exposure to it living in Alabama. And by the way, a lot of cities and states are far less sensitive to it as well.
Speaking of which, that is what pisses me off the most about what he said. It embarrasses the State of Alabama again.
People of Alabama: No, we are very nice southern state that is comprised of smart and not crazy radical christian conservatives. We can think for ourselves.
Right... There you go again. As if Christian Conservatives are incapable of thinking for themselves...
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I'm still failing to see the problem you have. Of course as a Christian he believes that only Christians are saved and going to heaven. It says in the Bible, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the father except through Me. John 14:6". If you believe in the Bible that kind of means that Jesus is how you are saved. Now to me (and most other Baptists) that includes pretty much all the evangelical denominations and most Catholics and Orthodox Christians. Which is better than what most Catholics believe (go and read up on what the Pope says about non orthodox denominations and their salvation).
So yes, that means that to most Christians that Mormons, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, atheists, agnostics, wiccans, new age crystal carriers are not going to heaven. Which is why Christians "shove their religion in your face", it's out of concern. Muslims feel the same way about their view on God, a lot of them just choose to proselytize with suicide bombers and threats, most Christians (I'm looking at you Westboro Baptist Church) got over that in the middle ages with the end of the Inquisition and Crusades.
Again, if a guys says he's a Christian and he gets elected and then talks about his religion what's the problem? If he say's he's a Muslim and then gets elected and says that he needs to schedule in prayer time 5 times a day good for him. You knew what you were getting when you elected the guy.
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I'm still failing to see the problem you have. Of course as a Christian he believes that only Christians are saved and going to heaven. It says in the Bible, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the father except through Me. John 14:6". If you believe in the Bible that kind of means that Jesus is how you are saved. Now to me (and most other Baptists) that includes pretty much all the evangelical denominations and most Catholics and Orthodox Christians. Which is better than what most Catholics believe (go and read up on what the Pope says about non orthodox denominations and their salvation).
So yes, that means that to most Christians that Mormons, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, atheists, agnostics, wiccans, new age crystal carriers are not going to heaven. Which is why Christians "shove their religion in your face", it's out of concern. Muslims feel the same way about their view on God, a lot of them just choose to proselytize with suicide bombers and threats, most Christians (I'm looking at you Westboro Baptist Church) got over that in the middle ages with the end of the Inquisition and Crusades.
Again, if a guys says he's a Christian and he gets elected and then talks about his religion what's the problem? If he say's he's a Muslim and then gets elected and says that he needs to schedule in prayer time 5 times a day good for him. You knew what you were getting when you elected the guy.
I certainly cannot speak for AWK; the only problem that I have with what the Gov.-Elect said (as emphasized by AWK) is that it was completely inappropriate to the occasion. Perhaps the venue stirred his faith. At any rate, there are reams of print and miles of video about the Civil Rights work of MLK that could have been commented on, referenced, praised, or criticized without going into a sermon. He should have used better judgment.
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Don't get me started on da bible colleges.
You know like Bob Jones University.
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Don't get me started on da bible colleges.
You know like Bob Jones University.
I've seen all the "Mother Jones" publications around Sani's place...he's an "angel".
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Wrong again... My example of the radical Muslim statement advocated violence against non-Muslims. That's the difference, and that's what you, Rosie O'Donnell and the rest of "your kind" never seem to understand. You equate anything remotely Christian with the most vile and disgusting acts advocated and committed by radical Islam. Your gov was just talking about accepting his religion rather than killing non-Christians. While innappropriate for the venue, the messages are completely different.
Actually, Jewish and Muslim politicians and leaders do similar all of the time. You just don't have much exposure to it living in Alabama. And by the way, a lot of cities and states are far less sensitive to it as well.
Right... There you go again. As if Christian Conservatives are incapable of thinking for themselves...
Through all of that crap, you never once admitted you would be ok with a Jewish/Muslim politician doing this...of course.
To the bolded above, "Go to Church or the Devil will get you." "Gambling is bad, it brings sin." "Drinking is bad, we don't need new beer." Etc... Etc... Etc....
I'm still failing to see the problem you have. Of course as a Christian he believes that only Christians are saved and going to heaven. It says in the Bible, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the father except through Me. John 14:6". If you believe in the Bible that kind of means that Jesus is how you are saved. Now to me (and most other Baptists) that includes pretty much all the evangelical denominations and most Catholics and Orthodox Christians. Which is better than what most Catholics believe (go and read up on what the Pope says about non orthodox denominations and their salvation).
So yes, that means that to most Christians that Mormons, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, atheists, agnostics, wiccans, new age crystal carriers are not going to heaven. Which is why Christians "shove their religion in your face", it's out of concern. Muslims feel the same way about their view on God, a lot of them just choose to proselytize with suicide bombers and threats, most Christians (I'm looking at you Westboro Baptist Church) got over that in the middle ages with the end of the Inquisition and Crusades.
Again, if a guys says he's a Christian and he gets elected and then talks about his religion what's the problem? If he say's he's a Muslim and then gets elected and says that he needs to schedule in prayer time 5 times a day good for him. You knew what you were getting when you elected the guy.
First, the above bolded attitude is my problem. To tell someone they are going to hell because they don't believe in the same thing you do is arrogant and ignorant.
Second, I didn't vote for him, but I was going to give him the benefit of the doubt...Then he goes spouting off shit like this. I don't care if you believe in the flying spaghetti God or Yogi Bear as your true savior...but keep that shit out of the political arena AKA your job. I don't walk into my office and tell my partner who is Mormon that he is not my brother because he is not saved. Separate religion from politics/work... Plus, the comment on it's face is insanely stupid and ostracizes a large majority of people.
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I don't care if you believe in the flying spaghetti God or Yogi Bear as your true savior...but keep that poop out of the political arena AKA your job. I don't walk into my office and tell my partner who is Mormon that he is not my brother because he is not saved. Separate religion from politics/work... Plus, the comment on it's face is insanely stupid and ostracizes a large majority of people.
Most people don't realize that Pastafarianism is a real religion.
I have to give you credit for using the word "ostracize". That must be a first for the X.
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I don't walk into my office and tell my partner who is Mormon that he is not my brother because he is not saved.
What is the main religion of middle Earth?
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What is the main religion of middle Earth?
Now THAT is a great topic!
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To tell someone they are going to hell because they don't believe in the same thing you do is arrogant and ignorant.
So you are saying that people shouldn't proselytize and share what they believe because that makes them arrogant and ignorant. But people should be "open-minded" like you are. So you think people should think and believe the way that you do? So that's different how?
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What is the main religion of middle Earth?
I've always wondered if robots dream of electric sheep.
And I still get headaches considering the question of whether or not Schrödinger's cat is alive or dead...or a zombie.
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Yeah....uh...what's wrong wit da' beer we got now?
It drank pretty good don't it?
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So you are saying that people shouldn't proselytize and share what they believe because that makes them arrogant and ignorant. But people should be "open-minded" like you are. So you think people should think and believe the way that you do? So that's different how?
No, I am saying that people who believe it's their way and no other way are arrogant and ignorant.
I think people should be open minded, yes. Do I think people should believe what I personally believe, no. Do I think people are stupid if they refuse to view other lifestyles other then own as even plausible and if you don't agree with them you are going to a bad place for eternity, Yes.
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What is the main religion of middle Earth?
One ring to rule them all.
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One ring to rule them all.
Didn't know they made cock rings that small.
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No, I am saying that people who believe it's their way and no other way are arrogant and ignorant.
I think people should be open minded, yes. Do I think people should believe what I personally believe, no. Do I think people are stupid if they refuse to view other lifestyles other then own as even plausible and if you don't agree with them you are going to a bad place for eternity, Yes.
Ahh. You have succumbed to the religion of Oprah, I see. You might want to look into being the gov's brother. If not, you just might be on your way <whispering> to a bad place.
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No, I am saying that people who believe it's their way and no other way are arrogant and ignorant.
I think people should be open minded, yes. Do I think people should believe what I personally believe, no. Do I think people are stupid if they refuse to view other lifestyles other then own as even plausible and if you don't agree with them you are going to a bad place for eternity, Yes.
I think we may be talking past each other somewhat; I just get riled up when I hear people bitch and moan about Christians (or any other religion) being close minded, when all too often the people bitching are really just mad that the religious people don't think the way they do on some particular subject. Which is just being close minded in the other direction.
Not saying that that is what you were doing, it was just my first impression.
And the people of middle earth were obviously Zoroastrians.
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And the people of middle earth were obviously Zoroastrians.
Not so fast. Can we get a ruling from the hobbit?
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Not so fast. Can we get a ruling from the hobbit?
Mormons are hobbits, Hobbits are mormons... It's science.
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Mormons are hobbits, Hobbits are mormons... It's science.
I'm confused.
What does that make Jehovah’s Witnesses?
The Kraken?
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I'm confused.
What does that make Jehovah’s Witnesses?
The Kraken?
They are the wondering ring fuckers who ride on their gay dragons handing out pamphlets.
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They are the wondering ring fuckers who ride on their gay dragons handing out pamphlets.
Why do the dragons always have to be gay in your stories?
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Why do the dragons always have to be gay in your stories?
http://getyourgrip.deviantart.com/art/Sam-and-The-Gay-Dragon-101336803
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You've become enraged by his choice of words and not his statement of faith. At least, I hope that is the case.
In our government, we are ruled by the elected and those who elected Robert Bentley are presumably Christian. I presume this because Robert Bentley is an outspoken Christian - always has been - and surely those who voted for him understood his platform and history.
Therefore, it is entirely plausible and acceptable for him to continue being an outspoken Christian.
Thoreau is one who states that the majority should look out for the minority; however, the majority does not have the obligation to change their stance and views in order to coincide with the stance and views of the minority. I agree with that statement, and I think that is how Bentley is choosing to govern.
It's not that he is hindering the lifestyle of those not of his religion, but he is attempting to satisfy the desires of his voting public.
His choice of words were weak. I'll definitely admit that. "Brothers and sisters" and "saved" and "holy spirit lives in me" are all common phrases from a particular charismatic group of protestants. It's jargon that does not bring in nonbelievers but rather pushes them away much like the original poster of this thread.
Consider if Bentley had said, "I am a Christian, and I believe only those who believe in Jesus will go to heaven. Therefore, I hope and pray that everyone associated with me and my governing district will one day believe in Jesus."
Would anyone really have a problem with that? Would that be wrong and intolerable?
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Oh - and everyone knows that Middle Earth practiced Gandalfism and were known as Frodo Do Birds.
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You've become enraged by his choice of words and not his statement of faith. At least, I hope that is the case.
In our government, we are ruled by the elected and those who elected Robert Bentley are presumably Christian. I presume this because Robert Bentley is an outspoken Christian - always has been - and surely those who voted for him understood his platform and history.
Therefore, it is entirely plausible and acceptable for him to continue being an outspoken Christian.
Thoreau is one who states that the majority should look out for the minority; however, the majority does not have the obligation to change their stance and views in order to coincide with the stance and views of the minority. I agree with that statement, and I think that is how Bentley is choosing to govern.
It's not that he is hindering the lifestyle of those not of his religion, but he is attempting to satisfy the desires of his voting public.
His choice of words were weak. I'll definitely admit that. "Brothers and sisters" and "saved" and "holy spirit lives in me" are all common phrases from a particular charismatic group of protestants. It's jargon that does not bring in nonbelievers but rather pushes them away much like the original poster of this thread.
Consider if Bentley had said, "I am a Christian, and I believe only those who believe in Jesus will go to heaven. Therefore, I hope and pray that everyone associated with me and my governing district will one day believe in Jesus."
Would anyone really have a problem with that? Would that be wrong and intolerable?
I hate Christians, praise Allah! :sarcasm: :bc:
I have a name!!! It's Toby.
I agree that what you wrote above would be a lot better than what he said, but it would still bother me. I guess it's because I don't think it is right for a person place to force or push their religion on others... Especially in a work setting or political arena. (In this country at least)
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I think we may be talking past each other somewhat; I just get riled up when I hear people bitch and moan about Christians (or any other religion) being close minded, when all too often the people bitching are really just mad that the religious people don't think the way they do on some particular subject. Which is just being close minded in the other direction.
Not saying that that is what you were doing, it was just my first impression.
That's exactly what he was doing... again.
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That's exactly what he was doing... again.
Actually, no. Reading comprehension is a virtue. See post replying to his. K.Thx.
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Through all of that crap, you never once admitted you would be ok with a Jewish/Muslim politician doing this...of course.
Actually, while you are always trying to paint others as the narrow-minded bigots, my sarcasm should have made that fact obvious... of course.
To the bolded above, "Go to Church or the Devil will get you." "Gambling is bad, it brings sin." "Drinking is bad, we don't need new beer." Etc... Etc... Etc....
That's truly enlightened... Must be your interpretation of the 10 Commandments. Thankfully, some of us don't live by your shallow interpretation.
Now... back under your rock.
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I think we may be talking past each other somewhat; I just get riled up when I hear people bitch and moan about Christians (or any other religion) being close minded, when all too often the people bitching are really just mad that the religious people don't think the way they do on some particular subject. Which is just being close minded in the other direction.
Not saying that that is what you were doing, it was just my first impression.
And the people of middle earth were obviously Zoroastrians.
My remark about Mike Huckabee being a close-minded, bigoted, provincial hayseed is limited to Mike Huckabee...and perhaps Gov. Elect Bentley (R-AL)...not all Christians.
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The Jews killed Christ.
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The Jews killed Christ.
I can't believe that someone went there with this topic.
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Actually, while you are always trying to paint others as the narrow-minded bigots, my sarcasm should have made that fact obvious... of course.
That's truly enlightened... Must be your interpretation of the 10 Commandments. Thankfully, some of us don't live by your shallow interpretation.
Now... back under your rock.
It was hard to notice the sarcasm with sounds of your fist pounding so heavily.
Again, you fail at understanding my comparison. You stated something along the lines of not all conservative christians are zombies and some can think for themselves. I, then, used a few of the countless number of examples showing that some (I personally think a large majority) don't think for themselves. Obviously, that doesn't apply to everyone.
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Actually, no. Reading comprehension is a virtue. See post replying to his. K.Thx.
So is honesty...
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The Jews killed Christ.
They taste a lot like chicken too.
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''Now I will have to say that, if we don't have the same daddy, we're not brothers and sisters..."
Probably not the best venue to make THAT statement...
Underrated post in my opinion.
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Again, you fail at understanding my comparison. You stated something along the lines of not all conservative christians are zombies and some can think for themselves. I, then, used a few of the countless number of examples showing that some (I personally think a large majority) don't think for themselves. Obviously, that doesn't apply to everyone.
I'm just trying to get this straight... In your words, a large majority of Conservative Christians are zombies. I see... More of that enlightened thought again... Truly amazing...
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Underrated post in my opinion.
Quite.
Points out the irony of what he said and where he said it.
The GOV should have stopped ended his remarks at "...I am color blind."
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Quite.
Points out the irony of what he said and where he said it.
The GOV should have stopped ended his remarks at "...I am color blind."
If you really are color blind then why would one need to say it?
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If you really are color blind then why would one need to say it?
Uncle Sani!
You ARE aksing all the right questions today!
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Uncle Sani!
You ARE aksing all the right questions today!
I'm getting all the common sense out before Saturday. No need to not do something stupid while in Auburn. It's like tradishun.
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Underrated post in my opinion.
Thank you, my dear. Seriously, it seems to me that he was trying to win over the crowd with some zealotry and offend all the mommas with multiple baby daddys all at the same time. The whole thing was a disaster.
I have no problem with a politician being any religion, as long as he does not represent his constituency based solely on his own personal beliefs. "My constituency is overwhelmingly pro-choice, but since I am a pro-life Catholic, that will dictate how I vote, even if it does not reflect the values of the people that elected me to this office." THAT is what makes me crazy(-er). People elect you to represent them - not make choices for them without giving at least lip service to their input.
So he can worship the Flying Spaghetti God all he wants, but if he uses that belief as the basis for banning the preparation and consumption of lasagne, I will take umbrage.
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I'm getting all the common sense out before Saturday. No need to not do something stupid while in Auburn. It's like tradishun.
That's fine - I will make sure to have bail money at the ready.
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I'm just trying to get this straight... In your words, a large majority of Conservative Christians are zombies. I see... More of that enlightened thought again... Truly amazing...
Thanks!
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Thank you, my dear. Seriously, it seems to me that he was trying to win over the crowd with some zealotry and offend all the mommas with multiple baby daddys all at the same time. The whole thing was a disaster.
I have no problem with a politician being any religion, as long as he does not represent his constituency based solely on his own personal beliefs. "My constituency is overwhelmingly pro-choice, but since I am a pro-life Catholic, that will dictate how I vote, even if it does not reflect the values of the people that elected me to this office." THAT is what makes me crazy(-er). People elect you to represent them - not make choices for them without giving at least lip service to their input.
So he can worship the Flying Spaghetti God all he wants, but if he uses that belief as the basis for banning the preparation and consumption of lasagne, I will take umbrage.
You're probably right with that presumption. No white politician can pull off that kind of religious zealotry on MLK Day like Bill Clinton. And he even has an office in Harlem and a big prop Bible with a prominent cross on the cover.
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go and read up on what the Pope says about non orthodox denominations and their salvation
Could you elaborate on this? I'm Catholic, and I can't recall any priest or pope saying that Non-Catholics were doomed to hell fire. Google wasn't much help except to reaffirm that I already believed.
From what I can recall, non-Catholic Christians would first go to purgatory.
For non-Catholics, it's a bit fuzzier, it's been well over 20 years since I had a formal religion class, and the salvation of non-Catholics isn't exactly something I stay current on, but I seem to remember if the person grew up in a society that didn't believe Jesus was the Son of God, it wouldn't be held against them.
Side note, I'm far from a perfect Cat-lick, and don't want you to think I'm attacking you or anything like that. Just curious what you have read/believe.
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Took me a little while to find it, it was something I remember reading when Ratzenberger became Pope Benedict XVI.
Basically he signed a document while Cardinal that kind of strongly hinted that the Catholic and Eastern Orthodoxy were the only "true" churches of Jesus. Probably not as strong as what I remembered (and put in my post) but was a sticking point between Protestants and Catholics.
http://www.beliefnet.com/Faiths/Christianity/2005/04/What-Is-Dominus-Iesus-And-Why-Is-Everyone-Mad-About-It.aspx
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I almost never post in this forum anymore due to GarMan's reasoning deficiency.
Pretty much everything I wanted to say on the topic has already been said.
I want to commend TarHeel for a thread on a social issue in this forum that I agree 100% with him on.
To elaborate on one point that was already discussed, it is amazing how people can equate "Think exactly like me as a Christian" with "Be open minded", as if the two are comparable. "Be open minded" is not at all prosthelytizing any specific beliefs. It's, in fact, exactly the opposite. It's not saying "I'm (Insert Religion or lack thereof) and you should be too" or "You should drink beer on Sundays". It's saying you shouldn't give a fuck about anyone else's personal business or beliefs.
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I think that one of my favorite comedians, Rowan Atkinson, as "Toby" (that's 'the devil' to those of you from Tuscaloosa) explains it best who gets eternal damnation. Well worth the three minutes of your time if you like British humour (there are very good zingers at 1:40 and again just towards the end after "atheists").
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91DSNL1BEeY
*edit: you may have to double-click on the damn video to see it at YouBook...or FaceToob...apologies.
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I almost never post in this forum anymore due to GarMan's reasoning deficiency.
That's funny... I feel similar about you.
It's always the same with you kids. Your "reasoning" capability goes about as far as the limits of your experiences, and your limited experiences are overwhelmingly obvious. Perhaps, your lives in Alabama only exposed you to some radical hick fringe of Christianity that plays with snakes and can't think beyond the scope of their weekly Sunday sermons, but that doesn’t mean that all Christians are like that. And, it really shouldn’t take experience to teach you that.
Look, we’ve done this dance before. You spew diarrhea from your mouths, categorize everyone who disagrees with you in the same “narrow-minded†hate group, and piss-off or alienate as many as you can along the way. It may have been fun the first few times to volley back-and-forth, but it’s just annoying now. And, it’s always the same thing in here anyway especially on this topic. Those damn Christians… Harrumph, harrumph, harrumph…
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That's funny... I feel similar about you.
It's always the same with you kids. Your "reasoning" capability goes about as far as the limits of your experiences, and your limited experiences are overwhelmingly obvious. Perhaps, your lives in Alabama only exposed you to some radical hick fringe of Christianity that plays with snakes and can't think beyond the scope of their weekly Sunday sermons, but that doesn’t mean that all Christians are like that. And, it really shouldn’t take experience to teach you that.
Look, we’ve done this dance before. You spew diarrhea from your mouths, categorize everyone who disagrees with you in the same “narrow-minded†hate group, and piss-off or alienate as many as you can along the way. It may have been fun the first few times to volley back-and-forth, but it’s just annoying now. And, it’s always the same thing in here anyway especially on this topic. Those damn Christians… Harrumph, harrumph, harrumph…
I don't think you are narrow minded, I just think you are wrong. ;)
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That's funny... I feel similar about you.
It's always the same with you kids. Your "reasoning" capability goes about as far as the limits of your experiences, and your limited experiences are overwhelmingly obvious. Perhaps, your lives in Alabama only exposed you to some radical hick fringe of Christianity that plays with snakes and can't think beyond the scope of their weekly Sunday sermons, but that doesn’t mean that all Christians are like that. And, it really shouldn’t take experience to teach you that.
Prime example. Show me where I, or anyone in this thread, said any of the ridiculous shit you're saying about every Christian, or snake handling, or anything like that. Keep building that straw man, as usual though.
I sure as shit didn't say it, because I don't feel that way. I'm pretty sure everyone you view as "Christian haters", have specifically stated that it they only have a problem with these my-way-or-the-highway Christians that use a political platform to condemn certain individuals to hell for not sharing their beliefs. But yeah, snakes and stuff...
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Prime example. Show me where I, or anyone in this thread, said any of the ridiculous poop you're saying about every Christian, or snake handling, or anything like that. Keep building that straw man, as usual though.
Here's a prime example... Although, I would hope that this is just a poor choice of words...
I, then, used a few of the countless number of examples showing that some (I personally think a large majority) don't think for themselves. Obviously, that doesn't apply to everyone.
OK... Splitting hairs... "A large majority" isn't necessarily "all", but my point is still spot-on.
I sure as poop didn't say it, because I don't feel that way. I'm pretty sure everyone you view as "Christian haters", have specifically stated that it they only have a problem with these my-way-or-the-highway Christians that use a political platform to condemn certain individuals to hell for not sharing their beliefs. But yeah, snakes and stuff...
Would you honestly say that first article in this thread was an example of the AL Gov "using a political platform to condemn certain individuals to hell for not sharing [his] beliefs"? His stupid comments may have alienated some folks, but to suggest that he's condemning people to hell would be a considerable stretch. Just sayin'...
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So I guess this means I won't be playing any electronic bingo for the next 4 years.
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So I guess this means I won't be playing any electronic bingo for the next 4 years.
:bugs:
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Proverbs 31:7, bitches.
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Took me a little while to find it, it was something I remember reading when Ratzenberger became Pope Benedict XVI.
Basically he signed a document while Cardinal that kind of strongly hinted that the Catholic and Eastern Orthodoxy were the only "true" churches of Jesus. Probably not as strong as what I remembered (and put in my post) but was a sticking point between Protestants and Catholics.
http://www.beliefnet.com/Faiths/Christianity/2005/04/What-Is-Dominus-Iesus-And-Why-Is-Everyone-Mad-About-It.aspx
The original Holy Catholic church originating from Jesus Christ is not the same as the Roman Catholic Church today. I don't really want to get into any more detail there, but they are not the same.
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The original Holy Catholic church originating from Jesus Christ is not the same as the Roman Catholic Church today. I don't really want to get into any more detail there, but they are not the same.
If you really want some interesting reading, go out on the net and find all you can about the origination of Catholic and Protestant church beginnings. Many religions were born from a government trying to control the people. It's very shady as to the true evolution of what we see today.
Read back to Constantine I (I think), I think that is where many claim it started.
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If you really want some interesting reading, go out on the net and find all you can about the origination of Catholic and Protestant church beginnings. Many religions were born from a government trying to control the people. It's very shady as to the true evolution of what we see today.
Read back to Constantine I (I think), I think that is where many claim it started.
Nonsense. I invented religion.
Constantine was the Debil.
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I've been saying for a while that we need a religious discussion forum.
:bc:
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Look, we’ve done this dance before. You spew diarrhea from your mouths, categorize everyone who disagrees with you in the same “narrow-minded†hate group, and piss-off or alienate as many as you can along the way. It may have been fun the first few times to volley back-and-forth, but it’s just annoying now.
Agreed.
Somehow we (not this board, but pretty much the world) has distilled everything down until there is no compromise anymore, no polite political/religious/whatever discussion. You are either pro-life or pro-choice, pro-gun or for complete gun control, right wing nut job or left wing commie, or think everyone is going to hell or nobody is. I get tired of discussions like this, which is why I usually don't do much more on this part of the board but browse through it.
There, I've said my piece and counted to 10.
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Here's a prime example... Although, I would hope that this is just a poor choice of words...
OK... Splitting hairs... "A large majority" isn't necessarily "all", but my point is still spot-on.
Would you honestly say that first article in this thread was an example of the AL Gov "using a political platform to condemn certain individuals to hell for not sharing [his] beliefs"? His stupid comments may have alienated some folks, but to suggest that he's condemning people to hell would be a considerable stretch. Just sayin'...
Yeah, that doesn't work. I said some of them don't think for themselves... Would you argue with that? Of course not...
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Yeah, that doesn't work. I said some of them don't think for themselves... Would you argue with that? Of course not...
Actually, you did say "a large majority"...
I, then, used a few of the countless number of examples showing that some (I personally think a large majority) don't think for themselves.
... but, that was just your subconscious internal voice. You didn't mean to type that "out loud".
Um... I'm moving on... I need logical/rational discourse. This "I said... He said... I meant... I really meant" isn't working for me.
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Actually, you did say "a large majority"...
... but, that was just your subconscious internal voice. You didn't mean to type that "out loud".
Um... I'm moving on... I need logical/rational discourse. This "I said... He said... I meant... I really meant" isn't working for me.
I know what I said captain obvious... And I stand by it. I think a large number of southern Baptists, who attend church regularly, do what they are told...
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I think a large number of southern Baptists, who attend church regularly, do what they are told...
I know all the women I have known that were Baptist did not protest when told what to do.
just sayin'
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I know all the women I have known that were Baptist did not protest when told what to do.
just sayin'
See, it's science proven by Saniflush.
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See, it's science proven by Saniflush.
It's science baby.
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I know all the women I have known that were Baptist did not protest when told what to do.
just sayin'
GHB is a helluva drug.
Or is that cocaine?
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Agreed.
Somehow we (not this board, but pretty much the world) has distilled everything down until there is no compromise anymore, no polite political/religious/whatever discussion. You are either pro-life or pro-choice, pro-gun or for complete gun control, right wing nut job or left wing commie, or think everyone is going to hell or nobody is. I get tired of discussions like this, which is why I usually don't do much more on this part of the board but browse through it.
There, I've said my piece and counted to 10.
This X1000
It's either/or.....
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Or is that cocaine?
They were my supplier.
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I know what I said captain obvious... And I stand by it. I think a large number of southern Baptists, who attend church regularly, do what they are told...
Well then go screw yourself. I'm Southern Baptist and I don't think you know s**t. I teach a Sunday school class and I've had my doubts about the validity of Christianity, especially in college, but decided for myself that there is no doubt there is a creator God and that Jesus is his son. And by judging on the discussions I have had in my Sunday School class I am in the majority in my thinking. We have had discussions in our class and our men's group about whether there should be prayer in school (for the record, it was more against than for, most of us thought that no prayer was better than the prayers that some nutjob public school teacher would come up with), whether abortion should be abolished entirely, left open, or only in certain cases. We don't get told who to vote for during sermons, we don't picket abortion clinics, or anything else you probably think of when you think Southern and Baptist.
Lumping everyone together like that is really no different than saying black people are evil because most of the inmates in this country are black. Or that all southerners are racist because of the ones you see on Jerry Springer. Or that all bammers are toothless and inbred because....well some stereotypes are justified.
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Well then go screw yourself. I'm Southern Baptist and I don't think you know s**t. I teach a Sunday school class and I've had my doubts about the validity of Christianity, especially in college, but decided for myself that there is no doubt there is a creator God and that Jesus is his son. And by judging on the discussions I have had in my Sunday School class I am in the majority in my thinking. We have had discussions in our class and our men's group about whether there should be prayer in school (for the record, it was more against than for, most of us thought that no prayer was better than the prayers that some nutjob public school teacher would come up with), whether abortion should be abolished entirely, left open, or only in certain cases. We don't get told who to vote for during sermons, we don't picket abortion clinics, or anything else you probably think of when you think Southern and Baptist.
Lumping everyone together like that is really no different than saying black people are evil because most of the inmates in this country are black. Or that all southerners are racist because of the ones you see on Jerry Springer. Or that all bammers are toothless and inbred because....well some stereotypes are justified.
www.godhatesfags.com/
Just fuelin'.
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www.godhatesfags.com/
Just fuelin'.
They're independent baptists. They just do what they are told.
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They're independent baptists. They just do what they are told.
I'm fucking with Garman, but if you want to join in as well... Jesus was a Jew.
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I know what I said captain obvious... And I stand by it. I think a large number of southern Baptists, who attend church regularly, do what they are told...
Well, this is an emotionally charged issue.
I do not mean this comment as a criticism of Baptists.
I think that this supposition (see emphasis above) is not limited just to religious doctrine. Admittedly anecdotal in my experience I think it's endemic in the general population of America today. It's much easier to let someone tell you what to think on a given matter than to use the brain and cognitive thought process given to you by God to determine for yourself what to think.
And I'd add that it's even easier to 'feel'; that is, use emotions as your basis, rather than reasoning which GarMan might say is a very beta thing to do.
As for me I'm still not sure if Schrödinger's cat is alive or dead...
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Well, this is an emotionally charged issue.
I do not mean this comment as a criticism of Baptists.
I think that this supposition (see emphasis above) is not limited just to religious doctrine. Admittedly anecdotal in my experience I think it's endemic in the general population of America today. It's much easier to let someone tell you what to think on a given matter than to use the brain and cognitive thought process given to you by God fate to determine for yourself what to think.
And I'd add that it's even easier to 'feel'; that is, use emotions as your basis, rather than reasoning which GarMan might say is a very beta thing to do.
As for me I'm still not sure if Schrödinger's cat is alive or dead...
I fixed it so as to cover everyone.
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If you really want some interesting reading, go out on the net and find all you can about the origination of Catholic and Protestant church beginnings. Many religions were born from a government trying to control the people. It's very shady as to the true evolution of what we see today.
Read back to Constantine I (I think), I think that is where many claim it started.
correct. A lot of what you said is what I mean. The current ROMAN catholic church is controlled by another mortal man VIA the Vatican, to be a go between for man to st peter. Starting with constantine in the 4th century it became very govt influenced and became a state religion. This is really when it got away from being the holy catholic church. It became very politically motivated. To the point where the Romans were even changing things out of the bible. I.e. moving the sabbath to Sunday officially. Sunday is technically the 1st day of the week. I'm not a seventh day Adventist, just saying. I know a lot of this because I WAS Catholic. I am not anymore. I just can't go along with a lot of these govt'al liberties Rome has taken over the years that have no basis in the Bible. Anywhere.
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That piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah.
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I'm phuking with Garman, but if you want to join in as well... Jesus was a Jew.
You've already lost me, Scabbycrotch. Conservative Christians... Southern Baptists... Narrow-minded... Can't think for themselves... Whatever... Like I said before, just spewing more diarrhea from da mouf...
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That piece of halibut was good enough for Jehovah.
Where's my fake beard and rocks?
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Where's my fake beard and rocks?
:bc:
He's watching you...
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You've already lost me, Scabbycrotch. Conservative Christians... Southern Baptists... Narrow-minded... Can't think for themselves... Whatever... Like I said before, just spewing more diarrhea from da mouf...
You no love me?
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You no love me?
Now, don't get all clingy on me. Damn...
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Now, don't get all clingy on me. Damn...
:(
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BTW. Does the "H" stand for Herbert? That's what I have always been told.
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BTW. Does the "H" stand for Herbert? That's what I have always been told.
Henry. It's anglicized!
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Are there any women here today?
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Are there any women here today?
Taylor's been responding to posts...
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Taylor's been responding to posts...
BOOM goes the dynamite.
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In the vein of offending everybody... I would think that the "do as they are told" would apply to any group of organized people who are led by a charismatic person... and who, by lack of mental capacity or a "go along to get along" mentality or some other defect of character, will be led like lambs to the slaughter rather than challenge the status quo.
Jim Jones
David Koresh
Those freaky Comet people
Those fucked up Jonesboro church people
I am Christian, I believe in God, but despite being immersed (haha) in it since infancy, including attendance at a Baptist college, I no longer identify with the Southern Baptist theology because I refused to go along with and wholesale accept certain of their proclamations on social issues. Their treatment of women and other minorities, as well as gays, pushed me away. I guess I don't like ANYONE telling me what I will and will not be allowed to believe or do or say if I am to be an accepted part of the group, whether it be a Baptist preacher or a Catholic Pope or Priestess Miriam down in NOLA off Rampart Street. I am a grown woman, and while I am willing to accept guidance from those more learned in theology, I will make my own decisions as to my relationship with God and living my own life, thankyouverymuch.
That just happens to be my story - I am sure the Methodists, while slightly less self-righteous, have their own issues. I go to a Methodist church right now and holy smokes, they are money grubbing and try overly hard not to offend anyone - the polar opposite extreme of the hellfire Baptists i grew up around. My church built a columbarium ON PREMISE right outside the sanctuary so you can sit during church and look out the window knowing that dead people are buried RIGHT THERE - for a small fee, mind you, plus that yearly maintenance fee to clean the bird shit off your plaque in the ground for all eternity. Just... wow.
So, IMO, anyone who surrenders their critical thinking and reasoning skills in the name of theology or any other -ology or -ism is giving up their personal identity in the name of the group identity, and I have a hard time with that.
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In the vein of offending everybody... I would think that the "do as they are told" would apply to any group of organized people who are led by a charismatic person... and who, by lack of mental capacity or a "go along to get along" mentality or some other defect of character, will be led like lambs to the slaughter rather than challenge the status quo.
Jim Jones
David Koresh
Those freaky Comet people
Those fucked up Jonesboro church people
I am Christian, I believe in God, but despite being immersed (haha) in it since infancy, including attendance at a Baptist college, I no longer identify with the Southern Baptist theology because I refused to go along with and wholesale accept certain of their proclamations on social issues. Their treatment of women and other minorities, as well as gays, pushed me away. I guess I don't like ANYONE telling me what I will and will not be allowed to believe or do or say if I am to be an accepted part of the group, whether it be a Baptist preacher or a Catholic Pope or Priestess Miriam down in NOLA off Rampart Street. I am a grown woman, and while I am willing to accept guidance from those more learned in theology, I will make my own decisions as to my relationship with God and living my own life, thankyouverymuch.
That just happens to be my story - I am sure the Methodists, while slightly less self-righteous, have their own issues. I go to a Methodist church right now and holy smokes, they are money grubbing and try overly hard not to offend anyone - the polar opposite extreme of the hellfire Baptists i grew up around. My church built a columbarium ON PREMISE right outside the sanctuary so you can sit during church and look out the window knowing that dead people are buried RIGHT THERE - for a small fee, mind you, plus that yearly maintenance fee to clean the bird shit off your plaque in the ground for all eternity. Just... wow.
So, IMO, anyone who surrenders their critical thinking and reasoning skills in the name of theology or any other -ology or -ism is giving up their personal identity in the name of the group identity, and I have a hard time with that.
I'm also UMC now tw. Have been a member for a while now. I don't agree 100% with them but its as close as ill get I think. You are right. The money grubbing has gotten insane. I also don't like the way many churches have perpetuated the tithing myth through the generations using guilt to get monetary gain.
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Taylor's been responding to posts...
That's very Un-Christian like of you.
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In the vein of offending everybody... I would think that the "do as they are told" would apply to any group of organized people who are led by a charismatic person... and who, by lack of mental capacity or a "go along to get along" mentality or some other defect of character, will be led like lambs to the slaughter rather than challenge the status quo.
Jim Jones
David Koresh
Those freaky Comet people
Those fucked up Jonesboro church people
I am Christian, I believe in God, but despite being immersed (haha) in it since infancy, including attendance at a Baptist college, I no longer identify with the Southern Baptist theology because I refused to go along with and wholesale accept certain of their proclamations on social issues. Their treatment of women and other minorities, as well as gays, pushed me away. I guess I don't like ANYONE telling me what I will and will not be allowed to believe or do or say if I am to be an accepted part of the group, whether it be a Baptist preacher or a Catholic Pope or Priestess Miriam down in NOLA off Rampart Street. I am a grown woman, and while I am willing to accept guidance from those more learned in theology, I will make my own decisions as to my relationship with God and living my own life, thankyouverymuch.
That just happens to be my story - I am sure the Methodists, while slightly less self-righteous, have their own issues. I go to a Methodist church right now and holy smokes, they are money grubbing and try overly hard not to offend anyone - the polar opposite extreme of the hellfire Baptists i grew up around. My church built a columbarium ON PREMISE right outside the sanctuary so you can sit during church and look out the window knowing that dead people are buried RIGHT THERE - for a small fee, mind you, plus that yearly maintenance fee to clean the bird shit off your plaque in the ground for all eternity. Just... wow.
So, IMO, anyone who surrenders their critical thinking and reasoning skills in the name of theology or any other -ology or -ism is giving up their personal identity in the name of the group identity, and I have a hard time with that.
I agree, I was just targeting the southern Baptists because that is what Bentley is affiliated with...plus, Garman's mangina hamburger bleeds profusely when you discuss baptists.
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In the vein of offending everybody... I would think that the "do as they are told" would apply to any group of organized people who are led by a charismatic person... and who, by lack of mental capacity or a "go along to get along" mentality or some other defect of character, will be led like lambs to the slaughter rather than challenge the status quo.
Jim Jones
David Koresh
Those freaky Comet people
Those fucked up Jonesboro church people
I am Christian, I believe in God, but despite being immersed (haha) in it since infancy, including attendance at a Baptist college, I no longer identify with the Southern Baptist theology because I refused to go along with and wholesale accept certain of their proclamations on social issues. Their treatment of women and other minorities, as well as gays, pushed me away. I guess I don't like ANYONE telling me what I will and will not be allowed to believe or do or say if I am to be an accepted part of the group, whether it be a Baptist preacher or a Catholic Pope or Priestess Miriam down in NOLA off Rampart Street. I am a grown woman, and while I am willing to accept guidance from those more learned in theology, I will make my own decisions as to my relationship with God and living my own life, thankyouverymuch.
That just happens to be my story - I am sure the Methodists, while slightly less self-righteous, have their own issues. I go to a Methodist church right now and holy smokes, they are money grubbing and try overly hard not to offend anyone - the polar opposite extreme of the hellfire Baptists i grew up around. My church built a columbarium ON PREMISE right outside the sanctuary so you can sit during church and look out the window knowing that dead people are buried RIGHT THERE - for a small fee, mind you, plus that yearly maintenance fee to clean the bird shit off your plaque in the ground for all eternity. Just... wow.
So, IMO, anyone who surrenders their critical thinking and reasoning skills in the name of theology or any other -ology or -ism is giving up their personal identity in the name of the group identity, and I have a hard time with that.
Wonderful post.
I too have gone through a transformation of my religious identity over the past year.
I've grown tired not of the money-grubbing and the life-controlling, but rather, I've grown very tired of the show many churches try to sell in the name of Jesus. "Contemporary" church is now a product that is being pushed as the way, the truth, and the life.
The baptist churches I've attended have been the worst at telling me to listen to Chris Tomlin and Co, and by God, that's some of the worst music I've ever heard in my life. Don't tell me that's the only way to worship God through music.
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That's very Un-Christian like of you.
I'm sure you'll survive, Sweetpea...
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Wow this thread is still going........where is Weskey to give his input on religion?
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I've grown tired not of the money-grubbing and the life-controlling, but rather, I've grown very tired of the show many churches try to sell in the name of Jesus. "Contemporary" church is now a product that is being pushed as the way, the truth, and the life.
You're telling me - I live in Houston, home of Joel Osteen. A bigger load of touchy feeley horse pucky delivered by a bigger touchy feeley piece of horse pucky ye shall not find anywhere.
Now every church in Houston feels like they have to offer at least one "contemporary/praise" worship service in order to compete with Osteen and his "Everybody's Hands Go UP!" bible show. Even venerable institutions like Second Baptist and First Methodist have done it - gotta be "hip and happening" to get butts in pews and dollars in collection plates.
Creeps me out. Reminds me of the very groups I mentioned before - using charismatic means to sway a crowd into group think and mob mentality. Sit still and worship within yourself while those around you are gibbering in the aisles and knocking each other in the head with their flailing arms, and you are frowned upon. I truly wonder how much the participants of those services give into peer pressure and how much is truly worshipful behavior.
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You're telling me - I live in Houston, home of Joel Osteen. A bigger load of touchy feeley horse pucky delivered by a bigger touchy feeley piece of horse pucky ye shall not find anywhere.
Now every church in Houston feels like they have to offer at least one "contemporary/praise" worship service in order to compete with Osteen and his "Everybody's Hands Go UP!" bible show. Even venerable institutions like Second Baptist and First Methodist have done it - gotta be "hip and happening" to get butts in pews and dollars in collection plates.
Creeps me out. Reminds me of the very groups I mentioned before - using charismatic means to sway a crowd into group think and mob mentality. Sit still and worship within yourself while those around you are gibbering in the aisles and knocking each other in the head with their flailing arms, and you are frowned upon. I truly wonder how much the participants of those services give into peer pressure and how much is truly worshipful behavior.
http://ilike.myspacecdn.com/play#The+Vandals:Christian+or+Canadian:356331:s38266707.10419045.4715894.0.2.9%2Cstd_d6378bb64c0d40ad88b458448f413032
It couldn't be worse. From chorus to verse.
It sounds like Korn but a little bit worse.
Is it Christian or Canadian? Guess!
On 90.7 it's bad 311.
Evidently it's a hit. But it stinks to high heaven.
Is it Christian or Canadian? Guess!
Play the game that isn't fun, can't be ignored,
and can't be won. Someone get me a gun.
It sounds kind of emo, or not so tight screamo.
And he keeps saying 'Him', so i'm gonna say homo.
Is it Christian or Canadian? Guess!
He's wearing a sweater, like '98 Vedder.
But it's 2002, and the song could be better.
Is it Christian or Canadian? Guess!
Play the game that isn't fun, can't be ignored,
and can't be won. Someone get me a gun.
It's said that those that cannot do
will end up teaching stuff to you,
or some of them find God instead or better yet the border.
I cannot quite place it. It sounds like Ocasek.
But 20 years later, so you might as well face it.
Is it Christian or Canadian? Guess!
It's so non-commitish, like light Reel Big Fish.
Or rock en Espanol, translated into English.
Is it Christian or Canadian? Guess!
Play the game that isn't fun, can't be ignored,
and can't be won. Someone get me a gun!
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I've played in our Contemporary Worship band for years. I attend a huge Methodist Church here in Dothan and I think it has something to offer everyone. Yes, they push the tithing, stewardship angle pretty hard but hey, that's between you and God too. Otherwise, there's no pressure to live this way or that. Our pastor is a down to earth guy and his sermons talk straight to you in real terms about issues and struggles we all have. Relationships, work, alcohol, drugs, adultry, greed etc...
You attend, participate, hear the message and it's up to you if you want to apply it to your life or not. If some of you feel so "Pressured" to follow along like lemmings...I suggest you grow a set.
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I agree, I was just targeting the southern Baptists because that is what Bentley is affiliated with...plus, Garman's mangina hamburger bleeds profusely when you discuss baptists.
Nah... It's the Conservative Christian rants that chap my ass combined with the vague, shallow references to "most" Christians being narrow-minded, ignorant and incapable of individual thought. I do believe that some radical Baptist groups out there are just as looney as the extreme Left, but I would not insult all Chrisitians, all Baptists or even all Leftists by associating them to some extreme wacko group or collection of goofball beliefs. I'm surprised that you clowns still don't get that...
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You attend, participate, hear the message and it's up to you if you want to apply it to your life or not. If some of you feel so "Pressured" to follow along like lemmings...I suggest you grow a set.
Who have we missed? Have we pissed off the whole site yet? Come on! Don't stop until everyone posts a rant! We can do it! USA! USA! USA! :tits:
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Who have we missed? Have we pissed off the whole site yet? Come on! Don't stop until everyone posts a rant! We can do it! USA! USA! USA! :tits:
:soap:
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I've played in our Contemporary Worship band for years. I attend a huge Methodist Church here in Dothan and I think it has something to offer everyone. Yes, they push the tithing, stewardship angle pretty hard but hey, that's between you and God too. Otherwise, there's no pressure to live this way or that. Our pastor is a down to earth guy and his sermons talk straight to you in real terms about issues and struggles we all have. Relationships, work, alcohol, drugs, adultry, greed etc...
You attend, participate, hear the message and it's up to you if you want to apply it to your life or not. If some of you feel so "Pressured" to follow along like lemmings...I suggest you grow a set.
Until I get forced to pledge or give money if I wanna continue to be a member, I.e. consecration Sunday, etc. When over half the service involves money, I'm getting nothing out of it and you've lost me. I'm checked out at that point. The perverting of Christianity by many is exactly why so many have turned away. The dogmatic types Taylor is referring to are exactly those I am talking about.
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Who have we missed? Have we pissed off the whole site yet? Come on! Don't stop until everyone posts a rant! We can do it! USA! USA! USA! :tits:
ITT: Why the Tooth Fairy has it right, and the Easter Bunny can suck a dick.
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ITT: Why the Tooth Fairy has it right, and the Easter Bunny can suck a tool.
I was reading Tom Clancy's latest (not his best, IMO) and thought of you.
There was this lawyer who read a report from some soldiers in the field. Rangers. They'd been assigned a search and destroy mission in the mountains of Afghanistan and in the course of completing the mission they'd taken out nine Afghani soldiers. Some they capped in their sleep as they infiltrated a remote cave, searching for a bad guy.
This lawyer was offended by that. He worked up the chain to have the soldiers prosecuted for murder.
It may be a total mischaracterization, but that guy reminded me of how I think you see things. In his mind he was pursuing a utopian vision, a place where everybody plays by the same rules of left-leaning civilization. Everything can be accomplished with a carrot, there is no need for sticks.
I don't know what the character's name is in the book. I can't remember. I call him Chizloon.
Okay, back to your previously scheduled discussion.
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That didn't take long.
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That didn't take long.
Fish. Barrel. Bang.
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You are such a hypocrite. I'm so sureeeeeeeeeeeeeee you would be singing the same tune if it were an Alabama politician saying the same thing about his Muslim brothers and sisters.
Immediately going to the Islam as the go to religion was a poor choice. I would have gone with Mormonism or Scientology.
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Immediately going to the Islam as the go to religion was a poor choice. I would have gone with Mormonism or Scientology.
The scientologies...they are serious!!
(http://www.therealstevegray.com/wp-content/uploads/political-pictures-marshal-applewhite-heavens-gate-crazy-scientology.jpg)
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The scientologies...they are serious!!
(http://www.therealstevegray.com/wp-content/uploads/political-pictures-marshal-applewhite-heavens-gate-crazy-scientology.jpg)
This demotivational poster would have worked except for ----> Heaven's Gate ≠Scientology.
Otherwise, kudos for the throwback and I'll see you in 4385 when Hale-Bopp comes back!
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I was reading Tom Clancy's latest (not his best, IMO) and thought of you.
There was this lawyer who read a report from some soldiers in the field. Rangers. They'd been assigned a search and destroy mission in the mountains of Afghanistan and in the course of completing the mission they'd taken out nine Afghani soldiers. Some they capped in their sleep as they infiltrated a remote cave, searching for a bad guy.
This lawyer was offended by that. He worked up the chain to have the soldiers prosecuted for murder.
It may be a total mischaracterization, but that guy reminded me of how I think you see things. In his mind he was pursuing a utopian vision, a place where everybody plays by the same rules of left-leaning civilization. Everything can be accomplished with a carrot, there is no need for sticks.
I don't know what the character's name is in the book. I can't remember. I call him Chizloon.
Okay, back to your previously scheduled discussion.
I saw this picture and thought of you.
(http://www.michaelgruberlibrary.com/Cats/CatsVid/images/CatsVidGruber3a.jpg)
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I saw this picture and thought of you.
(http://www.michaelgruberlibrary.com/Cats/CatsVid/images/CatsVidGruber3a.jpg)
Well you certainly haven't honed your skills in my absence. Weak effort.
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I've played in our Contemporary Worship band for years. I attend a huge Methodist Church here in Dothan and I think it has something to offer everyone. Yes, they push the tithing, stewardship angle pretty hard but hey, that's between you and God too. Otherwise, there's no pressure to live this way or that. Our pastor is a down to earth guy and his sermons talk straight to you in real terms about issues and struggles we all have. Relationships, work, alcohol, drugs, adultry, greed etc...
You attend, participate, hear the message and it's up to you if you want to apply it to your life or not. If some of you feel so "Pressured" to follow along like lemmings...I suggest you grow a set.
You're absolutely wrong in your assessment of the effect of modern contemporary church services.
Church has become very much a cultural push rather than a venue for religious teaching. Theology is appreciated, but the music, the presentations, and the events are the selling points.
I know my opinion is influenced by numerous personal experiences (I too played in a worship band for almost 15 years), but I've observed enough to warrant making an objective assessment of the state of contemporary church.
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(I too played in a worship band for almost 15 years),
Which one are you?
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d58/saniflush/Stryper3370.jpg)
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Wow. Don't know what church you've been going to or why the in depth analysis. Contemporary worship is nothing more than an alternative to the tradional type service. It's more relaxed, no choir, more up to date music as opposed to singing the same old hymns and reciting the same old lines. The message is exactly the same as the one presented one hour earlier at the traditional service. Just a different atmosphere to worship in. There's no brainwashing, no "cultural push" or anything out of the norm. Same message in a more relaxed atmosphere.
Sure that in itself is a selling point, however, our church has literally exploded in membership and gone from 1 traditional service 10-12 years ago to as many as 5 per day. There's a type of service for just about everyone. I see absolutely nothing wrong with offering alternatives for adults, children etc in order to get them in the door. You can choose how you want to worship. Up to you.