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The Library => Haley Center Basement => Topic started by: Townhallsavoy on July 19, 2013, 02:21:09 AM
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I'm sure many of you (if you live in Alabama) have heard about the woman who left her 11 month old in a car seat in the middle of a July day in Alabama. If you haven't heard, a few hours after the woman went in to Genesis Nail Spa in Homewood, her baby was found dead in the back of the car.
The story is that she didn't bring her child to the babysitter and in a rush forgot to get the baby out of the car seat.
In my opinion, while the mother and her family have every right to grieve as much as they need to, the public response shouldn't be too compassionate. This is not a "It could happen to you" scenario. This is negligence to properly care for a child, and because of that negligence, the child is dead. She should face serious jail time in my opinion for committing a crime against another human being.
But if you look at (my) Facebook, you'll see quite a few people giving Mary Magdalene speeches and displaying their own grief for the pain this mother is going through. Again, I completely understand that this is a traumatic experience for her and it has already ruined her life.
However, being really really really sorry about what you've done doesn't excuse it.
There's more than just Facebook, though. Check out this article if you want:
Katie Luong is inconsolable.
She knows people blame her for leaving her 11-month-old daughter to die in a sweltering SUV. But no one - not one single person - blames her more than she blames herself.
"I want to tell everybody that I wish I was in that car seat, not her," the weeping 31-year-old mother told AL.com/The Birmingham News today. "If I had to die for her to live, I would have done that."
Gabriella Gi-Ny Luong, known to family members as Ella, was discovered by her mother about 1:20 p.m. Wednesday, still strapped in her car seat in the locked Lexus parked outside the family's Genesis Nail Spa. The temperature outside was about 90 degrees; inside the car it was roughly 127 degrees, authorities said.
Ella was unresponsive. Efforts, first by a nearby business owner and then paramedics, to revive her were unsuccessful. They rushed her to Children's of Alabama hospital anyway, where the staff pronounced her dead a short time later.
Luong, her husband, and a family friend Diana Huynh spoke with AL.com about the ordeal. They desperately want their privacy in this time of grief. But, they also don't want anyone to think they are monsters.
"Please ask anyone who knows me - I have never done anything wrong in my life,'' Luong pleaded.
Married for almost 10 years, the young couple tried for years to conceive. Success came only after their church family - the Vietnamese congregation at North Shelby Baptist Church - joined in collective prayer for conception for the couple.
They received the good news that Luong was pregnant one Thanksgiving. She had just graduated from UAB with a bachelor's degree in nursing and they decided on the name Gabriella, after the archangel Gabriel.
"I asked God for this baby,'' Luong said. "She was our gift from God."
The couple also opened their Homewood business about the same time of their daughter's birth, again choosing a biblical name. The long-awaited baby changed their lives. Though they were already active in their church, they became more so, to the point that Luong's husband started seminary.
"Our story is all about God," Luong said.
Both parents doted on the outgoing little girl. "She wouldn't even put her in daycare at church on Sundays,'' Hunyh said.
The Rev. Allan Murphy, senior pastor at North Shelby Baptist, agreed. "I can't explain what happened or why,'' Murphy said. "I do know they are loving parents who prayed to have a child and were careful in taking care of her."
"She was a conscientious mother and businesswoman,'' Murphy said.
On Wednesday, Luong put a sleeping Ella in her car seat and started the 10-mile drive to work. She was supposed to drop her off at the babysitter's house at 9:30 a.m.
But her mind was on overload - filled with thoughts and worries of a friend and employee who just recently hanged himself in a closet, only to be found there a week later. There was also concern for a close family friend, who is like a father to her, still hospitalized after having a stroke.
And in the midst of her worry and grief, she was planning Ella's first birthday party, set for Sunday at Oak Mountain State Park. It was too much, Luong admits.
"I had an uneasy feeling,'' she said. "I told my mom I felt like something was going to happen."
"She had too many things on her mind,'' Huynh said. "She was traumatized over her employee's death because she's never known anyone who has died, and there were so many people calling her yesterday about the birthday party."
"She was on the phone the whole time, and she said that cost her her baby's life,'' Huynh said. "She blames herself."
Unaware that she had left the baby inside the SUV, Luong went on with her day at work. When she arrived at the salon, she and her husband watched video on her cell phone from Ella dancing at their home the night before. "Music and dance was her passion,'' Luong said.
It was about 1:15 p.m. when the babysitter called, and asked Luong if Ella was sick and that was why she hadn't show up. It was then that the frantic parents realized what happened and found Ella unconscious in her car seat. "I want you to tell everybody I wish I was in that car seat,'' Luong said.
Instead of throwing the best-ever birthday party Sunday, the parents will bury their only child. The grieving mother said she can't even comprehend a life without Ella. She prays her faith will sustain her. "Without God, I am nothing,'' she said.
Pastor Murphy knows her pain, to some extent. His own daughter drowned 14 years ago while on a mission trip in Mexico. "I know what it's like for a child to die,'' Murphy said. "Little Ella is with the Lord in Heaven."
Murphy said no one can undo what happened Wednesday. "There's no rewind, it's not a dream,'' he said. "It's reality."
"She's beating herself up about it and I can't take that away either,'' the pastor said. "There was certainly no malice."
Murphy, friends and family are praying for understanding. "When you hear just a few details, you can judge quickly but it's different when you know someone's heart and hear their hurt,'' he said. "It was a tragic thing that happened. A human tragedy."
http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2013/07/mother_of_baby_left_in_locked.html
TL;DR - The mother was an outstanding woman who was involved in church and cared much about her faith and just finished up a nursing degree. This is a "the Lord Giveth, the Lord Taketh" tragedy so please be more understanding of their situation.
Here are some comments underneath the article:
This is a really sad story and I feel for the family. I can't imagine what this mother is going through. It is hard to look at the picture of this sweet angel and wonder how long she cried and what she was thinking or saying while she was in that car. I made a comment to my husband a couple of weeks ago about how I had a fear of forgetting something important and mention a story I saw on Oprah about a mother that was a principal that left her baby in the car all day. I have actually dropped my kids off with the sitter and looked in the backseat and panicked for a split second because they weren't there so I think we should not be so quick to judge this lady. It is a very terrible accident that she will pay for the rest of her life.
Very sad and tragic and I wish people would not rush to judgement!
My thoughts and prayers go out to the mother and to the family. I'm not going to judge this mother on her actions. About 15 years ago, I worked in a job where I was the boss, I was having a terrible day, things going wrong, employees constantly coming to me with problems, and I received a phone call from my 6 year old child's school that he had a fever and was sick and needed to be picked up. I said that I will be there within the hour. Then, more craziness kept happening at work, all kinds of issues, everything escalating and at 5:30PM that day I went home exhausted, walked in the door, and there sat my child, he had rode the bus home sick, no Mommy ever went to go pick him up from the nurse's office at school. I had not even thought another thing about that phone call until I walked into the door of my house and had laid eyes on my sweet child. I fell down on my knees onto the floor right then and there and broke down crying in front of my child. I turned in my resignation and never worked a job that was this demanding on my mind, and time ever again. It was my sign. I'm just saying, my prayers are with this family, because I got a second chance to change things before I made an even bigger mistake and to make a conscious effort to change my life and never let the demons of the hectic life that I lead ever get between my kids and me ever again. I pray for this family. I'm so sorry for their loss. But I know too well how things like this can happen.
My heart goes out to this sweet family who loved their little girl so much. Something like this could happen to anyone at anytime. I count my blessings that nothing like this ever happened to me. The more distracted we become by external pressures, social media, etc., the more likely terrible tragedies like this are to happen. This is very similar to texting and driving fatal accidents. The human mind is only capable of so much.
I wonder how many of the "it would never happen to me" crowd use their cell phones while they drive. That is a much more egregious offense, because one must make a conscious decision to do that, knowing full well it could cause a serious accident and kill their children, not to mention someone else.
One of the better ones here...
It is nice to see that there are some real Alabama Christians among those Alabama Sunday Morning Christians who do not understand the Word and have learned nothing except being StoneThrowers.
This young couple needs compassion and love and I want them to keep their faith regardless of the stonethrowers because their tragedy is also our tragedy, but as I said in a previous post, Baby Ella has saved many lives. So be faithful because the Lord os on your side.
There should be nothing but sympathy and prayers for this poor couple. It is obvious that this tragedy is their worst nightmare realized.
Please, please..... I beg you, All..... please do not rush to judgment against this mother. I know this family very well and Ella meant everything to them. I have no idea how they or any parents can recover from a tragedy like this. No amount of punishment anyone or any legal system could impose on her/them could possibly ever compare with the punishment they are inflicting on themselves. I cannot imagine their pain, guilt and grief. I pray for the parents and for precious Baby Ella.
I would like the mother to know that I do not and cannot blame her. It was a horrible accident. I am so, so sorry for her loss. Many parents have way too much on their minds and make mistakes or forget things. Many parents endanger or allow their children to be endangered at any age. You can read about it every day. Let he who is without error cast the first stone. RIP Ella.
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While I somewhat understand the "things happen" excuses being thrown around, this is YOUR kid.
The biggest thing that has pissed me off about the "aftermath" is the television reporters trying to help others from having this happen to them. They are telling moms to put their purse or their phone in the backseat with their kids, so they don't forget them. In other words, we understand that you may forget your kids...but we know you can't make it 15 minutes without your phone or your makeup.
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No excuse in this case. None. It's a CHILD!!
I hate society. Nothing is anyone's fault anymore. Always an excuse. No one takes responsibility anymore. :hulk:
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No excuse in this case. None. It's a CHILD!!
I hate society. Nothing is anyone's fault anymore. Always an excuse. No one takes responsibility anymore. :hulk:
This. That bitch should be put to death in the same manner in which she killed her child.
It's called RESPONSIBILITY damn it.
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This. That bitch should be put to death in the same manner in which she killed her child.
It's called RESPONSIBILITY damn it.
I'd have to say the greater punishment would be letting her live.
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This. That bitch should be put to death in the same manner in which she killed her child.
It's called RESPONSIBILITY damn it.
Could not say it better myself.
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I'm a hard line person typically, but I'm not feeling the wrath or rage here.
I've driven miles past my exit on the Interstate because I was thinking about something else. I've done the Raising Arizona thing where we got down the road and realized our daughter wasn't in the car, we just assumed she was. Had to go back and get her.
Can't say I'd ever leave a kid strapped in a car BUT... If the kid was asleep and totally quiet, if my mind was running with a million different things, if the car is like an SUV or something where you wouldn't obviously see him/her back there... I dunno.
The guy in south Alabama who put his baby in a sack and tossed him in the bed of a pickup? Yeah. Kill him slowly and painfully.
This lady clearly loved her kid and made a horrible mistake for which she will suffer grief unimaginable. Will charging her with a crime and putting her in jail bring that kid back? Will it rehabilitate her? Is charging her with a crime going to prevent anyone else from doing the same?
Seriously. What purpose would criminal charges serve?
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I'm a hard line person typically, but I'm not feeling the wrath or rage here.
I've driven miles past my exit on the Interstate because I was thinking about something else. I've done the Raising Arizona thing where we got down the road and realized our daughter wasn't in the car, we just assumed she was. Had to go back and get her.
Can't say I'd ever leave a kid strapped in a car BUT... If the kid was asleep and totally quiet, if my mind was running with a million different things, if the car is like an SUV or something where you wouldn't obviously see him/her back there... I dunno.
The guy in south Alabama who put his baby in a sack and tossed him in the bed of a pickup? Yeah. Kill him slowly and painfully.
This lady clearly loved her kid and made a horrible mistake for which she will suffer grief unimaginable. Will charging her with a crime and putting her in jail bring that kid back? Will it rehabilitate her? Is charging her with a crime going to prevent anyone else from doing the same?
Seriously. What purpose would criminal charges serve?
Maybe to get the next parent to think about there responsibility's to there children. Its time for people to face the consequences of their actions. Make her trial so very public, show her sorry ass crying on TV everyday. She killed( murdered) another human being.
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Maybe to get the next parent to think about there responsibility's to there children. Its time for people to face the consequences of their actions. Make her trial so very public, show her sorry ass crying on TV everyday. She killed( murdered) another human being.
Just don't see it.
Have to show depraved indifference.
Have to show malice.
Have to show intent.
It's not there.
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Just don't see it.
Have to show depraved indifference.
Have to show malice.
Have to show intent.
It's not there.
Last time I checked negligence is criminal. And she was negligent in the death of her child. I don't give a damn what her excuse is.
What you did with your story wasn't a crime nor did it lead to harm or death.
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Just don't see it.
Have to show depraved indifference.
Have to show malice.
Have to show intent.
It's not there.
Same circumstances but its your kid and its a daycare van coming back from a day out. Your kid falls asleep in the back and they unload the van and yours gets left behind. There is no depraved indifference,no malice, no intent. They just forget.
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Same circumstances but its your kid and its a daycare van coming back from a day out. Your kid falls asleep in the back and they unload the van and yours gets left behind. There is no depraved indifference,no malice, no intent. They just forget.
Do I want a day care worker to spend 20 years in prison for that?
No. I don't.
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Do I want a day care worker to spend 20 years in prison for that?
No. I don't.
This is out of character for you.
What if the worker was a young male named Travarious?
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This is out of character for you.
What if the worker was a young male named Travarious?
That's what I was thinking. Him and Chizad must be having a pic nic together today or something.
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This is out of character for you.
What if the worker was a young male named Travarious?
And served burgers with tomatoes?
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No Jail time needed.
But there should be forced sterilization. This person has proven that she cannot be trusted with a child.
AS a matter of fact, sterilization should be a plea option for many of these types of cases.
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This is out of character for you.
What if the worker was a young male named Travarious?
If he's wearing a hoodie? *BANG*
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No Jail time needed.
But there should be forced sterilization. This person has proven that she cannot be trusted with a child.
AS a matter of fact, sterilization should be a plea option for many of these types of cases.
So you feel that some kind of criminalization and punishment is needed?
We won't sterilize. We can incarcerate.
This story is one of the many problems associated with this new aged compassion. Rolling Stone publishes magazine covers with terrorists and articles on what outside factors led to their actions. Trayvon Martin sucker punches a guy and acts seemingly with the intent to kill a person, and the whole country is flabbergasted that the victim used a gun to defend himself.
We don't live with fear of making a mistake. We are complacent. As Buzz pointed out earlier, girls are getting the idea from our media to put their purse in the child seat because they'll remember they need their purse even though they may not remember they need their child.
We're allowed to live selfishly without any concern for other people and without any concern for consequences because most consequences are being excused.
You have a lot of literature and research starting to question why our prison system involves so many black males. Most of this progressive thinking doesn't question the reasons why black males break laws. It questions the law.
You have people questioning the social status of certain types of people. It's not that some people are eschewing education and hard work and playing the same game everyone else has to play. It's that despite anecdotes that contribute to proving otherwise, we excuse these people's attitudes and blame their problems on everyone else and then try to force those who are successful to provide a certain level of convenience for them.
This story falls right in line with that. She acted in a way that KILLED her child. That to me is completely unacceptable in our society. It should be seen as a horrific act that should not be tolerated no matter the excuse. It's not something I would do. It's not something you would do. This is not a cast the first stone case. If it is, then every single crime has to be seen the same way.
Don't have enough money to eat, so you go steal from someone else? That's okay. Cast the first stone if you're without sin, right? And surely EVERYONE would go steal at some point in their life?
Like Dallas brought up - what if the scenario were different? What if it's a daycare worker having a brainfart and your child dies? What if it's a pharmacist being too concerned about a phone conversation and you die?
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Maybe to get the next parent to think about there responsibility's to there children. Its time for people to face the consequences of their actions. Make her trial so very public, show her sorry ass crying on TV everyday. She killed( murdered) another human being.
You don't think the dead baby is serving that purpose?
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I'm a hard line person typically, but I'm not feeling the wrath or rage here.
I've driven miles past my exit on the Interstate because I was thinking about something else. I've done the Raising Arizona thing where we got down the road and realized our daughter wasn't in the car, we just assumed she was. Had to go back and get her.
Can't say I'd ever leave a kid strapped in a car BUT... If the kid was asleep and totally quiet, if my mind was running with a million different things, if the car is like an SUV or something where you wouldn't obviously see him/her back there... I dunno.
The guy in south Alabama who put his baby in a sack and tossed him in the bed of a pickup? Yeah. Kill him slowly and painfully.
This lady clearly loved her kid and made a horrible mistake for which she will suffer grief unimaginable. Will charging her with a crime and putting her in jail bring that kid back? Will it rehabilitate her? Is charging her with a crime going to prevent anyone else from doing the same?
Seriously. What purpose would criminal charges serve?
I agree. My wife and I realized once that we had driven half way across Atlanta with our newborn just sitting in the infant carrier and not buckled in. Could have been disastrous.
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You have a lot of literature and research starting to question why our prison system involves so many black males. Most of this progressive thinking doesn't question the reasons why black males break laws. It questions the law.
You have people questioning the social status of certain types of people. It's not that some people are eschewing education and hard work and playing the same game everyone else has to play. It's that despite anecdotes that contribute to proving otherwise, we excuse these people's attitudes and blame their problems on everyone else and then try to force those who are successful to provide a certain level of convenience for them.
http://news.yahoo.com/black-americas-real-problem-isnt-white-racism-070000529.html
In the aftermath of the acquittal of George Zimmerman, Eric Holder, Al Sharpton and Ben Jealous of the NAACP are calling on the black community to rise up in national protest.
Yet they know — and Barack Obama, whose silence speaks volumes, knows — nothing is going to happen.
"Stand-Your-Ground" laws in Florida and other states are not going to be repealed. George Zimmerman is not going to be prosecuted for a federal "hate crime" in the death of Trayvon Martin.
The result of all this ginned-up rage that has produced vandalism and violence is simply going to be an ever-deepening racial divide.
Consider the matter of crime and fear of crime.
From listening to cable channels and hearing Holder, Sharpton, Jealous and others, one would think the great threat to black children today emanates from white vigilantes and white cops.
Hence, every black father must have a "conversation" with his son, warning him not to resist or run if pulled over or hassled by a cop.
Make the wrong move, son, and you may be dead is the implication.
But is this the reality in Black America?
When Holder delivered his 2009 "nation-of-cowards" speech blaming racism for racial separation, Manhattan Institute's Heather Mac Donald suggested that our attorney general study his crime statistics.
In New York from January to June 2008, 83 percent of all gun assailants were black, according to witnesses and victims, though blacks were only 24 percent of the population. Blacks and Hispanics together accounted for 98 percent of all gun assailants. Forty-nine of every 50 muggings and murders in the Big Apple were the work of black or Hispanic criminals.
New York Police Commissioner Ray Kelly confirms Mac Donald's facts. Blacks and Hispanics commit 96 percent of all crimes in the city, he says, but only 85 percent of the stop-and-frisks are of blacks and Hispanics.
And these may involve the kind of pat-downs all of us have had at the airport.
Is stop-and-frisk the work of racist cops in New York, where the crime rate has been driven down to levels unseen in decades?
According to Kelly, a majority of his police force, which he has been able to cut from 41,000 officers to 35,000, is now made up of minorities.
But blacks are also, per capita, the principal victims of crime. Would black fathers prefer their sons to grow up in Chicago, rather than low-crime New York City, with its stop-and-frisk policy?
Fernando Mateo, head of the New York taxicab union, urges his drivers to profile blacks and Hispanics for their own safety: "The God's honest truth is that 99 percent of the people that are robbing, stealing, killing these drivers are blacks and Hispanics."
Mateo is what The New York Times would describe as "a black Hispanic" Yet he may be closer to the 'hood than Holder, who says he was stopped by police when running to a movie — in Georgetown.
Which raises a relevant question. Georgetown is an elitist enclave of a national capital that has been ruled by black mayors for half a century. It's never had a white mayor.
Is Holder saying we've got racist cops in the district where Obama carried 86 percent of the white vote and 97 percent of the black vote? And his son should fear the white cops in Washington, D.C.?
What about interracial crime, white-on-black attacks and the reverse?
After researching the FBI numbers for "Suicide of a Superpower," this writer concluded: "An analysis of 'single offender victimization figures' from the FBI for 2007 finds blacks committed 433,934 crimes against whites, eight times the 55,685 whites committed against blacks. Interracial rape is almost exclusively black on white — with 14,000 assaults on white women by African Americans in 2007. Not one case of a white sexual assault on a black female was found in the FBI study."
Though blacks are outnumbered 5-to-1 in the population by whites, they commit eight times as many crimes against whites as the reverse. By those 2007 numbers, a black male was 40 times as likely to assault a white person as the reverse.
If interracial crime is the ugliest manifestation of racism, what does this tell us about where racism really resides — in America?
And if the FBI stats for 2007 represent an average year since the Tawana Brawley rape-hoax of 1987, over one-third of a million white women have been sexually assaulted by black males since 1987 — with no visible protest from the civil rights leadership.
Today, 73 percent of all black kids are born out of wedlock. Growing up, these kids drop out, use drugs, are unemployed, commit crimes and are incarcerated at many times the rate of Asians and whites — or Hispanics, who are taking the jobs that used to go to young black Americans.
Are white vigilantes or white cops really Black America's problem?
Obama seems not to think so. The Rev. Sharpton notwithstanding, he is touting Ray Kelly as a possible chief of homeland security.
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You don't think the dead baby is serving that purpose?
No, people will grieve for the small child, they need to see the parent punished.
Note: I have no children and never have.
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So George Zimmerman left his baby in the car?
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So George Zimmerman left his baby in the car?
Little trayvon?
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So George Zimmerman left his baby in the car?
It was an Asian baby, so it's obvious the guy is a racist.
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Last time I checked negligence is criminal.
Criminal negligence is criminal, and is actually more akin to recklessness than mere negligence. Criminal negligence/recklessness might apply here, but I just wanted to point out that mere negligence is usually not criminal.
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Criminal negligence is criminal, and is actually more akin to recklessness than mere negligence. Criminal negligence/recklessness might apply here, but I just wanted to point out that mere negligence is usually not criminal.
Your world frightens and confuses me! Sometimes the honking horns of your traffic make me want to get out of my BMW.. and run off into the hills, or wherever.. Sometimes when I get a message on my fax machine, I wonder: "Did little demons get inside and type it?" I don't know! My primitive mind can't grasp these concepts.
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As Buzz pointed out earlier, girls are getting the idea from our media to put their purse in the child seat because they'll remember they need their purse even though they may not remember they need their child.
Meh...I get that any comparison between the importance of a purse/phone/whatever to a child is totally absurd. But I don't think that's the reasoning behind the tip.
No one is saying that a purse is more important than a child. However, a woman has carried a purse since her teens; meanwhile, she's only had that child for X months. Like it or not, if you've been carrying something around for years, you're probably going to have a higher likelihood of noticing its absence than something that you've been carrying for months.
We're humans. Shit happens. It's certainly more depressing and more serious to lose a child than it is to lose a phone, but to act like a human should be perfect when it comes to a child when we're imperfect creatures is a little unreasonable. We don't have the ability to achieve perfection just because it's a child we're dealing with and not a phone.
With that being said, I really don't know whether she should face criminal charges. I sort of side with Kaos, but at the same time, a death did occur and it was due to her actions/inaction. By the letter of the law, charges could be brought I guess, and in that sense, maybe they should be. Why let her off the hook just because she's sorry? Or didn't mean to do it? Doesn't change the fact that it happened.
But all of the personal rage against her for "killing" a child? It's a sad incident, for sure, but like I said, we're all human.
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Meh...I get that any comparison between the importance of a purse/phone/whatever to a child is totally absurd. But I don't think that's the reasoning behind the tip.
No one is saying that a purse is more important than a child. However, a woman has carried a purse since her teens; meanwhile, she's only had that child for X months. Like it or not, if you've been carrying something around for years, you're probably going to have a higher likelihood of noticing its absence than something that you've been carrying for months.
We're humans. Shit happens. It's certainly more depressing and more serious to lose a child than it is to lose a phone, but to act like a human should be perfect when it comes to a child when we're imperfect creatures is a little unreasonable. We don't have the ability to achieve perfection just because it's a child we're dealing with and not a phone.
With that being said, I really don't know whether she should face criminal charges. I sort of side with Kaos, but at the same time, a death did occur and it was due to her actions/inaction. By the letter of the law, charges could be brought I guess, and in that sense, maybe they should be. Why let her off the hook just because she's sorry? Or didn't mean to do it? Doesn't change the fact that it happened.
But all of the personal rage against her for "killing" a child? It's a sad incident, for sure, but like I said, we're all human.
It's like I think it and then you type it.
Does that make me want a cock in my ass?
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Criminal negligence is criminal, and is actually more akin to recklessness than mere negligence. Criminal negligence/recklessness might apply here, but I just wanted to point out that mere negligence is usually not criminal.
When it involves someone dying. No?
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It's like I think it and then you type it.
Does that make me want a cock in my ass?
I sure hope so.
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When it involves someone dying. No?
The fact that someone died does not affect how you acted or did not act. Either your actions were criminally negligent or they weren't. The standards don't change.
Again, I'm not saying that criminal negligence wouldn't apply to this instance...I don't really do criminal law. But I do know that mere negligence is not necessarily criminal, and that there is a separate standard for criminal negligence that is more akin to recklessness.
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The fact that someone died does not affect how you acted or did not act. Either your actions were criminally negligent or they weren't. The standards don't change.
Again, I'm not saying that criminal negligence wouldn't apply to this instance...I don't really do criminal law. But I do know that mere negligence is not necessarily criminal, and that there is a separate standard for criminal negligence that is more akin to recklessness.
You don't do criminal law but you do guys in the butt.
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The fact that someone died does not affect how you acted or did not act. Either your actions were criminally negligent or they weren't. The standards don't change.
Again, I'm not saying that criminal negligence wouldn't apply to this instance...I don't really do criminal law. But I do know that mere negligence is not necessarily criminal, and that there is a separate standard for criminal negligence that is more akin to recklessness.
Pre-med?
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You don't do criminal law but you do guys in the butt.
Now that's a lawyer that cares.
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Pre-medpubescent boys?
Yes please.
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The fact that someone died does not affect how you acted or did not act. Either your actions were criminally negligent or they weren't. The standards don't change.
Again, I'm not saying that criminal negligence wouldn't apply to this instance...I don't really do criminal law. But I do know that mere negligence is not necessarily criminal, and that there is a separate standard for criminal negligence that is more akin to recklessness.
I can accept that perhaps it's not deserving of criminal charges. What I cannot accept is the overwhelming amount of compassion for this horrific act of negligence.
I got really bogged down with work. My wife was cheating on me. My kids have the flu. My dog got diarrhea. I stubbed my toe. I had to get dinner ready and keep up with the laundry. The grass had to be cut.
Sorry everyone, I just plum forgot to see to my bedridden mother staying in an upstairs bedroom. I just feel terrible, so terrible, about those gaping holes known as bed sores and the gaunt cheeks from not eating and the stench of the bed being soaked in shit and piss and some puke.
Terrible, terrible accident, but it's one that absolutely cannot happen. You cannot fucking leave your kid to die in a car seat in a hot car and then be met with a horde of "It's okay. It could happen to happen to any of us. No one should be quick to judge because we all know we've made mistakes in the past!"
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Yes please.
Why are you profiling young boys? I thought you liked males of all ages.
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Why are you profiling young boys? I thought you liked males of all ages.
I do, but physically subduing grown men can sometimes be hard for a hobbit.
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I can accept that perhaps it's not deserving of criminal charges. What I cannot accept is the overwhelming amount of compassion for this horrific act of negligence.
I got really bogged down with work. My wife was cheating on me. My kids have the flu. My dog got diarrhea. I stubbed my toe. I had to get dinner ready and keep up with the laundry. The grass had to be cut.
Sorry everyone, I just plum forgot to see to my bedridden mother staying in an upstairs bedroom. I just feel terrible, so terrible, about those gaping holes known as bed sores and the gaunt cheeks from not eating and the stench of the bed being soaked in shit and piss and some puke.
Terrible, terrible accident, but it's one that absolutely cannot happen. You cannot fucking leave your kid to die in a car seat in a hot car and then be met with a horde of "It's okay. It could happen to happen to any of us. No one should be quick to judge because we all know we've made mistakes in the past!"
I have a sneezing/coughing fit while driving. As a result, I run over a child. Horrific incident? Yes. But should people refuse to show me compassion just because it's a horrific incident? I personally don't think so. I'm going to look at how and why the horrific incident occurred, and not just the fact that a horrific incident occurred, before deciding to show or not show compassion.
And while I understand that an involuntary physical act of sneezing/coughing is different from simply forgetting something, it's not all that different. Our brains have limitations. We get distracted. We get worried. We don't always focus on everything that we should be focusing on. Despite all of our good intentions to do, say, and think the right things at the right times, we don't always succeed. It's part of the nature of being human.
If a person doesn't take care of their mother because they're too busy daydreaming about big black cocks, I'm not going to have much sympathy for them. But when they're a new parent, an employee just killed themselves, and their life in general is hectic? I personally would show a little compassion. I'd hate to know that despite my attempts at doing the right thing to the best of my abilities, if I were to ever fuck up, no one would want to show me compassion for an honest mistake.
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I have a sneezing/coughing fit while driving. As a result, I run over a child. Horrific incident? Yes. But should people refuse to show me compassion just because it's a horrific incident? I personally don't think so. I'm going to look at how and why the horrific incident occurred, and not just the fact that a horrific incident occurred, before deciding to show or not show compassion.
And while I understand that an involuntary physical act of sneezing/coughing is different from simply forgetting something, it's not all that different. Our brains have limitations. We get distracted. We get worried. We don't always focus on everything that we should be focusing on. Despite all of our good intentions to do, say, and think the right things at the right times, we don't always succeed. It's part of the nature of being human.
If a person doesn't take care of their mother because they're too busy daydreaming about big black cocks, I'm not going to have much sympathy for them. But when they're a new parent, an employee just killed themselves, and their life in general is hectic? I personally would show a little compassion. I'd hate to know that despite my attempts at doing the right thing to the best of my abilities, if I were to ever fuck up, no one would want to show me compassion for an honest mistake.
Who names their kid up?
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Who names their kid up?
The kind of person who leaves their kid in a car and makes it easy for me to abduct them.
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The kind of person who leaves their kid in a car and makes it easy for me to abduct them.
Ima call him picked up
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Very sad - no happy endings at their Asian spa
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Very sad - no happy endings at their Asian spa
A little late, but nice.
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A little late, but nice.
Too bad he couldn't come up with this during happy hour. The barmaid was scraping up the change and the closed sign was on when he brings in a triple. Now we see why he couldn't make it in Vegas.
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The fact still remains that because of her negligence, her child is now dead. There is no doubt in my mind that she is sorry for what she did. However sorry she is, it's not going to bring the child back. Neither is stringing her up in a tree. The problem with this world today is that we don't hold people accountable for their actions or lack there of. As mad as it makes me that a child has died, (it makes want to hurt this woman) I don't think she should be facing the death penilty, but I do think she should be charged with a crime.
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The fact still remains that because of her negligence, her child is now dead. There is no doubt in my mind that she is sorry for what she did. However sorry she is, it's not going to bring the child back. Neither is stringing her up in a tree. The problem with this world today is that we don't hold people accountable for their actions or lack there of. As mad as it makes me that a child has died, (it makes want to hurt this woman) I don't think she should be facing the death penilty, but I do think she should be charged with a crime.
The line between negligence and an accident can be blurry.
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Wi tu hot?
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Wi tu hot?
Ho Li Fuk
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It happened again. This time it was a father that left the baby in the car. In the latest update, they've charged him with murder. From what I can tell, the Homewood mother was never charged with anything.
ATLANTA (CBS46) -
A 22-month-old child has died after being left in a hot car for more than eight hours.
MORE
Father accused of leaving child in car charged with murder
A father has been charged with murder in the death of his 2-year-old child after he allegedly left the toddler in a hot car for eight hours.
Police said Justin Ross Harris, 34, was supposed to drop the child off at daycare, but forgot. He then drove to work around 9 a.m. Wednesday and left the toddler in the car. It wasn't until Harris left work and started driving home that he looked in the backseat and saw the child still strapped in the car seat and unresponsive.
According to Cobb County police, the father of the toddler was supposed to drop the baby off at daycare, but forgot. The father then drove to work around 9 a.m. Wednesday and left the baby in the car. It wasn't until the man left work and started driving home that he looked in the backseat and saw the child still strapped in the car seat and unresponsive.
"It is tough, I am not sure how someone could forget they have a child in the backseat," Dale Hamilton said.
Hamilton said he was in the Akers Mill Square shopping center getting lunch when he saw the man drive into the parking lot, stop his car straddling two lanes of traffic, jump out and begin CPR on the baby.
"He hopped out of his car. I didn't know what he was doing at the time," Hamilton said. "But, he eventually pulled the child out of the car seat. I guess he was trying to un-restrain him. He pulled him out of the car seat, laid him on the ground and was trying to resuscitate him."
Hamilton said it was difficult to watch.
"He was constantly saying, 'What have I done, what have I done.'"
Some good Samaritans tried to resuscitate the child but it was too late. Investigators took the father in for questioning at the Cobb County Police Department. Police said the man had to be restrained at the scene because he was so distraught. At this point charges have not been filed. Police said pending the outcome of their investigation the father could face a charge of involuntary manslaughter.
Temperatures in Atlanta topped 90 degrees Wednesday afternoon. Temperatures inside a hot car could go as high as 130 to 140 degrees in a few hours.
Check back with CBS46.com for updates.
http://www.wafb.com/story/25812472/child-dies-after-being-left-in-hot-car?clienttype=generic&mobilecgbypass&utm_content=buffer17188&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer (http://www.wafb.com/story/25812472/child-dies-after-being-left-in-hot-car?clienttype=generic&mobilecgbypass&utm_content=buffer17188&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer)
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It happened again. This time it was a father that left the baby in the car. In the latest update, they've charged him with murder. From what I can tell, the Homewood mother was never charged with anything.
As the father of 4 year old I just don't see how you can forget your kid in the back seat. Especially a 2 year old.
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As the father of 4 year old I just don't see how you can forget your kid in the back seat. Especially a 2 year old.
I know someone who knew someone. One of those kind of deals. In LR, Arky. Man was supposed to take his toddler to daycare because the wife couldn't for whatever reason. I don't remember but I know that the man usually didn't drop the kid off.
Baby is asleep in the car seat and the man drives to work just as normal, forgets about the kid.
Kid stayed in the car all day and obviously died.
I won't say it could never happen to me.
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I know someone who knew someone. One of those kind of deals. In LR, Arky. Man was supposed to take his toddler to daycare because the wife couldn't for whatever reason. I don't remember but I know that the man usually didn't drop the kid off.
Baby is asleep in the car seat and the man drives to work just as normal, forgets about the kid.
Kid stayed in the car all day and obviously died.
I won't say it could never happen to me.
I imagine if they are your kid they probably hide in the back hoping for death, but I could be wrong.
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As the father of 4 year old I just don't see how you can forget your kid in the back seat. Especially a 2 year old.
Which is why it should be negligence at minimum. Murder though? Damn.
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Which is why it should be negligence at minimum. Murder though? Damn.
Murder's way too much. But negligence for sure. It's not different than forgetting your child hasn't eaten in three days. "I was so busy and I wasn't used to feeding him...."
It scares me that this turns into a debate. "It could happen to anyone!" No, I don't think so. I don't consider my son the equivalent of another bag that gets thrown into the backseat. Even though mine is 12 months, and even when he was just 1 month, I always talk to him and acknowledge he's in the car. I have my eye on him at all times when he's playing at home. Even if he's safe in his crib and I'm only a few rooms over taking care of something, I'll have the monitor on just in case.
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Murder's way too much. But negligence for sure. It's not different than forgetting your child hasn't eaten in three days. "I was so busy and I wasn't used to feeding him...."
It scares me that this turns into a debate. "It could happen to anyone!" No, I don't think so. I don't consider my son the equivalent of another bag that gets thrown into the backseat. Even though mine is 12 months, and even when he was just 1 month, I always talk to him and acknowledge he's in the car. I have my eye on him at all times when he's playing at home. Even if he's safe in his crib and I'm only a few rooms over taking care of something, I'll have the monitor on just in case.
We all have different names we call it.
He prolly really doesn't like listening to that.
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We all have different names we call it.
He prolly really doesn't like listening to that.
fap fap fap
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The negligent father is a bammer.
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Sad story for sure.
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Meanwhile, in Tuscaloosa:
BIRMINGHAM, Alabama - An Alabama man is charged with murder after authorities say he left his toddler son in his SUV for seven hours on Wednesday.
Justin Ross Harris, a Tuscaloosa native who goes by Ross, is being held without bond in the Cobb County Jail. He was booked into the Georgia jail at 11:56 p.m., jail records show.
The 22-month-old boy was strapped into a child car seat in the back seat of his father's vehicle. The temperature was 88 degrees outside the car at 4:16 p.m., according to a Cobb County arrest warrant affidavit. That was the time Harris apparently realized he had left his son in the vehicle all day, and pulled over into a shopping center parking lot screaming for help.
Witnesses reported hearing Harris yelling, "What have I done? What have I done? I've killed our child." Cobb police Sgt. Dana Pierce told the AJC, "Apparently he forgot the child was in the car-seat."
Harris is charged with first-degree cruelty to a child and felony murder. He is a 1999 graduate of Tuscaloosa's Central High School, and was formerly employed by the University of Alabama, according to his 2006 wedding announcement.
He graduated in 2012 from The University of Alabama with a bachelor's degree in Management Information Systems, and is currently a web developer for Home Depot, according to his Linkedin profile. He and his wife now live in Marietta, Ga.
http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/tuscaloosa_man_charged_with_mu.html (http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/tuscaloosa_man_charged_with_mu.html)
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Murder's way too much. But negligence for sure. It's not different than forgetting your child hasn't eaten in three days. "I was so busy and I wasn't used to feeding him...."
It scares me that this turns into a debate. "It could happen to anyone!" No, I don't think so. I don't consider my son the equivalent of another bag that gets thrown into the backseat. Even though mine is 12 months, and even when he was just 1 month, I always talk to him and acknowledge he's in the car. I have my eye on him at all times when he's playing at home. Even if he's safe in his crib and I'm only a few rooms over taking care of something, I'll have the monitor on just in case.
It's your first. Call me if you still do that on your second or third...
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It's your first. Call me if you still do that on your second or third...
Or in simp's case - 11th, 12th, or 13th.
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This guy did not murder his child. He did not do this out of malice or intent. He made a grave mistake and the unthinkable happened.
As a parent, there are times that things happen and you think, "Lord. thank you for taking care of us". This man got tangled up in the vines of life and made an unthinkable error. I'm not sure there is a punishment we have that will be worse than the torment of a parent that realizes they caused the death of their child.
Once again, sterilize the guy. He had his chance and botched it.
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This guy did not murder his child. He did not do this out of malice or intent. He made a grave mistake and the unthinkable happened.
As a parent, there are times that things happen and you think, "Lord. thank you for taking care of us". This man got tangled up in the vines of life and made an unthinkable error. I'm not sure there is a punishment we have that will be worse than the torment of a parent that realizes they caused the death of their child.
Once again, sterilize the guy. He had his chance and botched it.
Sense. He just made it.
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Sense. He just made it.
I'm so glad you opined here friend.
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It's your first. Call me if you still do that on your second or third...
I have two and I still don't see how you can forget one of them is in the car with you, especially after 7 hours. I think about mine constantly off and on through the day with their pictures being on the wall above my monitor, I would have thought "oh shit" within a few minutes of being at work. Not saying it can't happen, just question how, especially if you are the one that is taking them to daycare.
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I have two and I still don't see how you can forget one of them is in the car with you, especially after 7 hours. I think about mine constantly off and on through the day with their pictures being on the wall above my monitor, I would have thought "oh shit" within a few minutes of being at work. Not saying it can't happen, just question how, especially if you are the one that is taking them to daycare.
You have a desk where you sit on your ass and think. Those people who hit work running and go for 8 hours just do not think like that. It would be nice of you to acknowledge the little people too.
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You have a desk where you sit on your ass and think. Those people who hit work running and go for 8 hours just do not think like that. It would be nice of you to acknowledge the little people too.
Oh, you mean sit on my ass and think just like a little person at my IT job just like the one he had? My bad. I forgot how hard we work and hit the ground running all day. So go fuck yourself and your high horse attitude. I never said it couldn't happen and never said I didn't feel bad for the guy. Just said that I have more than one child and I could never see me forgetting I left them in the car for 8 hours especially when I am the one responsible for taking them to daycare.
http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2014/jun/20/ga-man-charged-murder/ (http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2014/jun/20/ga-man-charged-murder/)
The 33-year-old father, friends said, is successful at his IT job at Home Depot, where he works at corporate headquarters in Vinings.
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I hit the ground sitting for 8 hours.
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Just don't see it.
Have to show depraved indifference.
Have to show malice.
Have to show intent.
It's not there.
Agree
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This guy did not murder his child. He did not do this out of malice or intent. He made a grave mistake and the unthinkable happened.
As a parent, there are times that things happen and you think, "Lord. thank you for taking care of us". This man got tangled up in the vines of life and made an unthinkable error. I'm not sure there is a punishment we have that will be worse than the torment of a parent that realizes they caused the death of their child.
Once again, sterilize the guy. He had his chance and botched it.
Agree
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Murder's way too much. It's not different than forgetting your child hasn't eaten in three days. "I was so busy and I wasn't used to feeding him...."
Agree with first statement as to the case being debated but strongly disagree with the second. Far different IMHO.
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Agree with first statement as to the case being debated but strongly disagree with the second. Far different IMHO.
How so? How is this not negligence?
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How so? How is this not negligence?
I could write a tl-dr....
Its at BEST....IMHO....GROSS neglegence....a differernt level of neglegence...a higher level of culpability. At worst I think I could establish intent or depraved heart for not feeding a child for days. JMHO YMMV
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I could write a tl-dr....
Its at BEST....IMHO....GROSS neglegence....a differernt level of neglegence...a higher level of culpability. At worst I think I could establish intent or depraved heart for not feeding a child for days. JMHO YMMV
Fair point.
Still negligence. Still deserves jail time.
And I read today that they're searching his office for evidence. I hope the Homewood PD did the same due diligence for the woman last year who (accidentally of course) left her daughter to die in a car seat.
But there's also this quote:
"Much has changed about the circumstances leading up to the death of this 22-month-old since it was first reported," Cobb County Police Sgt. Dana Pierce told CNN. "I've been in law enforcement for 34 years. What I know about this case shocks my conscience as a police officer, a father and a grandfather."
Who knows where this case may be going?
Nonetheless, it's still sickening to me that almost 10k people have signed a change.org petition to drop the charges against this guy.
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Fair point.
Still negligence. Still deserves jail time.
And I read today that they're searching his office for evidence. I hope the Homewood PD did the same due diligence for the woman last year who (accidentally of course) left her daughter to die in a car seat.
But there's also this quote:
Who knows where this case may be going
Nonetheless, it's still sickening to me that almost 10k people have signed a change.org petition to drop the charges against this guy.
The DA is searching for a legal peg to hang the Murder charge on. Sesrch warrants served at his home and office. I suspect hoping to find drugs or some sign this was all planned. I was contacted by a friend of mine who is a friend of his. He has lots of support from those close to him. IMHO the DA is going to do hus best to make an example of him to all potential absent minded parents.
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Oh, you mean sit on my ass and think just like a little person at my IT job just like the one he had? My bad. I forgot how hard we work and hit the ground running all day. So go fuck yourself and your high horse attitude. I never said it couldn't happen and never said I didn't feel bad for the guy. Just said that I have more than one child and I could never see me forgetting I left them in the car for 8 hours especially when I am the one responsible for taking them to daycare.
Sorry. At the time, they only reported that he worked at Home depot. My assumption was the store, not corporate.
But then again, that place is considered a sweat shop from an IT standpoint.
Still, there must have been some serious crap going on at work or home to have him forget his child.
Has anyone heard from the mom yet?
(High horse. Funny. I work in IT and it gets busy at times, but nothing like working at one of the stores.)
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I hit the ground sitting for 8 hours.
Yep. You should see his hemorrhoids. They're horrid hemorrhoids.
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Still, there must have been some serious crap going on at work or home to have him forget his child.
And he was still negligent.
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And he was still negligent.
Yep.
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And he was still negligent.
Pretty much goes without saying doesn't it?
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We are all negligent in some things. I have no idea about this case and realize that it could be intentional. Still, I can see how it could happen to someone who is preoccupied.
I don't think that most doctors that kill their patients do it on purpose. I can't imagine this guy doing this on purpose. Regardless of what anyone thinks of him as a parent, to me the DA needs to prove intent before I can convict this guy of anything.
If dumbass mistakes are a crime, I'll bet you can dig around in the DA's closet and find some things to charge him with, just as with most anyone else. The only difference being that it likely didn't cost a life.
So, does the mere fact that it cost someone's life make it worth adding injury to injury? Unless they find something to prove he did it intentionally or that he was under the influence, I have to let the man walk. And if that happens, the D.A. needs to be disciplined for grandstanding.
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Pretty much goes without saying doesn't it?
Yes but there is a faction of people who think someone who does this should be absolved from all charges. Just because they didn't mean to or it was an accident for whatever reason.
Just because the preacherman absolved you doesnt mean the state of Mississippi isnt a little more hard nosed.
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Yes but there is a faction of people who think someone who does this should be absolved from all charges. Just because they didn't mean to or it was an accident for whatever reason.
Just because the preacherman absolved you doesnt mean the state of Mississippi isnt a little more hard nosed.
As a general rule we don't criminally prosecute people for accidents. In this state (Alabama) criminally negligent homicide is a misdemeanor. I'd be perfectly ok with that in this circumstance. Taking responsibility doesn't necessarily mean taking whatever punishment any and all want to administer. The punishment must fit the crime and the crime includes state of mind.
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From the GA Criminal Code...
2010 Georgia Code
TITLE 16 - CRIMES AND OFFENSES
CHAPTER 2 - CRIMINAL LIABILITY
ARTICLE 1 - CULPABILITY
§ 16-2-1 - "Crime" defined
O.C.G.A. 16-2-1 (2010)
16-2-1. "Crime" defined
(a) A "crime" is a violation of a statute of this state in which there is a joint operation of an act or omission to act and intention or criminal negligence.
(b) Criminal negligence is an act or failure to act which demonstrates a willful, wanton, or reckless disregard for the safety of others who might reasonably be expected to be injured thereby.
and...
2010 Georgia Code
TITLE 16 - CRIMES AND OFFENSES
CHAPTER 2 - CRIMINAL LIABILITY
ARTICLE 1 - CULPABILITY
§ 16-2-2 - Effect of misfortune or accident on guilt
O.C.G.A. 16-2-2 (2010)
16-2-2. Effect of misfortune or accident on guilt
A person shall not be found guilty of any crime committed by misfortune or accident where it satisfactorily appears there was no criminal scheme or undertaking, intention, or criminal negligence.
My take...the DA here is going to have a long, uphill battle making a felony murder case stick. Criminal Negligence in GA is a standard that is pretty near intent. Higher than civil negligence.
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So, a man or a woman tragically forgets their child in the car and the child dies (or some other accident) and we want to hang them.
Meanwhile, millions of women get a life sucked from their cooter and we do nothing but call it a choice. We let the ones choosing murder escape, while we want to hang the person that has been trying to be a good parent, but makes a huge mistake?
We are a sad society.
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I think both "sides" agree that it's criminal negligence, no?
I don't think anyone thinks this dude killed his kid in cold blood because he wanted him to die.
But I don't get the sympathy for him as if he's the victim.
His negligence resulted in the death of his own kid. It's horrible. It's tragic. It's terrible. And he shouldn't have fuckin' done it. No more excusable than killing a kid by running him over in your car because you were fucking around on your phone and plowed through a red light. I'm not saying give him the death penalty or anything like that, but whatever the appropriate punishment is for criminal negligence is, that's what this guy deserves. I don't understand why he's being made out to be a hero and getting all charges dropped against him is the faceboook cause dejour.
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I think both "sides" agree that it's criminal negligence, no?
I don't think anyone thinks this dude killed his kid in cold blood because he wanted him to die.
But I don't get the sympathy for him as if he's the victim.
His negligence resulted in the death of his own kid. It's horrible. It's tragic. It's terrible. And he shouldn't have fuckin' done it. No more excusable than killing a kid by running him over in your car because you were fucking around on your phone and plowed through a red light. I'm not saying give him the death penalty or anything like that, but whatever the appropriate punishment is for criminal negligence is, that's what this guy deserves. I don't understand why he's being made out to be a hero and getting all charges dropped against him is the faceboook cause dejour.
Well. somebody already stated that criminally negligent homicide is a misdemeanor.
Is that acceptable?
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I think both "sides" agree that it's criminal negligence, no?
I don't think anyone thinks this dude killed his kid in cold blood because he wanted him to die.
But I don't get the sympathy for him as if he's the victim.
His negligence resulted in the death of his own kid. It's horrible. It's tragic. It's terrible. And he shouldn't have fudgein' done it. No more excusable than killing a kid by running him over in your car because you were fudgeing around on your phone and plowed through a red light. I'm not saying give him the death penalty or anything like that, but whatever the appropriate punishment is for criminal negligence is, that's what this guy deserves. I don't understand why he's being made out to be a hero and getting all charges dropped against him is the faceboook cause dejour.
Maybe I don't understand the legal aspect of it, nor do I care to. Cause most lawyers are queers. But I'm just a saying that the fellow could have just fucked up and he'll pay dearly for it the rest of his life regardless of what the courts do.
I don't know the man or much about the case. But I can see how someone could accidentally do this. It doesn't make them a bad parent in my book. I personally know two people who ran over their kids. One died. It was tragic. It was most definitely an accident. The death caused lasting problems. But I know that it wouldn't have done anyone any good to charge either of the parents with any crime. It would have been ridiculous.
Everything in life isn't so cut and dry. Again, I don't know anything about this particular case other than what I've read here. I'm only saying that the fact a guy leaves his kid in the car and kid dies, should not automatically mean that he gets charged with any crime.
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Well. somebody already stated that criminally negligent homicide is a misdemeanor.
Is that acceptable?
I guess so. If that's the law. Because that's what he did. He was criminally negligent.
Everything doesn't have to be so extreme one way or the other. He deserves whatever the law dictates. He doesn't deserve life in prison, but he doesn't deserve a fuckin' parade in his honor for killing his kid.
People are so quick today to pick extreme sides of every fuckin news story and make the subject either a hero and a victim or a monster deserving of death by firing squad. Can't this guy just be a dumbass and still be culpable for the horrible consequences of his dumbassery?
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I guess so. If that's the law. Because that's what he did. He was criminally negligent.
Everything doesn't have to be so extreme one way or the other. He deserves whatever the law dictates. He doesn't deserve life in prison, but he doesn't deserve a fudgein' parade in his honor for killing his kid.
People are so quick today to pick extreme sides of every fudgein news story and make the subject either a hero and a victim or a monster deserving of death by firing squad. Can't this guy just be a dumbass and still be culpable for the horrible consequences of his dumbassery?
Is not the sucking of cock against the law in at least some state or township in the U.S.? I would think there would be some old law on the books regarding this. And if so, you need to stay clear of these places.
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I think both "sides" agree that it's criminal negligence, no?
His negligence resulted in the death of his own kid. It's horrible. It's tragic. It's terrible. And he shouldn't have fuckin' done it. No more excusable than killing a kid by running him over in your car because you were fucking around on your phone and plowed through a red light.
I do not necessarily agree that it's criminal negligence as I read the Georgia Criminal Code. And I strongly disagree with your comparison to texting while driving it being comparable
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I do not necessarily agree that it's criminal negligence as I read the Georgia Criminal Code. And I strongly disagree with your comparison to texting while driving it being comparable
But do you agree that AUChizad sucks the cock?
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But do you agree that AUChizad sucks the cock?
Yes.
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I think both "sides" agree that it's criminal negligence, no?
I don't think anyone thinks this dude killed his kid in cold blood because he wanted him to die.
But I don't get the sympathy for him as if he's the victim.
His negligence resulted in the death of his own kid. It's horrible. It's tragic. It's terrible. And he shouldn't have fuckin' done it. No more excusable than killing a kid by running him over in your car because you were fucking around on your phone and plowed through a red light. I'm not saying give him the death penalty or anything like that, but whatever the appropriate punishment is for criminal negligence is, that's what this guy deserves. I don't understand why he's being made out to be a hero and getting all charges dropped against him is the faceboook cause dejour.
What this guy said ^^
No hanging. But no walk free either.
Not sure why that is so hard to understand.
But as to what degree he is punished in the realm of negligence, that is JR's area of expertise. I just know murder is much. And walking free of all charges is a little much.
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What this guy said ^^
No hanging. But no walk free either.
Not sure why that is so hard to understand.
But as to what degree he is punished in the realm of negligence, that is JR's area of expertise. I just know murder is much. And walking free of all charges is a little much.
Sterilization should be mandatory. No reason to jail the guy. But in no way should he be sent to jail on a murder charge. Too many prosecutors are looking to make the big splash instead of realizing the truth of the matter.
I find these types of prosecutors to be as bad as the defense attorneys for the worst of us.
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Sterilization should be mandatory. No reason to jail the guy. But in no way should he be sent to jail on a murder charge. Too many prosecutors are looking to make the big splash instead of realizing the truth of the matter.
I find these types of prosecutors to be as bad as the defense attorneys for the worst of us.
Nothing gained for society to imprison him. To punish him via the criminal process serves no greater good and the criminal law really does not contemplate this type situation. Moreover, a greater number of folks than I thought feel that his life long guilt is the greatest consequence he will ever have. Im actually surprised to see this seems to be the manority sentiment and I agree with it. I would not argue, though, with a criminally negligent homicide charge even though it appears to me even that does not fit the GA version of it.
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So, if the kid was in the car when they went to chick-fil-a that morning and went back to his car at lunch, I'm suspicious.
Tuscaloosa man charged in Georgia death of toddler son went to his SUV at lunch, warrant shows
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Carol Robinson | crobinson@al.com By Carol Robinson | crobinson@al.com
Email the author | Follow on Twitter
on June 25, 2014 at 9:32 AM, updated June 25, 2014 at 10:43 AM
COBB COUNTY, Georgia - A Tuscaloosa man charged in the death of his toddler son in Georgia went to his car midday, where 22-month-old Cooper Mills Harris was strapped into a rear-facing car seat and later pronounced dead.
A new warrant was issued Wednesday, changing charges against Justin "Ross" Harris from first- to second-degree child cruelty, according to Fox 5 Atlanta. Harris, 33, is also charged with murder.
According to the warrant made public Wednesday by a Cobb County magistrate, Harris placed Cooper into the rear-facing car seat of his 2011 Hyundai Tucson after eating at Chick-Fil-A on Cumberland Parkway, which was near Harris' Home Depot office. Cobb County police spokesman Officer Mike Bowman said he doesn't know what time Harris and his son were at Chick-Fil-A that morning.
Harris then drove to his office a couple of blocks away, and left his son strapped into the car seat in the SUV while he went into work. During lunch, the warrant says, Harris went back out to his car and was seen opening the driver's side door to put something in the vehicle.
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So, if the kid was in the car when they went to chick-fil-a that morning and went back to his car at lunch, I'm suspicious.
Tuscaloosa man charged in Georgia death of toddler son went to his SUV at lunch, warrant shows
Print
Carol Robinson | crobinson@al.com By Carol Robinson | crobinson@al.com
Email the author | Follow on Twitter
on June 25, 2014 at 9:32 AM, updated June 25, 2014 at 10:43 AM
COBB COUNTY, Georgia - A Tuscaloosa man charged in the death of his toddler son in Georgia went to his car midday, where 22-month-old Cooper Mills Harris was strapped into a rear-facing car seat and later pronounced dead.
A new warrant was issued Wednesday, changing charges against Justin "Ross" Harris from first- to second-degree child cruelty, according to Fox 5 Atlanta. Harris, 33, is also charged with murder.
According to the warrant made public Wednesday by a Cobb County magistrate, Harris placed Cooper into the rear-facing car seat of his 2011 Hyundai Tucson after eating at Chick-Fil-A on Cumberland Parkway, which was near Harris' Home Depot office. Cobb County police spokesman Officer Mike Bowman said he doesn't know what time Harris and his son were at Chick-Fil-A that morning.
Harris then drove to his office a couple of blocks away, and left his son strapped into the car seat in the SUV while he went into work. During lunch, the warrant says, Harris went back out to his car and was seen opening the driver's side door to put something in the vehicle.
Shut your yap. The man's a hero by gawdd!
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I do not necessarily agree that it's criminal negligence as I read the Georgia Criminal Code. And I strongly disagree with your comparison to texting while driving it being comparable
Why? What's different? Both are extreme failure to pay a reasonable amount of attention to not result in the death of another human being.
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Would you be for court martial of all soldiers guilty in friendly fire incidents? All parties deserve jail time in accidental shootings, car wrecks, industrial accidents, etc.?
There is a big difference in starving a kid, imprisoning him in a closet, etc and forgetting you left him in the car seat.
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Would you be for court martial of all soldiers guilty in friendly fire incidents? All parties deserve jail time in accidental shootings, car wrecks, industrial accidents, etc.?
There is a big difference in starving a kid, imprisoning him in a closet, etc and forgetting you left him in the car seat.
I think you are seriously mixing apples and oranges here.
And no not all accidents. But he was responsible for this kid. The child is dead now by HIS actions, malicious or not. Actions have consequences. In this case, the action resulted in a child dying.
And with the video evidence popping up that he knew the kid was in the car, it looks even worse. Not sure how anyone can defend this asshat when he made a quick lunchtime trip to the car to see the kid.
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Why? What's different? Both are extreme failure to pay a reasonable amount of attention to not result in the death of another human being.
Criminal negligence is a higher standard. Its more than accidental. All vehicle accidents are negligence but we dont prosecute those criminally unless there is something more than innatentiveness. Ie texting while driving or DUI.
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I think you are seriously mixing apples and oranges here.
And no not all accidents. But he was responsible for this kid. The child is dead now by HIS actions, malicious or not. Actions have consequences. In this case, the action resulted in a child dying.
And with the video evidence popping up that he knew the kid was in the car, it looks even worse. Not sure how anyone can defend this asshat when he made a quick lunchtime trip to the car to see the kid.
He has consquences. You want criminal consequences.
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I think you are seriously mixing apples and oranges here.
And no not all accidents. But he was responsible for this kid. The child is dead now by HIS actions, malicious or not. Actions have consequences. In this case, the action resulted in a child dying.
And with the video evidence popping up that he knew the kid was in the car, it looks even worse. Not sure how anyone can defend this asshat when he made a quick lunchtime trip to the car to see the kid.
There is no mixing. It's a question. And did the guy admit that he made the trip to the car to see the kid? I didn't read that anywhere. If so, that puts a totally different perspective than if he actually forgot the kid was in the car.
As you say, actions have consequences. So, I ask about the car accidents, friendly fire, etc. If you or someone you love has an accident and it kills someone, is jail time warranted? I assume everyone that can't understand how this could happen would say yes.
I am not defending this particular guy. I am defending people's rights to have a senior moment without jail time.
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http://www.wsfa.com/story/25866892/new-warrant-issued-for-man-accused-of-leaving-child-in-car (http://www.wsfa.com/story/25866892/new-warrant-issued-for-man-accused-of-leaving-child-in-car)
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And the newest developments make me question the written law for this type of case.
According to JR, the prosecution would have very little to use in terms of convicting him of any crime. This seems like way too easy of a way for parents to kill their children. Check the weather. 95. Sunny. Put child in car seat. Go to work. Come back at 5. No more kids. Just fake the tears and you're good to go.
If this guy intentionally did this to his kid, then he needs to fry next week. But the scary thought is that if he did this intentionally, he should have skipped the last meal for the kid. He would have gotten away with it and had the support of thousands of people some of whom have raised money for the guy.
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In light of this new evidence, yes he deserves to die. Murder 1.
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Would you be for court martial of all soldiers guilty in friendly fire incidents? All parties deserve jail time in accidental shootings, car wrecks, industrial accidents, etc.?
There is a big difference in starving a kid, imprisoning him in a closet, etc and forgetting you left him in the car seat.
In almost all cases your engaged with the enemy in a hostile situation fearing for your life.
Bad example. :facepalm:
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If they can prove intent...then yes....murder
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In light of this new evidence, yes he deserves to die. Murder 1.
@RandyTravisFox5 Cobb law enforcement source: Work computer for Dad who left child in car shows search for how long it takes to kill animal in hot car.
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Told you they were searching for this very type of thing. If its legit he will fry.
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If this mofo searched for "how long it takes to kill an animal in a hot car", then with the right grandparent/uncle/friend, there will be no need in debating the legal process.
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In almost all cases your engaged with the enemy in a hostile situation fearing for your life.
Bad example. :facepalm:
no shit?
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Shut your yap. The man's a hero by gawdd!
Yeah. That's what people are saying!
I have to believe in the premise of our system; innocent until proven guilty.
If we don't have that, then we might as well return to survival of the fittest.
If convicted and proven he knew his kid was in the car; lock that bitch in a hot box and bury it after five days in the sun!
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Death Penalty
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(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u1/miked0003/e67d2cc6146d9018570f6a706700e6851_zps203cd572.jpg) (http://s164.photobucket.com/user/miked0003/media/e67d2cc6146d9018570f6a706700e6851_zps203cd572.jpg.html)
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Death Penalty
To good for him
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To good for him
Well that settles it. Zimmerman needs to die. He's obviously guilty. I mean, all of you said so...
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Well that settles it. Zimmerman needs to die. He's obviously guilty. I mean, all of you said so...
Its hard to defend the guy as "leaving the kid in the car accidentally" or "forgetting" when he made a cognitive effort to go back out and "check" on him at lunch. This is probably what Prosecutor and law enforcement knew that we didn't that brought about the charge. And then there is the google search.
No one on here is "saying so"....the evidence is saying so. Yeah, he will have his day in court, innocent until proven guilty and all that, but its seriously hard to dispute this evidence. I'd really like to see this guy explain it away. This should be good.
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Its hard to defend the guy as "leaving the kid in the car accidentally" or "forgetting" when he made a cognitive effort to go back out and "check" on him at lunch. This is probably what Prosecutor and law enforcement knew that we didn't that brought about the charge. And then there is the google search.
No one on here is "saying so"....the evidence is saying so. Yeah, he will have his day in court, innocent until proven guilty and all that, but its seriously hard to dispute this evidence. I'd really like to see this guy explain it away. This should be good.
"I really wanted to kill the family dog in the car but wasn't sure how long it would take so I tested it out on the human pet."
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"I really wanted to kill the family dog in the car but wasn't sure how long it would take so I tested it out on the human pet."
I think the preferred nomenclature is "critter".
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Its hard to defend the guy as "leaving the kid in the car accidentally" or "forgetting" when he made a cognitive effort to go back out and "check" on him at lunch. This is probably what Prosecutor and law enforcement knew that we didn't that brought about the charge. And then there is the google search.
No one on here is "saying so"....the evidence is saying so. Yeah, he will have his day in court, innocent until proven guilty and all that, but its seriously hard to dispute this evidence. I'd really like to see this guy explain it away. This should be good.
And all of the "evidence" in the Zimmerman case pointed to him as racist white guy who hunted and killed a defenseless skittles eating baby boy!
It's like you people have learned nothing.
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Cognitive Dissonance: Look it up, CCTAU. You're a victim.
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Well that settles it. Zimmerman needs to die. He's obviously guilty. I mean, all of you said so...
He's a bama fan of course he is guilty.
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And all of the "evidence" in the Zimmerman case pointed to him as racist white guy who hunted and killed a defenseless skittles eating baby boy!
It's like you people have learned nothing.
I know I'm always google searching how to kill animals in my hot car. That's some funny shit.
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Criminal negligence is a higher standard. Its more than accidental. All vehicle accidents are negligence but we dont prosecute those criminally unless there is something more than innatentiveness. Ie texting while driving or DUI.
I posted this while driving. And simultaneously eating a granola bar.
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Well that settles it. Zimmerman needs to die. He's obviously guilty. I mean, all of you said so...
Just gonna say... this is not the same as Zimmerman.
This is a douche who pretty obviously faked anguish to get away with murdering his own child.
Rawl Tahd.
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http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/ (http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/)
(http://thenypost.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/hotcar.jpg?w=720&h=480&crop=1)
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This guy did this on purpose - but lots of parents don't. It can happen and does happen, like any accident, and in my personal opinion, it is not a criminal offense, and should not be prosecuted at all (cases like this asshole excepted). I know for a fact those parents will suffer more than you could possibly imagine.
It came close to happening to me, and I don't think anyone here would or could accuse me of being a neglectful mom. Our regular morning routine was broken up by a doctor's appointment, and I got halfway to work before I realized I had not taken Katie to the babysitter. She was asleep in her car seat in the backseat and I completely forgot she was there. Scared the living shit out of me, because I was only too aware of what could have happened. She was newborn little, I had already gone back to work and was tired from being up all hours of the night nursing, and was driving on auto pilot. So for all of you who say "Oh, it would never happen to me..." - you can't say that. Because yeah, it could. All it takes is a change in routine or a sleepless night or a stressful situation to distract you. You can't tell me that you have never driven to work on auto-pilot, and just kind of snapped back to yourself and realized you were at work and can't remember the drive in, especially if it is a daily routine.
I turned around and took her to the babysitter and all was well. But I still have nightmares about this incident and always will, and nothing even happened.
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Its hard to defend the guy as "leaving the kid in the car accidentally" or "forgetting" when he made a cognitive effort to go back out and "check" on him at lunch. This is probably what Prosecutor and law enforcement knew that we didn't that brought about the charge. And then there is the google search.
No one on here is "saying so"....the evidence is saying so. Yeah, he will have his day in court, innocent until proven guilty and all that, but its seriously hard to dispute this evidence. I'd really like to see this guy explain it away. This should be good.
He went to check on him at lunch? It says that?
Fwiw...the warrant is not evidence.
They are looking for evidence of knowledge or intent...they may have found it. Maybe.
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Look, he had to make some harsh decisions in his life.
Food and clothing for a child or additional personalized tags and stickers for his vehicle.
Caring for a child or appropriately displaying his Bama fandom?
Caring for a child or saving money for Got 16 t-shirts and stickers which will be out in January?
Caring for a child or having enough cash to rent a bigger TV to watch Bama dominate the "Final Four' ?
Caring for a child or being able to travel back to Tuscaloosa for the championship parade?
Caring for a child or getting that houndstooth hat he saw at Cracker Barrel?
Caring for a child or scraping together gas money to have his picture taken in front of Saban's statue?
Choice is pretty obvious once you look at the facts. Saban worship trumps all.
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This guy did this on purpose - but lots of parents don't. It can happen and does happen, like any accident, and in my personal opinion, it is not a criminal offense, and should not be prosecuted at all (cases like this asshole excepted). I know for a fact those parents will suffer more than you could possibly imagine.
It came close to happening to me, and I don't think anyone here would or could accuse me of being a neglectful mom. Our regular morning routine was broken up by a doctor's appointment, and I got halfway to work before I realized I had not taken Katie to the babysitter. She was asleep in her car seat in the backseat and I completely forgot she was there. Scared the living shit out of me, because I was only too aware of what could have happened. She was newborn little, I had already gone back to work and was tired from being up all hours of the night nursing, and was driving on auto pilot. So for all of you who say "Oh, it would never happen to me..." - you can't say that. Because yeah, it could. All it takes is a change in routine or a sleepless night or a stressful situation to distract you. You can't tell me that you have never driven to work on auto-pilot, and just kind of snapped back to yourself and realized you were at work and can't remember the drive in, especially if it is a daily routine.
I turned around and took her to the babysitter and all was well. But I still have nightmares about this incident and always will, and nothing even happened.
Some here believe it cant happen by accident and its a crime if it does.
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He went to check on him at lunch? It says that?
Fwiw...the warrant is not evidence.
They are looking for evidence of knowledge or intent...they may have found it. Maybe.
Some people seem to think they have it all figured out. The guy is obviously guilty. I mean they are investigating him. SO he has to be guilty.
I don't know if he did this on purpose or not. But like I said earlier, if he did, I'll help throw the rope over a limb.
But to run around convicting a guy from news reports? Well, most of you are smart enough to know the news fashions things to their benefit. If there is nothing to see here, you don't read, watch, or listen. They lose.
I've just come to the conclusion that we should stick to the innocent until PROVEN guilty process.
Some of you wold have TW in therapy now for admitting she forgot about the sitter. Obviously she was contemplating killing her baby...
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Some people seem to think they have it all figured out. The guy is obviously guilty. I mean they are investigating him. SO he has to be guilty.
I don't know if he did this on purpose or not. But like I said earlier, if he did, I'll help throw the rope over a limb.
But to run around convicting a guy from news reports? Well, most of you are smart enough to know the news fashions things to their benefit. If there is nothing to see here, you don't read, watch, or listen. They lose.
I've just come to the conclusion that we should stick to the innocent until PROVEN guilty process.
Some of you wold have TW in therapy now for admitting she forgot about the sitter. Obviously she was contemplating killing her baby...
Out on a limb here, dog. I usually stand with you but this one is off the rails for me.
Too many coincidences. Too much inconsistency in his story.
Agree that rush to judgment (Zimmerman) is bad. But so is rush to defense. We had morons setting up a DEFENSE FUND for this guy and hailing him as a hero/victim before extenuating circumstances were known.
Hail Saban.
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All it takes is a change in routine or a sleepless night or a stressful situation to distract you. You can't tell me that you have never driven to work on auto-pilot, and just kind of snapped back to yourself and realized you were at work and can't remember the drive in, especially if it is a daily routine.
You've said this more eloquently than I but it's what I'm feeling. Accidents CAN happen to anyone and there is a difference between accidents and negligence. End of story. I don't yet know which applies in this instance, yet. But early reports have it sounding like neither.
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Out on a limb here, dog. I usually stand with you but this one is off the rails for me.
Too many coincidences. Too much inconsistency in his story.
Agree that rush to judgment (Zimmerman) is bad. But so is rush to defense. We had morons setting up a DEFENSE FUND for this guy and hailing him as a hero/victim before extenuating circumstances were known.
Hail Saban.
I hear ya. I do not agree with the setting up of a support group for the guy. And things really do not look kosher. But I cannot definetively say he killed his own child on purpose.
And any support I may have given the guy, is the same support I would giver any parent who "forgot"
their child.
As this plays out, if he is found guilty, the amount of heartbreak I will feel, not only for the child, but for humanity itself will be epic.
And I have to believe that a person must be proven guilty.
I am not defending the man or his actions, I am defending the process.
The whole situation is sickening no matter what the legal outcome is.
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Some people seem to think they have it all figured out. The guy is obviously guilty. I mean they are investigating him. SO he has to be guilty.
I don't know if he did this on purpose or not. But like I said earlier, if he did, I'll help throw the rope over a limb.
But to run around convicting a guy from news reports? Well, most of you are smart enough to know the news fashions things to their benefit. If there is nothing to see here, you don't read, watch, or listen. They lose.
I've just come to the conclusion that we should stick to the innocent until PROVEN guilty process.
Some of you wold have TW in therapy now for admitting she forgot about the sitter. Obviously she was contemplating killing her baby...
As Kaos said, youre off the rails dude. And I also usually agree with you on most things.
And this is NOTHING like Zimmerman. That involved self defense and a lot of gray area. This involves the death of a toddler and possible neglect. And he IS innocent until proven guilty. I think most of what were saying is in response to the people who have made this guy out to be some kind of facebook hero, throwing money at him without knowing anything. They are worse than those who were proclaiming guilt of murder before anything actually came out.
If you go back and look in this thread, I said there was a middle ground somewhere. Pretty sure Chad and THS did as well. I don't think there was anyone on here that came right out and said " a child is dead so hang the mf'er!".
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He went to check on him at lunch? It says that?
Fwiw...the warrant is not evidence.
They are looking for evidence of knowledge or intent...they may have found it. Maybe.
http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/ (http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/)
A newly filed arrest warrant supporting the murder charge against 33-year-old Justin Ross Harris states that he stopped with his son for breakfast and also returned to put something inside his vehicle around lunchtime while the child was inside it.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/facts-will-show-death-kid-hot-car-not-negligence-says-n140491 (http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/facts-will-show-death-kid-hot-car-not-negligence-says-n140491)
"During lunch said accused (Harris) did access the same vehicle through the driver's side door to place an object into the vehicle," the warrant said. "Said accused then closed the door and left the car, re-entering his place of business."
That, plus the fact that he "forgot" him between taking him to breakfast and the 0.2 miles to his work, plus the smoking gun that he was googling how long it takes to kill an animal in a hot car...
You have to be a fucking idiot to defend this as an accident. Plain & simple. You have to be so invested in your predetermined position that this guy is a hero and deserving of our sympathy that you have shut off your brain in order to defend him.
Period.
And TW didn't forget her kid and kill it. If she had, that would be criminal negligence. But she didn't.
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http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/ (http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/)
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/facts-will-show-death-kid-hot-car-not-negligence-says-n140491 (http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/facts-will-show-death-kid-hot-car-not-negligence-says-n140491)
That, plus the fact that he "forgot" him between taking him to breakfast and the 0.2 miles to his work, plus the smoking gun that he was googling how long it takes to kill an animal in a hot car...
You have to be a fudgeing idiot to defend this as an accident. Plain & simple. You have to be so invested in your predetermined position that this guy is a hero and deserving of our sympathy that you have shut off your brain in order to defend him.
Period.
And TW didn't forget her kid and kill it. If she had, that would be criminal negligence. But she didn't.
This guy very well may be guilty of murder, I don't know. But if these reports about the googlz, checking in at lunch and breakfast are true, then he is. I won't make my decision based on news reports though.
And, if TW had forgotten her kid, she would NOT have been guilty of anything other than making a mistake. There should be no crime for an honest mistake. And anyone who thinks otherwise is a fudgeing idiot. And likely sucks richards.
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He went to check on him at lunch? It says that?
Fwiw...the warrant is not evidence.
They are looking for evidence of knowledge or intent...they may have found it. Maybe.
No it didn't literally say that. Its called paraphrasing.
Evidence, facts whatever you call it in the general sense. The dude went back to the car at lunch. THAT is not forgetting the child was in there. That shit is willful.
Yes, I know none of this is "official" as far as evidence and the guy will get his day in court to explain all of this away, but knowing all of this I don't know how anyone can defend this asshat as a victim. Give me a freaking break.
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This guy very well may be guilty of murder, I don't know. But if these reports about the googlz, checking in at lunch and breakfast are true, then he is. I won't make my decision based on news reports though.
And, if TW had forgotten her kid, she would NOT have been guilty of anything other than making a mistake. There should be no crime for an honest mistake. And anyone who thinks otherwise is a fudgeing idiot. And likely sucks richards.
Not a news report. A warrant. Issued to arrest him....and charge him with murder. With facts.
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2014/images/06/25/harris,.justin.criminal.warrant.6-25-14.pdf
(http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2014/images/06/25/harris,.justin.criminal.warrant.6-25-14.pdf)
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As Kaos said, youre off the rails dude. And I also usually agree with you on most things.
And this is NOTHING like Zimmerman. That involved self defense and a lot of gray area. This involves the death of a toddler and possible neglect. And he IS innocent until proven guilty. I think most of what were saying is in response to the people who have made this guy out to be some kind of facebook hero, throwing money at him without knowing anything. They are worse than those who were proclaiming guilt of murder before anything actually came out.
If you go back and look in this thread, I said there was a middle ground somewhere. Pretty sure Chad and THS did as well. I don't think there was anyone on here that came right out and said " a child is dead so hang the mf'er!".
Read back through. Hang him, death penalty, etc..
So to wait until the evidence backs up murder is off the rails?
And this is EXACTLY like Zimmerman. He was tried and deemed guilty in the court of public opinion BEFORE ANY EVIDENCE OR TRIAL (which turned out to be wrong BTW).
Just like many of you are doing here.
I am not defending the guy. I am just stating that we should wait for the truth (if it is ever reached)
Many of you already know the truth. the rest is just posturing by the government.
I will wait and see. You guys load up your ropes and go hang out on the doorsteps of the jail.
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http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/ (http://nypost.com/2014/06/25/dad-knew-son-was-trapped-inside-hot-car-warrant/)
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/facts-will-show-death-kid-hot-car-not-negligence-says-n140491 (http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/facts-will-show-death-kid-hot-car-not-negligence-says-n140491)
That, plus the fact that he "forgot" him between taking him to breakfast and the 0.2 miles to his work, plus the smoking gun that he was googling how long it takes to kill an animal in a hot car...
You have to be a fucking idiot to defend this as an accident. Plain & simple. You have to be so invested in your predetermined position that this guy is a hero and deserving of our sympathy that you have shut off your brain in order to defend him.
Period.
And TW didn't forget her kid and kill it. If she had, that would be criminal negligence. But she didn't.
It would help if you would read more carefully.
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Not a news report. A warrant. Issued to arrest him....and charge him with murder. With facts.
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2014/images/06/25/harris,.justin.criminal.warrant.6-25-14.pdf
(http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2014/images/06/25/harris,.justin.criminal.warrant.6-25-14.pdf)
You seem to be using the apples and oranges. I am not defending this guy. I'm just not convicting him because I haven't read much more about this than what's on here. And FYI, lots of warrants do not lead to guilty verdicts.
Let me clearly say, I am NOT saying that THIS guy is innocent of murder.
This is what I AM saying. There are ACCIDENTS and there is NEGLIGENCE.
Let me try this. ACCIDENTS=APPLES and NEGLIGENCE=ORANGES
If you think that my comparisons of most of the following (friendly fire, car wrecks, industrial accidents) to accidentally leaving a kid in a hot car are not apples to apples, then you will just have to continue to disagree with me. Which I can assure you, I don't care either way.
But, if you can see the comparison, then it's not apples and oranges.
I would think that most people could make the connection but I also thought that most people wouldn't vote for Obama the second term.
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You seem to be using the apples and oranges. I am not defending this guy. I'm just not convicting him because I haven't read much more about this than what's on here. And FYI, lots of warrants do not lead to guilty verdicts.
Let me clearly say, I am NOT saying that THIS guy is innocent of murder.
This is what I AM saying. There are ACCIDENTS and there is NEGLIGENCE.
Let me try this. ACCIDENTS=APPLES and NEGLIGENCE=ORANGES
If you think that my comparisons of most of the following (friendly fire, car wrecks, industrial accidents) to accidentally leaving a kid in a hot car are not apples to apples, then you will just have to continue to disagree with me. Which I can assure you, I don't care either way.
But, if you can see the comparison, then it's not apples and oranges.
I would think that most people could make the connection but I also thought that most people wouldn't vote for Obama the second term.
Accident = negligence < criminal negligence.
All moot points if he intended to kill the child.
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Accident = negligence < criminal negligence.
All moot points if he intended to kill the child.
Which will be determined by the evidence and maybe a trial. But up until that point in time, he is innocent.
That does not mean I want him to be my kid's scout leader. It does not mean there is no suspicion of wrong-doing. It just means we cannot hang him until he is proven guilty.
Either way, God bless that baby. I pray he fell asleep without any suffering. And may God be with the mother. I cannot imagine what she is going through.
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Which will be determined by the evidence and maybe a trial. But up until that point in time, he is innocent.
That does not mean I want him to be my kid's scout leader. It does not mean there is no suspicion of wrong-doing. It just means we cannot hang him until he is proven guilty.
Either way, God bless that baby. I pray he fell asleep without any suffering. And may God be with the mother. I cannot imagine what she is going through.You
Ifn you aint agin him yer fer him
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Read back through. Hang him, death penalty, etc..
Links? Quotes?
You're full of shit, Councillor.
It would help if you would read more carefully.
I get you're playing the lawyer semantics word-for-word zero room for interpretation and logic game, but it takes exactly two brain cells to rub together that this guy who was researching how long it takes to kill something in his car, probably undershot based on whatever his Google results told him, and thought he'd be "in the clear" by lunch. He went into his car again to "put something in it", and somehow completely didn't see his child, yet again? You don't believe that if you're being honest.
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Links? Quotes?
You're full of shit, Councillor.
I get you're playing the lawyer semantics word-for-word zero room for interpretation and logic game, but it takes exactly two brain cells to rub together that this guy who was researching how long it takes to kill something in his car, probably undershot based on whatever his Google results told him, and thought he'd be "in the clear" by lunch. He went into his car again to "put something in it", and somehow completely didn't see his child, yet again? You don't believe that if you're being honest.
RIF
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RIF
I read it the first time. Still right.
I get you're trained to pick a side and stick with it, not letting facts interfere with your pre-determined position.
The rest of us call that willfully ignorant.
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Links? Quotes?
You're full of shoot, Councillor.
I get you're playing the lawyer semantics word-for-word zero room for interpretation and logic game, but it takes exactly two brain cells to rub together that this guy who was researching how long it takes to kill something in his car, probably undershot based on whatever his Google results told him, and thought he'd be "in the clear" by lunch. He went into his car again to "put something in it", and somehow completely didn't see his child, yet again? You don't believe that if you're being honest.
I think that everyone on here (at least I hope) want the guy to get fried if the reports about the googlz, breakfast at fil-a and lunch visit to the car are accurate.
My main difference with you, aside from your blatant racism and homosexual tendencies, is that you think that even if someone truly accidentally left their kid in the car that they deserve jail. I don't.
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On the googling with the supposition that it was initially accidental.
What if he realized at 4:30 that "oh crap I forgot my kid" and then in a spasm of self preservation decided to see how deep he likely was in trouble. So if a dog suffocates in three hours I got a problem here. My kid has been out there for like eight. What to do now?
Nah. He's still a scum. Even if he was just checking to see how bad it was likely to be, the fact that he didn't go immediately to the car and seek help while still at the job ruins that line of thinking. Even colder like that.
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I read it the first time. Still right.
I get you're trained to pick a side and stick with it, not letting facts interfere with your pre-determined position.
The rest of us call that willfully ignorant.
Surprised you got that from my posts...or youve not read them all. Ive moved on from it being an accident. It loks like he may have intended it. Whole different game now.
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My main difference with you, aside from your blatant racism and homosexual tendencies, is that you think that even if someone truly accidentally left their kid in the car that they deserve jail. I don't.
I think that IF it were a total accident, which it weren't, that he would culpable of some wrongdoing for being a negligent father. As I said, if the law says that criminal negligence is a misdemeanor and thus a monetary fine or very light jail time is appropriate, then that's appropriate.
Something was off from the beginning with me, because people can say all day that "it can happen to anyone", but how many people does it really actually happen to? Not almost. Actually. Why does this thread exist? Because the two cases where it happened in the past few years were rare and alarming enough to bring it to our attention. Most people are decent enough parents to remember they are in fact parents before 7 hours of baby baking takes place.
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Surprised you got that from my posts...or youve not read them all. Ive moved on from it being an accident. It loks like he may have intended it. Whole different game now.
You seem to be pretty confrontational with anyone in this thread taking the facts and applying them logically to determine this guy's guilt for someone who has "moved on from it being an accident".
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I think that IF it were a total accident, which it weren't, that he would culpable of some wrongdoing for being a negligent father. As I said, if the law says that criminal negligence is a misdemeanor and thus a monetary fine or very light jail time is appropriate, then that's appropriate.
Something was off from the beginning with me, because people can say all day that "it can happen to anyone", but how many people does it really actually happen to? Not almost. Actually. Why does this thread exist? Because the two cases where it happened in the past few years were rare and alarming enough to bring it to our attention. Most people are decent enough parents to remember they are in fact parents before 7 hours of baby baking takes place.
Being a decent parent has nothing to do with a human beings predisposition to make dumb ass mistakes. I don't know if you are a parent or not but my guess is that you are not, so you cannot likely relate to TW's story. I can easily see how someone who has worked long hours and in what they think is their normal routine of going to work, forgets that they were supposed to drop the sleeping baby off at the daycare. And they normally never make that stop.
Let's not confuse this particular case with a scenario of a definitive "forgot the baby was in the car" case. The key in my opinion is "knowingly" doing something that reasonable people would consider endangering a child.
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You seem to be pretty confrontational with anyone in this thread taking the facts and applying them logically to determine this guy's guilt for someone who has "moved on from it being an accident".
LOL. :facepalm:
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Ifn you aint agin him yer fer him
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You seem to be pretty confrontational with anyone in this thread taking the facts and applying them logically to determine this guy's guilt for someone who has "moved on from it being an accident".
That is just it. I have yet to see any FACTS about this. All we get is what is spoon fed to us and a lot of that is supposition on the media's part.
That is why it is dangerous making absolute determinations on the man's guilt at this point.
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Chad. I encourage you to read ALL my post in this thread from start to finish in order. Its not too many. Discount the one you picked where I was being a smartass and I'll bet youll find a different take from me than the one you perceive. Or don't. It's up to you, but it matters not either way.
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That is just it. I have yet to see any FACTS about this. All we get is what is spoon fed to us and a lot of that is supposition on the media's part.
That is why it is dangerous making absolute determinations on the man's guilt at this point.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-H9qpfdjasrk/T-WW_qn8E7I/AAAAAAAABh4/msev0xHusH0/s1600/545113_380850791979232_1896929387_n.jpg)
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I think that IF it were a total accident, which it weren't, that he would culpable of some wrongdoing for being a negligent father. As I said, if the law says that criminal negligence is a misdemeanor and thus a monetary fine or very light jail time is appropriate, then that's appropriate.
Something was off from the beginning with me, because people can say all day that "it can happen to anyone", but how many people does it really actually happen to? Not almost. Actually. Why does this thread exist? Because the two cases where it happened in the past few years were rare and alarming enough to bring it to our attention. Most people are decent enough parents to remember they are in fact parents before 7 hours of baby baking takes place.
Jail time is appropriate? Decent enough parent? Yes, I remembered - but I might not have. I was a zombie that day. Dude, you have no fucking clue. You cannot be uber parent 24/7. It is impossible to do, and believe me, I tried. I was so damn paranoid from the day K came home from the hospital, I nearly made myself sick. Parents are human. You will make mistakes. And sometimes a mistake has tragic consequences that a parent has to live with forever. But that's not necessarily criminal and most people recognize that. You wait until you are sleep deprived and going through your days and nights on auto pilot with a new little life in your care and see if you don't screw up a time or two. God forbid anything tragic happen to you, but there will be times when a close call will leave you sleepless for a week. My son pulled away from me in a Target parking lot one time - just snatched free of my hand and ran off between two cars toward the drive lane. And they are fast - holy shit a toddler is fast. I screamed and fortunately the driver saw him and stopped. Was I negligent and deserving of criminal charges? No - but I guarantee you I'm serving a life sentence. That was five years ago and I STILL wake up in a cold sweat dreaming about that and how close I came to losing him.
So best wishes to you atop the lofty heights of your pedestal.
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Can we all get back to the point?
He's an Alabama fan and thus guilty.
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Can we all get back to the point?
He's an Alabama fan and thus guilty.
Thats what I am saying.
and also that Wench is a bad mom that almost lost her kids ...twice.
I keed.
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Jail time is appropriate? Decent enough parent? Yes, I remembered - but I might not have. I was a zombie that day. Dude, you have no fucking clue. You cannot be uber parent 24/7. It is impossible to do, and believe me, I tried. I was so damn paranoid from the day K came home from the hospital, I nearly made myself sick. Parents are human. You will make mistakes. And sometimes a mistake has tragic consequences that a parent has to live with forever. But that's not necessarily criminal and most people recognize that. You wait until you are sleep deprived and going through your days and nights on auto pilot with a new little life in your care and see if you don't screw up a time or two. God forbid anything tragic happen to you, but there will be times when a close call will leave you sleepless for a week. My son pulled away from me in a Target parking lot one time - just snatched free of my hand and ran off between two cars toward the drive lane. And they are fast - holy shit a toddler is fast. I screamed and fortunately the driver saw him and stopped. Was I negligent and deserving of criminal charges? No - but I guarantee you I'm serving a life sentence. That was five years ago and I STILL wake up in a cold sweat dreaming about that and how close I came to losing him.
So best wishes to you atop the lofty heights of your pedestal.
:bar:
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Can we all get back to the point?
He's an Alabama fan and thus guilty.
Probably a Saints fan as well.
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Probably a Saints fan as well.
DEATH PENALTY!
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http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/06/25/ga-man-accused-of-murdering-infant-son-by-leaving-him-in-a-locked-car-for-7-hours/ (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/06/25/ga-man-accused-of-murdering-infant-son-by-leaving-him-in-a-locked-car-for-7-hours/)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BrJTFa4IMAEHlF8.jpg)
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Probably a Saints fan as well.
Might I remind you he was living in Atlanta.
Dirty Bird, to be certain.
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(http://scallywagandvagabond.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/h6.jpg?3a7e42)
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Being a bammer satisfies me he's guilty
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Being a bammer satisfies me he's guilty
Being a bammer fan is not a cri...
Hey. Wait a minute. I see what you did there...
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Being a bammer satisfies me he's guilty
Never thought I would see those three word together on this site, Unless it was from VV.
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Never thought I would see those three word together on this site, Unless it was from VV.
Bammers don't satisfy me. I'm not related to them, so they are never interested.
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Bammers don't satisfy me. I'm not related to them, so they are never interested.
Usually too old too...wait, thats another guy on here.
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http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/06/25/ga-man-accused-of-murdering-infant-son-by-leaving-him-in-a-locked-car-for-7-hours/ (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/06/25/ga-man-accused-of-murdering-infant-son-by-leaving-him-in-a-locked-car-for-7-hours/)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BrJTFa4IMAEHlF8.jpg)
The baby died because they had it signed by $aban and the permanent marker came off in the bath, therefore he didn't need it anymore.
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The baby died because they had it signed by $aban and the permanent marker came off in the bath, therefore he didn't need it anymore.
Dude that isn't even funny!
Acting like Bammers bathe.
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http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/father_charged_in_death_of_geo.html (http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/father_charged_in_death_of_geo.html)
I think he may confess soon.
He's talking...selling bullshit.
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As Kaos said, youre off the rails dude. And I also usually agree with you on most things.
And this is NOTHING like Zimmerman. That involved self defense and a lot of gray area. This involves the death of a toddler and possible neglect. And he IS innocent until proven guilty. I think most of what were saying is in response to the people who have made this guy out to be some kind of facebook hero, throwing money at him without knowing anything. They are worse than those who were proclaiming guilt of murder before anything actually came out.
If you go back and look in this thread, I said there was a middle ground somewhere. Pretty sure Chad and THS did as well. I don't think there was anyone on here that came right out and said " a child is dead so hang the mf'er!".
Death Penalty
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Fry em both.
http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/wife_of_justin_ross_harris_als.html#incart_m-rpt-2 (http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/wife_of_justin_ross_harris_als.html#incart_m-rpt-2)
COBB COUNTY, Georgia - The mother of a Georgia toddler who died after the boy was left by his father in a sweltering SUV for seven hours also searched, on the internet, child deaths inside vehicles and what temperature it needs to be for that to occur.
"Leanna Harris, the child's mother, was also questioned regarding the incident and made similar statements regarding researching in car deaths and how it occurs,'' according to new search warrants made public Sunday. The warrants were released by Cobb County magistrate officials, and obtained by Fox 5 in Atlanta, and other media outlets.
On Saturday, warrants showed the boy's father, Justin "Ross" Harris, 33, also recently researched the topic. The warrants do not say when those searches took place. "During an interview with Justin, he stated that he recently researched, through the internet, child deaths inside vehicles and what temperature it needs to be for that to occur. Justin stated that he was fearful that this could happen," the warrants said.
The warrants show police seized a number of items from the parents' home: A white iPhone 5, Hyundai car, home laptop computer, computer tower, a Google Chromecast Internet searcher and other electronic devices. Police said the searches were intended to find blood, DNA, hair fibers, latent impressions, writings and photographs relating to child abuse, child neglect, homicide to children, and cruelty to children.
Justin Ross Harris, a Tuscaloosa native, is charged with murder and child cruelty, in the June 18 death of his son, 22-month-old Cooper Harris. Harris remains jailed without bond in the case. Leanna Harris, 30, has not been charged with any crime.
HarrisCollage.jpg
View full size
The two were married in 2006. Leanna Harris is a 2002 graduate of Demopolis Academy in Alabama, and attended the University of Alabama where she studied food and nutrition. The couple now lives in Marietta.
Leanna Harris has not given any interviews regarding the incident, nor have Cooper's grandparents. At Cooper's funeral Saturday, Ross Harris called in from the jail and spoke to those gathered there. "Thank you for everything you've done for my boy," he said, according to a CNN report. "Good life. (Inaudible) No words to say. Just horrible. (Inaudible) I'm just sorry I can't be there."
Leanna Harris also spoke at the service and publicly answered the questions she said she has struggled with in the last 10 days. She said she misses her son deeply, but finds solace knowing Cooper is shielded from knowing the pain of a broken heart, from mourning the death of his own loved ones and from being exposed to the hard truths of a world that she called broken.
Leanna Harris also said she was not angry at God nor at her husband Ross, who left their son in a car seat in his SUV last Wednesday and found him dead after he finished his day at work. Citing the Book of Job, she said the Lord gives and takes away, and his name should be praised in good times and bad.
She also told her husband she loved him. "Am I angry with Ross?" CNN quoted her as saying. "Absolutely not. It has never crossed my mind. Ross is and was and will be, if we have more children, a wonderful father. Ross is a wonderful daddy and leader for our household. Cooper meant the world to him."
The warrants also outlined the timeline of events the day 22-month-old Cooper Harris died. On June 18, police were called at 4:24 p.m. to 2955 Akers Mill Rd, Atlanta GA regarding a person down call. When the officers arrived on scene, they found Cooper dead. A homicide investigation was launched, according to the warrants.
Harris was witnessed pulling into the parking lot of Uncle Maddio's Pizza in his 2011 Hyundai Tucson. The vehicle came to a sudden stop and Ross quickly got out, opened the driver side passenger door and pulled out Cooper.
"Justin was witnessed yelling, 'Oh my god what have I done','' the warrant says. "He then began doing CPR on the child. EMS responded to the scene. It was obvious that the child was deceased."
Harris told police he went to work that morning and forgot to drop the child off at day care. He left his Marietta home and took the child to Chik-fil-A in Vinings and then went to work. The child was left in the SUV from 9:30 a.m. until he was discovered by Justin at around 4:20 p.m. when he was driving to meet up with some friends.
Authorities later said they received information that Harris went to his SUV during lunchtime, and put something in it.
Like black people did with Trayvon and like everyone did with Casey Anthony, there's nothing anyone can do or say to change my mind about this case. I won't be on the jury, but if I was, I don't believe there's anything that would convince me to acquit.
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Fry em both.
http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/wife_of_justin_ross_harris_als.html#incart_m-rpt-2 (http://www.al.com/news/birmingham/index.ssf/2014/06/wife_of_justin_ross_harris_als.html#incart_m-rpt-2)
Like black people did with Trayvon and like everyone did with Casey Anthony, there's nothing anyone can do or say to change my mind about this case. I won't be on the jury, but if I was, I don't believe there's anything that would convince me to acquit.
Death to both.
Death to all the rawl tahd braying "hundreds" who crowded into the funeral, applauded the baby (who applauds at a funeral?) and listened to the fool and his strumpet wife yammer. Hose the entire place down with a flamethrower. I'd applaud that.
But don't blame these wonderful parents. The world is broken! They saved they baby from evar havin' a broke heart. They heroes! Gonna have more babbies, too.
Maybe I'm just stunned by the loss of Lutz but my sympathy level is pretty low. These assbags are going to eventually use a religious defense, 'a God told me to fry my baby 'cuz the world be harsh' shield. Makes me want to kill them myself. I hate when mush brained feebs like these two idiots make those of us who believe in God look like we don't have a grip on reality.
I don't like the way the dad looks. He looks like the first word of every sentence would be "duuuhhh." I don't like how stupid the wife looks. She looks like a dead-eyed cow. In my mind it reflects on just how worthless a UA degree must be if these two simpletons could both possess one.
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Death to both.
Death to all the rawl tahd braying "hundreds" who crowded into the funeral, applauded the baby (who applauds at a funeral?) and listened to the fool and his strumpet wife yammer. Hose the entire place down with a flamethrower. I'd applaud that.
But don't blame these wonderful parents. The world is broken! They saved they baby from evar havin' a broke heart. They heroes! Gonna have more babbies, too.
Maybe I'm just stunned by the loss of Lutz but my sympathy level is pretty low. These assbags are going to eventually use a religious defense, 'a God told me to fry my baby 'cuz the world be harsh' shield. Makes me want to kill them myself. I hate when mush brained feebs like these two idiots make those of us who believe in God look like we don't have a grip on reality.
I don't like the way the dad looks. He looks like the first word of every sentence would be "duuuhhh." I don't like how stupid the wife looks. She looks like a dead-eyed cow. In my mind it reflects on just how worthless a UA degree must be if these two simpletons could both possess one.
Every single word of this ^^
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Death Penalty
Knowing what we do now? Yep.
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And he's fat too.
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And he's fat too.
Death by starvation!
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And he's fat too.
No fat remarks please. There are standards on here and comments about fat people aren't acceptable and are disrespectful toward some of the fat ass people on here. Not me, I'm just a little fluffy. But some people are sensitive about being a fat ass slob.
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Strap the motherfucker into a Hyundai SUV covered in Bama stickers in a Wal Mart parking lot in the middle of Tuscaloosa on July 4 and weld the fucking doors shut. Make it a public event.
Make his pig-eyed wife watch while he burns to death. Chain her naked to the light pole in front of the car. As he takes his last breath, let one of the attendees (whoever won the drawing) perform an impromptu hysterectomy on her using whatever tools can be acquired by searching the trunks of the three nearest cars with both bama stickers and expired license plates. Then let the six biggest bama fans in attendance mount her. This should encompass a combined ton last approximately 82 seconds total.
If she happens to survive that, pour kerosene on her and let one of the inbreds drop a lit Viceroy on her. Because you know there will be a plethora of cigarette-smoking cousin humpers in that crowd.
Anyone who offers support or assistance to either of these diptards should be stoned to death with full cans of Natural Light -- which can then be drunk by the bamtards who witness the event.
Death is too good for these morons. It must be torture.
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Knowing what we do now? Yep.
This is exactly the type case the death penalty is for. I just want to know why...why they did it and why such a horrendous method of death.
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This is exactly the type case the death penalty is for. I just want to know why...why they did it and why such a horrendous method of death.
Maybe they didn't care how horrendous it was. Not that it would be much better if they gave the boy sleeping pills or whatever. But, to me, this shows that they were willing to do whatever it took to get away with it. And this provided the best opportunity to make it look like an accident.
I cannot imagine what it's like to be baked to death. If it were an accident, it would be tough to live with. But doing it on purpose?
And if they both were in on it, it is dumbfounding. It wouldn't surprise me as much if the dumbass dad did it on his own. Financial troubles, wanting to punish the mom or whatever his mentally deranged reason could've been. But both? This is crazier than the mom who drowned the kids and claimed they were abducted many years ago in S.C., I believe.
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Maybe they didn't care how horrendous it was. Not that it would be much better if they gave the boy sleeping pills or whatever. But, to me, this shows that they were willing to do whatever it took to get away with it. And this provided the best opportunity to make it look like an accident.
I cannot imagine what it's like to be baked to death. If it were an accident, it would be tough to live with. But doing it on purpose?
And if they both were in on it, it is dumbfounding. It wouldn't surprise me as much if the dumbass dad did it on his own. Financial troubles, wanting to punish the mom or whatever his mentally deranged reason could've been. But both? This is crazier than the mom who drowned the kids and claimed they were abducted many years ago in S.C., I believe.
Both being in on it is what makes it so much more strange.
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Maybe they didn't care how horrendous it was. Not that it would be much better if they gave the boy sleeping pills or whatever. But, to me, this shows that they were willing to do whatever it took to get away with it. And this provided the best opportunity to make it look like an accident.
I cannot imagine what it's like to be baked to death. If it were an accident, it would be tough to live with. But doing it on purpose?
And if they both were in on it, it is dumbfounding. It wouldn't surprise me as much if the dumbass dad did it on his own. Financial troubles, wanting to punish the mom or whatever his mentally deranged reason could've been. But both? This is crazier than the mom who drowned the kids and claimed they were abducted many years ago in S.C., I believe.
Seriously. Can you imagine those conversations?
"So, hon, how much are season tickets this year? Damn. This damn kid's expensive. What if we just left him in the car on a hot summer day until his insides baked? JK, LOL."
"You're TERRIBLE! You shouldn't joke like that, but LOL wouldn't that be funny?"
"Yeah, I mean, I'd never do it or nuthin, but how long do you reckon that would take?"
"I don't know. Maybe we should google it."
"Hmm. Says here about 7 hours."
"Hmm. You're at work for about 8 every day, but you have that lunch breaks splitting it up. If you skipped lunch that'd be like 9 straight hours. Pretty plausible."
"Yeah, let's do this."
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This is exactly the type case the death penalty is for. I just want to know why...why they did it and why such a horrendous method of death.
Her quotes are somewhat troubling to me. I may be reaching here but her and this redneck husband of hers seem seriously mental.
Like K said, she's almost justifying it. Mental condition? Religious kooks? Something isn't right in their medulla oblongatas. There are so many redflags in what both of them are saying.
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Seriously. Can you imagine those conversations?
"So, hon, how much are season tickets this year? Damn. This damn kid's expensive. What if we just left him in the car for on a hot summer day until his insides baked? JK, LOL."
"You're TERRIBLE! You shouldn't joke like that, but LOL wouldn't that be funny?"
"Yeah, I mean, I'd never do it or nuthin, but how long do you reckon that would take?"
"I don't know. Maybe we should google it."
"Hmm. Says here about 7 hours."
"Hmm. You're at work for about 8 every day, but you have that lunch breaks splitting it up. If you skipped lunch that'd be like 9 straight hours. Pretty plausible."
"Yeah, let's do this."
Seriously....I don't think you are that far off there.
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Seriously....I don't think you are that far off there.
Yeah Bama jokes aside, I'm willing to bet this was a conversation had while cuddling in bed together discussing how much they hate having a kid or maybe that particular kid. I wonder if he had any disabilities.
This is fucking disgusting. I just can't imagine. I don't get it. How could anyone do this on purpose? Especially planned out? That's the kicker for me. A crazy person uses their hands. A crazy mother drowns her children in the bathtub because the demon man told her to. A crazy father strangles his son (just saw this happened in Queens today) because the voices told him enough was enough.
But to have two people plot a way to horrifically murder their own child? To go through planning stages and then essentially go through with the act for 9 hours? 9 hours of dwelling on it? 9 hours of doing your typical workday responsibilities? Then in the end have the ability to put on a show for witnesses and police?
Kaos was too lenient. They don't need to die at all. They need to be kept alive in a torture chamber and then moved to the hospital ward and then back to the chamber and back to the hospital and so on and so on.
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Yeah Bama jokes aside, I'm willing to bet this was a conversation had while cuddling in bed together discussing how much they hate having a kid or maybe that particular kid. I wonder if he had any disabilities.
This is fucking disgusting. I just can't imagine. I don't get it. How could anyone do this on purpose? Especially planned out? That's the kicker for me. A crazy person uses their hands. A crazy mother drowns her children in the bathtub because the demon man told her to. A crazy father strangles his son (just saw this happened in Queens today) because the voices told him enough was enough.
But to have two people plot a way to horrifically murder their own child? To go through planning stages and then essentially go through with the act for 9 hours? 9 hours of dwelling on it? 9 hours of doing your typical workday responsibilities? Then in the end have the ability to put on a show for witnesses and police?
Kaos was too lenient. They don't need to die at all. They need to be kept alive in a torture chamber and then moved to the hospital ward and then back to the chamber and back to the hospital and so on and so on.
"Saw" style.
I'm serious. Make them pick their torture.
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This just keeps getting weirder and weirder!
I want to believe that no parent could do that, much less both. But the odds are stacking against them.
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This just keeps getting weirder and weirder!
I want to believe that no parent could do that, much less both. But the odds are stacking against them.
I feel the same way as do most I talk to. The internet searches are just way too much for me personally. Legally its still a long way from a slam dunk conviction. I bet there are more twists to this yet and none good for these 2.
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And yet these two still take breaths, along with thousands of others sickos like them, while a guy like Philip Lutzenkirchen doesn't.
I said the same thing to a friend and he said, "it's the Lord's will, the Lord has a plan, etc, etc, etc."
My response kinda floored him. I said, "well, the Lord's will is apparently flipped on it's axis...or what we've been led to believe, throughout the past 1500 or so years has been made up similar to the Mormon religion as a way to answer the main question we all had and still have, which is why are we here. Therefore, whenever we couldn't explain things, we'd always resort to Lord's will."
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And yet these two still take breaths, along with thousands of others sickos like them, while a guy like Philip Lutzenkirchen doesn't.
I said the same thing to a friend and he said, "it's the Lord's will, the Lord has a plan, etc, etc, etc."
My response kinda floored him. I said, "well, the Lord's will is apparently flipped on it's axis...or what we've been led to believe, throughout the past 1500 or so years has been made up similar to the Mormon religion as a way to answer the main question we all had and still have, which is why are we here. Therefore, whenever we couldn't explain things, we'd always resort to Lord's will."
People who don't believe in an X amount of freewill scare me.
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And yet these two still take breaths, along with thousands of others sickos like them, while a guy like Philip Lutzenkirchen doesn't.
I said the same thing to a friend and he said, "it's the Lord's will, the Lord has a plan, etc, etc, etc."
My response kinda floored him. I said, "well, the Lord's will is apparently flipped on it's axis...or what we've been led to believe, throughout the past 1500 or so years has been made up similar to the Mormon religion as a way to answer the main question we all had and still have, which is why are we here. Therefore, whenever we couldn't explain things, we'd always resort to Lord's will."
I don't think there is any guarantee that being a Christian is always easy or seems fair in this life.
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I'm just thankful the baby won't be witness to the three bama losses and the endless beatings that would come.
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I'm just thankful the baby won't be witness to the three bama losses and the endless beatings that would come.
That would have been the wife's problem ass whippin anyway.
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That would have been the wife's problem ass whippin anyway.
1st Cousin...same thing.
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Preiminary hearing live on CNN now.
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Preiminary hearing live on CNN now.
He's wearing an orange shirt. :facepalm:
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Uh oh...he was sexting with wimmenz during the day. They now have potential motive. He is FUXXED!
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He's wearing an orange shirt. :facepalm:
Jail clothes looks like maybe
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Uh oh...he was sexting with wimmenz during the day. They now have potential motive. He is FUXXED!
Who the HELL would be sending him pictures of their boobs? He's a freaking doofus. And with teenagers! Oh hell. Why would a teenager be sending him her boobs?
And exchanging through SCOUT! Baaaa haaa haaa haaa haaa haaa....
Row Tahd, here a picture of my swole up dick.
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Who the HELL would be sending him pictures of their boobs? He's a freaking doofus. And with teenagers! Oh hell. Why would a teenager be sending him her boobs?
And exchanging through SCOUT! Baaaa haaa haaa haaa haaa haaa....
Row Tahd, here a picture of my swole up dick.
I said I thought it would get worse for him...it has and in a big way. He gonna fry.
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Death Penalty
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The couple had a $25,000 life insurance policy on their son. Harris’ wife “was complaining about his purchasing, sporadic purchasing or overcharging credit cards.â€
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I said I thought it would get worse for him...it has and in a big way. He gonna fry.
Where do I go to sign the petition? He's clearly being persecuted. Chasing 16-year old tail is an inalienable right.
Honestly? This is the worst thing I've seen in a long, long time. This guy is stupid as hell. He left a blazing trail of idiocy.
Just remember he has a DEGREE from UA. And so does his dumb wife. He graduated from there. What is that piece of paper worth? Clearly nothing. A moose on a three-day bender could get one.
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Harris backed up his car when he arrived at work (before parking), according to Stoddard, who says Harris didn't have a backup camera and would have had to use his rearview and side mirrors (or turn around). Harris reached over the center console to grab his laptop in the passenger seat, according to Stoddard. Investigators used a demonstrative aide in the car seat and found that the boy's head would have been visible over the top of the car seat. Harris sat in his car for 30 seconds before exiting the vehicle.
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The distance from Chick-fil-A to work is 0.6 miles -- "Not even a mile,"
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*Stoddard is the lead investigator*
Harris visited a subreddit about “people who die,†which shows videos of people dying (suicide, executions, war, etc.)
He also visited a subreddit called child-free: “They advocate not having any more children and adding to the biomass I guess is the best way they put it,†Stoddard said.
Harris also searched “how to survive in prison†and “age of consent for Georgia.â€
When Stoddard told him they were charging him, Harris allegedly responded by saying, “but there’s no malicious intent.â€
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. A moose on a three-day bender could get one.
The first time I've heard this one. :bar:
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I don't get why the dumb wife went along. Looks to me like she was trying to "save" their marriage. He didn't want kids, wanted to hammer 16-year old girls he met on the Bama football website and I guess she figured if the kid wasn't around they could go to more games together and worship Saban together and have rumpus smelly sex.
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*Stoddard is the lead investigator*
Harris visited a subreddit about “people who die,†which shows videos of people dying (suicide, executions, war, etc.)
He also visited a subreddit called child-free: “They advocate not having any more children and adding to the biomass I guess is the best way they put it,†Stoddard said.
Harris also searched “how to survive in prison†and “age of consent for Georgia.â€
When Stoddard told him they were charging him, Harris allegedly responded by saying, “but there’s no malicious intent.â€
All of this makes me have very, very bad thoughts toward this man. I don't care if he is mentally deranged, sicko, whatever. He knew right from wrong.
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I don't get why the dumb wife went along. Looks to me like she was trying to "save" their marriage. He didn't want kids, wanted to hammer 16-year old girls he met on the Bama football website and I guess she figured if the kid wasn't around they could go to more games together and worship Saban together and have rumpus smelly sex.
No shit! You really couldn't make this shit up if you were trying to make up a bad Bammer joke! Fucking bammer freaks!
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No offense to lawyers, but this is why I have a problem with the profession.
Defense lawyer's job is (should be) to make sure the defendant gets a fair trial and that the evidence is properly introduced.
This idea that their responsibility is to get the client "off" regardless of guilt or innocence is completely wrong IMO. Quibbling over technicalities, trying to get evidence that goes to the general nature of the person excluded... it just bothers me.
The guy researched heat deaths. He conspired with his wife. He consorted with teenage girls and showed them his chub. He connected with some of them. He killed his baby.
Why go through this farce?
ADDED: That blubberwuss was having sexting conversations with SIX women? Should I assume they were paid types? SIX women were attracted to that schlub enough to show him tits and coot? Holy cow. I need to get out more. I've got pictures of junk I need to send.
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Defense lawyer's job is (should be) to make sure the defendant gets a fair trial and that the evidence is properly introduced.
No.
He's entitled to a competent and zealous defense. That means fighting to exclude evidence if there is a valid (technical or not) rule/precedent supporting such exclusion.
Everybody is ready to cut corners on outrageous cases like this, but allowing conviction on anything less than evidence showing a full satisfaction of all elements of the crime (coupled with defeating any defenses) just opens the door for the State to cut corners on much less "clear" cases. Perhaps even yours or your loved ones'.
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No.
He's entitled to a competent and zealous defense. That means fighting to exclude evidence if there is a valid (technical or not) rule/precedent supporting such exclusion.
Everybody is ready to cut corners on outrageous cases like this, but allowing conviction on anything less than evidence showing a full satisfaction of all elements of the crime (coupled with defeating any defenses) just opens the door for the State to cut corners on much less "clear" cases. Perhaps even yours or your loved ones'.
see OJ Simpson case.
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He's entitled to a competent and zealous defense. That means fighting to exclude evidence if there is a valid (technical or not) rule/precedent supporting such exclusion.
Everybody is ready to cut corners on outrageous cases like this, but allowing conviction on anything less than evidence showing a full satisfaction of all elements of the crime (coupled with defeating any defenses) just opens the door for the State to cut corners on much less "clear" cases. Perhaps even yours or your loved ones'.
I get that.
But that's not how it's done. It seems to me that lawyers suborn perjury a lot of times when they try to manipulate evidence to portray some jackhole in a light that isn't real by getting evidence that portrays them as they really are removed from the game.
I don't agree with a lot of the reasonings, particularly the technical ones. I don't agree with "predjucing" the jury when fight to exclude things like his online history and the weiner shots he was sending to teenagers. Those things are clearly relevant to his state of mind.
Don't want to get into a big discussion about this and I certainly don't want to generate a novel from Vandy Vol wrongly explaining a million different things, so I've said all I want to say.
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And exchanging through SCOUT! Baaaa haaa haaa haaa haaa haaa....
LINK?!?
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LINK?!?
No link. The investigator said he was exchanging dick pics with a teenager on "a website called Scout."
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I get that.
But that's not how it's done. It seems to me that lawyers suborn perjury a lot of times when they try to manipulate evidence to portray some jackhole in a light that isn't real by getting evidence that portrays them as they really are removed from the game.
I don't agree with a lot of the reasonings, particularly the technical ones. I don't agree with "predjucing" the jury when fight to exclude things like his online history and the weiner shots he was sending to teenagers. Those things are clearly relevant to his state of mind.
Don't want to get into a big discussion about this and I certainly don't want to generate a novel from Vandy Vol wrongly explaining a million different things, so I've said all I want to say.
OK, if you want to end discussion there that's fine. This is just another one of those areas that you'll claim to know as much as the experts and find the weight of the entire profession to be unconvincing in the light of your immutable opinion.
see OJ Simpson case.
Skillful defense strategy and colossal fuck up by the prosecution.
I guess I bristle at the notion that the defense lawyer should (especially in the case of OJ...but even at the PD level) just cash a paycheck and make sure that the trial is "fair". Whatever that means.
If a lawyer is getting paid to advocate for a client and that lawyer does any less than utilize all legal means at his disposal to do so, then the lawyer has done his profession a disservice.
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Skillful defense strategy and colossal fuck up by the prosecution.
I guess I bristle at the notion that the defense lawyer should (especially in the case of OJ...but even at the PD level) just cash a paycheck and make sure that the trial is "fair". Whatever that means.
If a lawyer is getting paid to advocate for a client and that lawyer does any less than utilize all legal means at his disposal to do so, then the lawyer has done his profession a disservice.
I don't think you should advocate for a guilty client. Negotiate a fair sentence, yes. Advocate? I don't think so.
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I don't think you should advocate for a guilty client. Negotiate a fair sentence, yes. Advocate? I don't think so.
You certainly have the option, as a lawyer, to refrain to represent almost any client. That said, I'd have a hard time respecting a fellow lawyer who did not believe in my statement re: zealous and competent defense.
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You certainly have the option, as a lawyer, to refrain to represent almost any client. That said, I'd have a hard time respecting a fellow lawyer who did not believe in my statement re: zealous and competent defense.
I'm just curious, and no offense, but do you ever put any thought into the effects of your zealous and competent defense upon society as a whole?
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No link. The investigator said he was exchanging dick pics with a teenager on "a website called Scout."
I know this is true, but I NEED a link. Anyone?
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I don't think you should advocate for a guilty client. Negotiate a fair sentence, yes. Advocate? I don't think so.
Its fine to have the opinion that that should be the way things are but that's not the way they are. A lawyer is ethically bound to advocate for his client. And the system is set up that way.
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I'm just curious, and no offense, but do you ever put any thought into the effects of your zealous and competent defense upon society as a whole?
Absolutely. Enjoying the right to a zealous and competent defense buttresses societal confidence in the legal system, thus ensuring the machine of society continues to run.
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Absolutely. Enjoying the right to a zealous and competent defense buttresses societal confidence in the legal system, thus ensuring the machine of society continues to run.
Of course. Atticus Finch was one of my favorite characters when I was young.
But you personally, would you ever turn down a case because you were pretty sure you'd rather that particular fella didn't enjoy the benefits of your expert defense? Like maybe you just felt like the streets were a bad place for that guy to be?
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Of course. Atticus Finch was one of my favorite characters when I was young.
But you personally, would you ever turn down a case because you were pretty sure you'd rather that particular fella didn't enjoy the benefits of your expert defense? Like maybe you just felt like the streets were a bad place for that guy to be?
With the disclaimer that I do not practice criminal law...absolutely I'd decline to represent some folks. That said, those who take on the clients (to satisfy whatever motivation: money, justice, etc) owe them the duty of zealous and competent defense. This is most important at the PD level, since those folks make paltry salaries. It's the biggest fault in the system, in my opinion.
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Of course. Atticus Finch was one of my favorite characters when I was young.
But you personally, would you ever turn down a case because you were pretty sure you'd rather that particular fella didn't enjoy the benefits of your expert defense? Like maybe you just felt like t. streets were a bad place for that guy to be?
I cannot answer for Wes, but I personally would not unless there were something personal involved and then that would disqualify me anyway on a conflict of interest. But generally speaking it's never personal and if they can pay the fee I would take it. I might try to charge a fee that would exclude them but if they paid what I asked I would represent them...if I were not a prosecutor...which I still at this point in time.
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With the disclaimer that I do not practice criminal law...absolutely I'd decline to represent some folks. That said, those who take on the clients (to satisfy whatever motivation: money, justice, etc) owe them the duty of zealous and competent defense. This is most important at the PD level, since those folks make paltry salaries. It's the biggest fault in the system, in my opinion.
The disparity between the defense some poor shlub gets from the standard court appointed attorney and a great one on retainer is wide indeed.
The perception that if you're rich enough you can "buy" your way out of a conviction has always bothered me. At a certain point you can definitely put more resources into your defense than the state will be willing to field against you. I can definitely understand why a person would take some of these cases and fight valiantly for someone that is obviously quite frankly evil but I don't think I could do it.
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Of course. Atticus Finch was one of my favorite characters when I was young.
But you personally, would you ever turn down a case because you were pretty sure you'd rather that particular fella didn't enjoy the benefits of your expert defense? Like maybe you just felt like the streets were a bad place for that guy to be?
Back when I first started in practice, we were taking on anything because hell, we weren't even in the phone book yet. I started doing appointed criminal defense work and at that time, the way it was handled was that a group of us vulture...err, lawyers, showed up at First Appearances and hoped the Judge would appoint you a case. I needed the work but there were several times that I heard the charges read and slinked out of the room so I wouldn't get that case. Like the lady charged with beating the hell out of her infant son and breaking several bones. I hated her instantly and didn't think I could do my job because of it. Most of the other guys were grizzled veterans and saw it as just another case. I wanted no part of it.
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Back when I first started in practice, we were taking on anything because hell, we weren't even in the phone book yet. I started doing appointed criminal defense work and at that time, the way it was handled was that a group of us vulture...err, lawyers, showed up at First Appearances and hoped the Judge would appoint you a case. I needed the work but there were several times that I heard the charges read and slinked out of the room so I wouldn't get that case. Like the lady charged with beating the hell out of her infant son and breaking several bones. I hated her instantly and didn't think I could do my job because of it. Most of the other guys were grizzled veterans and saw it as just another case. I wanted no part of it.
Good thing for me, I'm highly effective at obtaining confessions. That way the court appointed attorneys can sit around, back slap each other, pretend like they give a shit about whatever thief I've ever put in jail, and leave me out of their circle-jerk of injustice when they sentence the burglar to a 780 year prison sentence, diverted to 12 days of community corrections with unsupervised probation.
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Good thing for me, I'm highly effective at obtaining confessions. That way the court appointed attorneys can sit around, back slap each other, pretend like they give a shit about whatever thief I've ever put in jail, and leave me out of their circle-jerk of injustice when they sentence the burglar to a 780 year prison sentence, diverted to 12 days of community corrections with unsupervised probation.
Just the opposite in this county. First, the long time D.A. is a sunuvabitch. Every case needs the max sentence and he looks at it as an opportunity to get in front of the camera and tell the world how safe he's making this county. Truthfully, he does a hell of a job. I haven't done any of that work in at least 10 years and they changed the format (In case you don't know it) to assigning contracted attorneys to each Judge. Couldn't get an appointed case if I wanted one. I don't. But back when I did, I saw a couple of Judge's that really looked intimidated by the D.A. If he tried the case, he normally kicked major ass.
But the other thing is back when I was doing appointed criminal work, I was all gung ho about doing everything right and scared to death of screwing up. I quickly noticed though, that the other lawyers really didn't give a flying monkey fuck about their appointed clients. I'd go to arraignments and there would always be 10-12 cases called where the defendant didn't show. The lawyers would just casually announce, "Judge, I sent him a letter" and go back to yukking it up. If I had any type hearing and couldn't reach my client, I was in the car headed down to the projects trying to track him down. Most of these guys just wanted to get the best deal they could and bill the State for some time.
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I would only add to all of this discussion that the psychological battle between right and wrong, justice and injustice, likely plays a substantial role in turning most lawyers toward sucking cock.
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I would only add to all of this discussion that the psychological battle between right and wrong, justice and injustice, likely plays a substantial role in turning most lawyers toward sucking cock.
Look, sometimes money gets tight.
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Don't want to get into a big discussion about this and I certainly don't want to generate a novel from Vandy Vol wrongly explaining a million different things, so I've said all I want to say.
(http://thumbs.newschoolers.com/index.php?src=http://www.smosh.com/sites/default/files/bloguploads/u-mad-1.jpg&size=400x1000)
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I know this is true, but I NEED a link. Anyone?
lawyertalk, lawyertalk, lawyertalk - don't you guys see that Chizzad wants to see some bammerdick?
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(http://thumbs.newschoolers.com/index.php?src=http://www.smosh.com/sites/default/files/bloguploads/u-mad-1.jpg&size=400x1000)
YOU....lookest over there.
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Absolutely. Enjoying the right to a zealous and competent defense buttresses societal confidence in the legal system, thus ensuring the machine of society continues to run.
^^^He said buttress. :haha:
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Fuck everything about /r/childfree. Never read more spiteful and malicious puke in my life than what you can find there.
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Wait a second...I missed something. Sexting? Scout?
Am I reading this correctly? He left his kid to die in a car then sexted with girls throughout the day before telling his buddies he'd be a little late to the movie?
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Got 140°?
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But the other thing is back when I was doing appointed criminal work, I was all gung ho about doing everything right and scared to death of screwing up. I quickly noticed though, that the other lawyers really didn't give a flying monkey fuck about their appointed clients. I'd go to arraignments and there would always be 10-12 cases called where the defendant didn't show. The lawyers would just casually announce, "Judge, I sent him a letter" and go back to yukking it up. If I had any type hearing and couldn't reach my client, I was in the car headed down to the projects trying to track him down. Most of these guys just wanted to get the best deal they could and bill the State for some time.
As many times as I have sat in the court room and just had to watch lawyers sitting around and talking about how drunk they got the night before (or currently are) and do exactly that "Judge, I sent him/her a letter" "request to continue, and I will see if I can get in touch with him/her". Most lawyers I have seen are doing just that, collecting a paycheck. It pisses me off that lawyers try to get thier turd of a client off on a technicality. When over half the time they walk in and have to ask ask the deputy that brought them to court which one their client is because they have never even talked to them before walking in the court room. Much less know anything about the case. Then when they do get a case and actually look at it before court and know a little bit about the case, they do their best to get it thrown out even when they know the sun of a bitch is guilty. That's why we have so much crap going to the supreme court. I understand working for your client, but let's call a spade a spade and move on with it. Send their ass to prison, and make them actually pay their debt to society
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Link for the "Scout" reference (43:00 mark)
http://mashable.com/2014/07/03/hot-car-death-justin-ross-harris/?utm_cid=Mash-Prod-RSS-Feedburner-All-Partial (http://mashable.com/2014/07/03/hot-car-death-justin-ross-harris/?utm_cid=Mash-Prod-RSS-Feedburner-All-Partial)
Also, Mr. & Mrs. Harris are quilty and both should be placed in a black sedan, with bulletproof glass, locked windows and welded doors and be made to sit in the Nevada desert for 12 hours.
The child had abrasions on the back of his head and on his face, the wife was told that Mr. Harris didn't bring their son to the daycare, she immediately responded with, "what do I do...he must've left him in the car." Then at the police station, they left Mr. & Mrs. Harris together in a room, she asked him, "did you say to much?" When a reporter asked Mrs. Harris about how her child looked, she said, "his eyes and mouth were closed and that he looked peaceful." The investigator said that was not the case, he said, "his eyes and mouth were open and he had visible wounds on his face."
Here's what will come out in the end...
Mr. & Mrs. Harris's marriage was failing. He had already cheated on her before, with her knowledge, and was still cheating on her. She wanted to make the marriage work, because she's apparently a fuckin mongoloid like him, and they love each other. They decided that they'll go on a second honeymoon (or first honeymoon if they didn't get the chance to do so previously), to spark the relationship back up. They were kinda strapped for money to afford the plane tickets and the vacation. They have two insurance policies on the baby ($25,000 & $2,500). They just need a way to get the money, without robbing a bank and a way to leave their baby, while they go off.
So, Mr. Harris charges around $4,000 on the credit card, for the sky miles & "accidentally" leaves the baby in the car in 88 degree heat for 8-10 hours (he'd just watched a video, a few days before, of a veterinarian sitting in a vehicle, in 90 degree heat, for a few hours, to show the temperature and explain how it felt and how it might feel to an animal)...needless to say, Mr. Harris knew for a fact that 8+ hours, in a vehicle, in 88 degree heat, would kill a baby. He finally talks to his wife, at the police station, after failing to reach her when he "realized" his son was dead and after he told the police officers to "shut the fuck up" when they asked him to put the phone away. The phone conservation between he and his wife lasted a little over a minute and I can pretty much guess what it consisted of (he's dead, are you sure, yes I'm sure, okay just don't talk to anyone about it, okay bye).
Also, the investigators will find more stuff about his life than he knew still existed, as well as his wife's. There'll be child pornography on his home and probably work computers and more nasty shit, stuff that he thinks that he wiped.
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This is the problem I have with defense attorneys.
Kilgore, the defense attorney, asked the judge to dismiss the charges against Harris. He said there wasn't enough evidence against him to even support a misdemeanor, and said Harris simply forgot his son was in the car.
"Ross pulled out of Chick-fil-A and his mind went elsewhere,'' Kilgore said. "We forget in an instant because our mind races ahead."
"The results of forgetting in this case were absolutely catastrophic, but an accident doesn't become a crime because the results are catastrophic,'' Kilgore said.
How can he stand up there with a straight face and a clean conscience and promote this theory? After everything that was presented and all the evidence to the contrary?
The Chick Fil A is five minutes from work. Five minutes. He fed his kid at Chick Fil A and then FORGOT to to take him from daycare because he was so busy snapping photos of his junk?
I understand defending the guy and making sure his rights aren't violated but it is an absolute affront to human decency to promote this "he just forgot" theory and request a dismissal of charges. And before you retort I know that it's standard practice to ask for dismissal of charges -- I find that offensive as well.
At some point the line between competent defense and asshattery needs to be drawn. Kilgore opted for asshattery.
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no way he "forgot" - the CFA where they went is at the corner of Cumberland and Paces Ferry, both divided four-lane parkways just inside 285. The access to that shopping center is only on Cumberland, and work and daycare are both left-turns out of there. To go to you pull left onto Cumberland, and would have to make a left at that big intersection with Paces Ferry to go to the main HD campus across 285 (where the daycare would be). As he pulled onto Cumberland, he probably had to pause in the median to get into traffic and immediately crossed those left-turn lanes to go straight across Paces to his office, which is further up Cumberland.
It's not "forgetting" in those few minutes going a half mile. It would be forgetting as soon as he turned out of the parking lot.
I also understand that he parked his car backwards. Wonder if he also made sure to park in an unshaded space, since a lot of parking in that area is in decks or shaded by landscaping.
It would surely change venue if it ever went to trial, so no chance for this Cobb County resident to be on that jury. Dude needs to be in gen pop when he gets to the big house. Mom should be in custody now too.
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This is the problem I have with defense attorneys.
How can he stand up there with a straight face and a clean conscience and promote this theory? After everything that was presented and all the evidence to the contrary?
The Chick Fil A is five minutes from work. Five minutes. He fed his kid at Chick Fil A and then FORGOT to to take him from daycare because he was so busy snapping photos of his junk?
I understand defending the guy and making sure his rights aren't violated but it is an absolute affront to human decency to promote this "he just forgot" theory and request a dismissal of charges. And before you retort I know that it's standard practice to ask for dismissal of charges -- I find that offensive as well.
At some point the line between competent defense and asshattery needs to be drawn. Kilgore opted for asshattery.
Yes, it sucks, but the purpose of the defense attorney is to represent the defendant. Everyone gets a right to a fair trial. The prosecution is accusing a man of murdering his child. If Harris wanted to, he could have claimed that he was in Europe that day. If he hired an attorney who took the case, he could tell his attorney about his trip to Europe and the attorney would bring his defense to the courtroom.
"My client cannot be guilty of murder. He was in Europe that day!"
Even though everyone would know it was bullshit including the attorney, Justin Ross Harris would still get his right to defend himself using a qualified person to go through the legal proceedings.
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Yes, it sucks, but the purpose of the defense attorney is to represent the defendant. Everyone gets a right to a fair trial. The prosecution is accusing a man of murdering his child. If Harris wanted to, he could have claimed that he was in Europe that day. If he hired an attorney who took the case, he could tell his attorney about his trip to Europe and the attorney would bring his defense to the courtroom.
"My client cannot be guilty of murder. He was in Europe that day!"
Even though everyone would know it was bullshit including the attorney, Justin Ross Harris would still get his right to defend himself using a qualified person to go through the legal proceedings.
There's a difference between being fair and outright lying.
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There's a difference between being fair and outright lying.
Well, yes, of course. The defendant is lying. The lawyer representing that lie is just going through the legal motions. Everyone has the right to provide a defense for an accusation.
I think you're putting the lie in the lawyer's mouth. The lawyer isn't the one lying. He's simply a middle man who knows how to smoothen the statements and evidence in a courtroom to fit legal proceedings.
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Well, yes, of course. The defendant is lying. The lawyer representing that lie is just going through the legal motions. Everyone has the right to provide a defense for an accusation.
I think you're putting the lie in the lawyer's mouth. The lawyer isn't the one lying. He's simply a middle man who knows how to smoothen the statements and evidence in a courtroom to fit legal proceedings.
I could not in good conscience do anything more than making sure no lies were told by the prosecution. Mounting a false "defense" for someone of this level of moral depravity isn't something I could do and live with myself.
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I could not in good conscience do anything more than making sure no lies were told by the prosecution. Mounting a false "defense" for someone of this level of moral depravity isn't something I could do and live with myself.
How do you know the prosecution isn't lying? How do you know the police aren't lying? The defense is there to make sure law enforcement isn't framing this guy. Or maybe there's another culprit in the case. Maybe there's just something else. Unless the guy admitted to the defense attorney that he committed premeditated murder on his child, then the defense is simply using his side of the story to refute the prosecution's claims.
It's not a false defense. No matter how much the media has swayed our opinion, this guy still gets his say in court, and I for one am glad that there exists a defense attorney willing to carry out due process.
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I didn't hear the defense ask for proof.
All they did was say all of the relevant things were irrelevant. So what if be searched murdering kids, his wife asked if he messed up and said too much, he sent dick pics while a child was baking to death, he searched for childless life info. Ignore every bit of that. He accidentally forgot.
Defense lawyers should have to show good faith. If he gets the guy off he has to let him and his whore wife babysit kids and grand kids for the next five years.
Get a rapist off and he has to live with the defense attorney for a year. Murderers, whatever. Take personal responsibility.
I bet the zealous defense shit would dry up in a hurry.
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In that link to the hearing, that I posted earlier, two things got Mr. Harris to take a "oh shit" type swallow. The first one was the investigator talking about just scratching the surface when asked about the information on Harris' computers. The other was when the investigators spoke about the abrasions on the baby's face and on the back of his head.
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I hope that they announce everything they find on his computer.
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I hope that they announce everything they find on his computer.
Including the REC scandals discussed in the BamaMag hidden forums. :hammer:
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Including the REC scandals discussed in the BamaMag hidden forums. :hammer:
Yup
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If the bama shirt fit .... you must FRY that dumb sumbitch.
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If the bama shirt fit .... you must FRY that dumb sumbitch.
Problem is he bought a medium
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Strap the motherfudgeer into a Hyundai SUV covered in Bama stickers in a Wal Mart parking lot in the middle of Tuscaloosa on July 4 and weld the fudgeing doors shut. Make it a public event.
Make his pig-eyed wife watch while he burns to death. Chain her naked to the light pole in front of the car. As he takes his last breath, let one of the attendees (whoever won the drawing) perform an impromptu hysterectomy on her using whatever tools can be acquired by searching the trunks of the three nearest cars with both bama stickers and expired license plates. Then let the six biggest bama fans in attendance mount her. This should encompass a combined ton last approximately 82 seconds total.
If she happens to survive that, pour kerosene on her and let one of the inbreds drop a lit Viceroy on her. Because you know there will be a plethora of ecigs (http://www.ecigfiend.com/products/)-smoking cousin humpers in that crowd.
Anyone who offers support or assistance to either of these diptards should be stoned to death with full cans of Natural Light -- which can then be drunk by the bamtards who witness the event.
Death is too good for these morons. It must be torture.
Too bad and sad..A baby lost her life due to negligence of her mother..World has changed lot in recent years..
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Lawyers, is she doing this as a way to try and prove innocence?
http://www.ajc.com/news/news/report-mother-of-toddler-in-cobb-hot-car-death-pas/nhRrQ/ (http://www.ajc.com/news/news/report-mother-of-toddler-in-cobb-hot-car-death-pas/nhRrQ/)
Report: Mother of toddler in Cobb hot car death passes polygraph test
July 3, 2014
Kelly J. Huff / Pool / Marietta Daily Journal / AP
Leanna Harris, wife of Justin Ross Harris, the father of a toddler who died after police say he was left in a hot car for about seven hours, looks on during her husband's bond hearing in Cobb County Magistrate Court on July 3, 2014, in Marietta, Ga. Harris, who police say intentionally killed his toddler son by leaving the boy inside a hot SUV, was exchanging nude photos with women the day his son died and had looked at websites that advocated against having children, a detective testified Thursday. At that same hearing, a judge refused to grant bond for Harris, meaning he will remain in jail.
The mother of a 22-month-old Cobb toddler who died after being left in a hot car for seven hours on a 90-degree day in June passed a polygraph test, unidentified sources told ABC News.
Fox 5 Atlanta responded to that report by tweeting that the polygraph was administered by Leanna Harris’ lawyer rather than by police.
In an exclusive interview Monday morning with Good Morning America, friend Angie Bond said Harris “had absolutely nothing to do with the accident.†The mother has not been charged in the June 18 death of Cooper Harris.
“She had nothing to hide,†said Bond, Harris’ best friend of 15 years. †… She loves her little boy. She misses her little boy desperately. And that will never change.â€
She talked about Ross Harris, the man who prosecutors allege purposely left the couple’s son in the back of his SUV outside his office while texting lewd pictures of himself to other women. A Cobb grand jury this month indicted Ross Harris on malice murder as well as seven other felonies.
“He absolutely adored Cooper,†Bond said. “He was a very hands-on father. Always playing with him.â€
She acknowledged that Leanna and Ross Harris’ marriage was not perfect.
“It’s been rocky,†Bond said. “But through it all, they always wanted to work through things.â€
Bond also addressed comments attributed to Leanna Harris by investigators, including testimony by Cobb police Det. Phil Stoddard that, when Harris was reunited with her husband after learning he had been charged with murder, she asked him, “Did you say too much?â€
“She was just saying, ‘Did you run your mouth? Did you talk so much it makes you look guilty?’†Bond said. “He was definitely a talker.â€
Leanna Harris has never doubted Ross Harris’ innocence or been angry with him about Cooper’s death, Bond said.
“She knows how much Ross loved Cooper,†she said.
Ross Harris is expected in court later this week.
Also read this a couple of weeks ago. http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/04/justice/hot-car-death-ross-harris-grand-jury/ (http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/04/justice/hot-car-death-ross-harris-grand-jury/)
He was indicted on eight counts with malice murder and two counts of felony murder. In a week or two we will know if they seek the death penalty. I don't know why I keep up with this, it makes me sad, but it's like a train wreck.
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“She was just saying, ‘Did you run your mouth? Did you talk so much it makes you look guilty?’†Bond said. “He was definitely a talker.â€
Leanna Harris has never doubted Ross Harris’ innocence or been angry with him about Cooper’s death, Bond said.
Something is definitely wrong with this. I have no clue if she is guilty, but this seems that she doesn't really care. How could you not be angry? If my wife had done something like that, I would be pissed as fuck...
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Lawyers, is she doing this as a way to try and prove innocence?
I haven't kept up with the case...has she been charged yet? More often than not, a polygraph is used in criminal cases in order to get a detective or prosecutor to not proceed with an investigation or filing of charges, or to drop any charges that have been filed.
The results of the polygraph can be admissible in court, and so it can be used after the trial has commenced in order to prove innocence, but generally the prosecution has to consent to the use of the polygraph test before it takes place. The main reason for this is that the prosecution needs to approve the questions that will be asked, as well as have the opportunity to have their own questions asked.
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Lawyers, is she doing this as a way to try and prove innocence?
Must say that I haven't delved into the subject as of late. I've been more involved with product liability and high dollar trusts and have been busier than a long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs.
At the same time, from glimpsing over it heretofore and whatnot, I believe that the perpetrator has an constituent right to a fair and incredible trail.
Vandy and I are both men of the law but let's face it, it doesn't take defense attorney to be able to tell a lot just by reading the affidavid. If this were my client, I would filibuster.
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Something is definitely wrong with this. I have no clue if she is guilty, but this seems that she doesn't really care. How could you not be angry? If my wife had done something like that, I would be pissed as fuck...
Yeah but you'd get over it you have like 10 others.
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Something is definitely wrong with this. I have no clue if she is guilty, but this seems that she doesn't really care. How could you not be angry? If my wife had done something like that, I would be pissed as fuck...
First off, you really don't know how you would feel.
I would imagine she is heart broken and is just as heart broken for him that this happened. Now if it is proven that he planned and executed this, then I would think she would change her position.
I will not venture to say how I would feel in this situation. People grieve in different ways.
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First off, you really don't know how you would feel.
I would imagine she is heart broken and is just as heart broken for him that this happened. Now if it is proven that he planned and executed this, then I would think she would change her position.
I will not venture to say how I would feel in this situation. People grieve in different ways.
Fair enough...but I am pretty sure I would be pissed. I'm also pretty sure that the first thing I would ask is "How the fuck did you forget the baby?" Not, "Did you say too much?"
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I haven't kept up with the case...has she been charged yet? More often than not, a polygraph is used in criminal cases in order to get a detective or prosecutor to not proceed with an investigation or filing of charges, or to drop any charges that have been filed.
The results of the polygraph can be admissible in court, and so it can be used after the trial has commenced in order to prove innocence, but generally the prosecution has to consent to the use of the polygraph test before it takes place. The main reason for this is that the prosecution needs to approve the questions that will be asked, as well as have the opportunity to have their own questions asked.
As far as I know she hasn't been charged with anything yet. The bold answered what I was thinking.
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Fair enough...but I am pretty sure I would be pissed. I'm also pretty sure that the first thing I would ask is "How the fuck did you forget the baby?" Not, "Did you say too much?"
Also in the same boat with you.