Tigers X - Number one Source to Talk Auburn Tigers Sports
Pat Dye Field => War Damn Eagle => Topic started by: Snaggletiger on September 11, 2012, 03:35:56 PM
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of the program....I've actually had more than one discussion in the past several weeks about another area that might be in need of a change. I know this may be BLASPHEMY to many but could some of our troubles be a result of our strength and conditioning methods?
I attended two Yox seminars in first couple of years at AU and as he readily admits, his approach is different than most. He focuses far more on exercises, lifts, runs etc. that translate more toward what you would be doing on the field. For instance, I don't know if he still uses this approach, but he had guys bench pressing with their grip in much closer, almost a tricep press, because a lineman blocks with his hands inside and that's where he feels the strength should be. Sounds good in theory and seems to make sense.
Anyone recall a guy that went by "The Deacon"? Might have been on Ghey Nation but he claimed to have worked with Yox as a GA, if memory serves. But, he was very critical of Yox's methods, claiming he wasn't interested in bulking guys up and getting them stronger. Said his methods were more about conditioning than building real strength. Admittedly, we constantly talk about getting this guy or that guy in here and "Yoxercising" him up to 250 or 315. And our players do seem to consistently put on weight each year....except McProne. But, I also think that's a natural occurrence when you're 17-22 and weight training and sitting at a training table with the best foods all day every day.
I'm not dogging the guy. He knows more about his craft than I could ever dream of learning. And yes, I see the pic of Porsche throwing a couple of tons overhead. But if we're going back to more of a ground and pound style, do we need to focus more on our linemen squatting small busses and benching Volvos? As one coach I talked to said when we were talking about it, "I'm sure he's good but sometimes you just need a change". Are our defensive tackles getting pushed around for a reason? Are our linebackers not getting off blocks because they're getting physically whipped? Just food for thought while we ponder why we suck everywhere else.
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Then why were the LBs under Tubs fucking bad ass? You walk up to Dansby and tell him that he's getting whipped.
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Then why were the LBs under Tubs fucking bad ass? You walk up to Dansby and tell him that he's getting whipped.
I'll slap da' taste out his mouf. With a few exceptions, Dansby...Thomas..the LB's under CTT were smaller and quicker.
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I'll slap da' taste out his mouf. With a few exceptions, Dansby...Thomas..the LB's under CTT were smaller and quicker.
Was about to say the same thing. Most RBs weve had the last 4 years were bigger than a lot of LBs we had from 2000-2008. Dansby and DT were exceptions. Remember Karibbe DEEDEE? Dude was about 201.
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I think for ever Karibe DeeDee you produce, I could name Alex Lincoln or a Pounds.
But thinking back, who was the DC before Chizik? Lovell? I thought his philosophy was to take "bigger" defensive backs and move them to a hybrid linebacker/DB role? Or was that Chizik? fuck, I can't remember. Or was it more a philosophy of Tubs?
Wonder if that's why Gibbs bolted?
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I think we're reaching.
I was with you on your initial take, Snags.
Holland is terrible and Frazier is fucking disgraceful.
That's the problem. Secondary problems that can be inferred from that are A) Chizik shouldn't have let it get this bad going into the season and B) There's a major problem with developing talent and actually coaching.
That being said, Chizik can't be expected to coach, for example, the QB directly. So what does he do? He sees it's a problem, and what does he do? Hire someone renowned for developing QBs. Apparently, he's beyond help.
Then on the other hand, he should certainly be held accountable for his staff not producing, and recognize that there is a major problem and fix it...if that's actually the problem.
I'm bumfuzzled.
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I heard the cheerleaders sucked too.
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I heard the cheerleaders sucked too.
Sure, but do they swallow?
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Yoxall was one of Tuberville's biggest selling points when I was in the athletic department. Yox was awarded some trophies or something for being a badass strength and conditioning coach, and he was very articulate when communicating his philosophy to parents and recruits.
No clue why the strength is down the past two years.
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of the program....I've actually had more than one discussion in the past several weeks about another area that might be in need of a change. I know this may be BLASPHEMY to many but could some of our troubles be a result of our strength and conditioning methods?
I attended two Yox seminars in first couple of years at AU and as he readily admits, his approach is different than most. He focuses far more on exercises, lifts, runs etc. that translate more toward what you would be doing on the field. For instance, I don't know if he still uses this approach, but he had guys bench pressing with their grip in much closer, almost a tricep press, because a lineman blocks with his hands inside and that's where he feels the strength should be. Sounds good in theory and seems to make sense.
Anyone recall a guy that went by "The Deacon"? Might have been on Ghey Nation but he claimed to have worked with Yox as a GA, if memory serves. But, he was very critical of Yox's methods, claiming he wasn't interested in bulking guys up and getting them stronger. Said his methods were more about conditioning than building real strength. Admittedly, we constantly talk about getting this guy or that guy in here and "Yoxercising" him up to 250 or 315. And our players do seem to consistently put on weight each year....except McProne. But, I also think that's a natural occurrence when you're 17-22 and weight training and sitting at a training table with the best foods all day every day.
I'm not dogging the guy. He knows more about his craft than I could ever dream of learning. And yes, I see the pic of Porsche throwing a couple of tons overhead. But if we're going back to more of a ground and pound style, do we need to focus more on our linemen squatting small busses and benching Volvos? As one coach I talked to said when we were talking about it, "I'm sure he's good but sometimes you just need a change". Are our defensive tackles getting pushed around for a reason? Are our linebackers not getting off blocks because they're getting physically whipped? Just food for thought while we ponder why we suck everywhere else.
(http://i.imgur.com/SbISy.gif)
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I've been saying the same thing the past week, we seem weak up front (almost no push from the interior guys), but yet we have two Freshmen getting a pretty good push. Note, theses guys in the interior (Guards and Center) have been in the weight program for 2-4 years...I don't get it. Same goes for our DTs and LBers. Have they not been in off-season weight programs? If so, are they doing anything besides Lolley Gaggin around?
Off Topic: Are the players wearing their Power Bands this year like they did for the 2010 season?
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I heard the cheerleaders sucked too.
The real problem is the damn stripper boots being worn by the majorettes.
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We have lots of issues. I don't think Yox is one of them.
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We have lots of issues. I don't think Yox is one of them.
Oh come on, it makes for a better stew if we throw all the ingredients in the pot.
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We have lots of issues. I don't think Yox is one of them.
Look, bucko, we're ripping everyone. It's scroched earth for Auburn. I'm just waiting to see if the 50 yard line logo at JHS has the proper color contrast this weekend. If not....the painter/striper guys best duck for cover. You're either with us, or agin us.
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Look, bucko, we're ripping everyone. It's scroched earth for Auburn. I'm just waiting to see if the 50 yard line logo at JHS has the proper color contrast this weekend. If not....the painter/striper guys best duck for cover. You're either with us, or agin us.
My 10:25:02 is better than yours. :haha: :haha: :haha:
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Have we talked about the Defense yet?
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Have we talked about the Defense yet?
They need heavy squats
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They need heavy squats
With Jake 10 yards downfield how many can he get in before the running back gets to him?
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With Jake 10 yards downfield how many can he get in before the running back gets to him?
Squat...backpedal...squat...backpedal....squat....backpedal.
Run awaaaaayyyyyy....
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I think for ever Karibe DeeDee you produce, I could name Alex Lincoln or a Pounds.
But thinking back, who was the DC before Chizik? Lovell? I thought his philosophy was to take "bigger" defensive backs and move them to a hybrid linebacker/DB role? Or was that Chizik? fudge, I can't remember. Or was it more a philosophy of Tubs?
Wonder if that's why Gibbs bolted?
That was Tubs, he learned that (along with how to cheat) from Jimmy Johnson at Miami. That was his philosophy there and with the Cowboys.
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Squat...backpedal...squat...backpedal....squat....backpedal.
Run awaaaaayyyyyy....
Jake Holland is a 6-0, 231-pound Inside Linebacker from Pelham, AL. He is ranked No. 231 in the country by 247Sports.
Holland is the No. 7 recruit in Alabama (AL) and is the No. 7 Inside Linebacker in the nation.
Holland has a 247Sports rating of 91, making him a 4-star prospect.
He has committed to Auburn Tigers.
From His BIO-SO the question is were there only 6 others in the state and 230 in the nation?
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how to cheat from Jimmy Johnson at Miami.
That was his philosophy there and with the Cowboys.
Look man, paying players is perfectly legal in the NFL :thumsup: Therefore, Jimmy was a natural in pro ball.
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We have lots of issues. I don't think Yox is one of them.
Agree. Just one example I know, but Dee Ford is playing about 50lbs heavier than when he arrived at Auburn. Yox can bulk them up if they need it. He can take weight off them too. I think I read Whittaker lost about 20lbs in the off season because they wanted him quicker. Can't tell it's helped any though, but that's not on Yox.
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Agree. Just one example I know, but Dee Ford is playing about 50lbs heavier than when he arrived at Auburn. Yox can bulk them up if they need it. He can take weight off them too. I think I read Whittaker lost about 20lbs in the off season because they wanted him quicker. Can't tell it's helped any though, but that's not on Yox.
All you have to do is look at pictures to see Yox is doing his job. Most of these dudes are massive and chiseled. They look conditioned on the surface. Issue is in the head/coaching/developing.
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Jake Holland is a 6-0, 231-pound Inside Linebacker from Pelham, AL. He is ranked No. 231 in the country by 247Sports.
Holland is the No. 7 recruit in Alabama (AL) and is the No. 7 Inside Linebacker in the nation.
Holland has a 247Sports rating of 91, making him a 4-star prospect.
He has committed to Auburn Tigers.
From His BIO-SO the question is were there only 6 others in the state and 230 in the nation?
The real burning question is why is this player, and one like Frazier, seemingly regressing in their ability to play the game they were recruited to play while at Auburn, while across the state there's a program churning out NFL draft picks left and right from the same talent pool with similar recruiting rankings?
4 star, #5 at position, 89 nationally http://rivals.yahoo.com/Alabama/football/recruiting/player-Kiehl-Frazier-79416 and he can't fucking play a lick.
4 star, #7 at postion, 128 nationally, http://rivals.yahoo.com/alabama/football/recruiting/player-AJ-McCarron-63348 and is a competent, even good college QB with a NC ring. This pencil necked fuck can play, and Frazier can't? Why?
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All you have to do is look at pictures to see Yox is doing his job. Most of these dudes are massive and chiseled. They look conditioned on the surface. Issue is in the head/coaching/developing.
Agree, see above post.
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The real burning question is why is this player, and one like Frazier, seemingly regressing in their ability to play the game they were recruited to play while at Auburn, while across the state there's a program churning out NFL draft picks left and right from the same talent pool with similar recruiting rankings?
4 star, #5 at position, 89 nationally http://rivals.yahoo.com/Alabama/football/recruiting/player-Kiehl-Frazier-79416 and he can't fucking play a lick.
4 star, #7 at postion, 128 nationally, http://rivals.yahoo.com/alabama/football/recruiting/player-AJ-McCarron-63348 and is a competent, even good college QB with a NC ring. This pencil necked fuck can play, and Frazier can't? Why?
Makes me wonder if Malzahn truly WAS masking a lot of our deficiencies last year. I mean, I know we looked bad last year but the shit I see this year is an abortion. I take everything I said bad about Loeffler back. I was wrong. He gave KF plenty of chances in the playcalling (as evidenced in some stills posted). KF just froze up. I'm not sure Loeffler can do much else. I really think he was not developed properly. Player development starts with the HC - how you bring them along, get them in games, mentor them, make sure they are learning, etc. Holland and Frazier were both 4 star, top 10 in their position recruits. They were talented at some point. Enough to be ranked that high and for other major D1 programs to want them. We have regressed both of these guys.
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Playing devil's advocate here. Lighter and quicker is fine. But why is Whittaker getting pushed to the sidelines. (He literally did get pushed all the way to the sidelines on a play up the middle Saturday) Getting push up the middle means a lot of things including angles and leverage but it also has to include leg strength. Guys are going to bulk up or slim down in every college program. Ask Demarcus Ware. Like I said, these guys are at a time in their lives where growth is at a premium. Weight training, all the best foods anythime they want. The question is are we strong enough not to get pushed around by Tongans?
I watched LSU this weekend. I'm not looking forward to anything about that Saturday except food and drink. A lot of it.
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I watched LSU this weekend. I'm not looking forward to anything about that Saturday except food and drink. A lot of it.
What about me?
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Makes me wonder if Malzahn truly WAS masking a lot of our deficiencies last year. I mean, I know we looked bad last year but the shit I see this year is an abortion. I take everything I said bad about Loeffler back. I was wrong. He gave KF plenty of chances in the playcalling (as evidenced in some stills posted). KF just froze up. I'm not sure Loeffler can do much else. I really think he was not developed properly. Player development starts with the HC - how you bring them along, get them in games, mentor them, make sure they are learning, etc. Holland and Frazier were both 4 star, top 10 in their position recruits. They were talented at some point. Enough to be ranked that high and for other major D1 programs to want them. We have regressed both of these guys.
We're not allowed to see all of practices, so we can't know what is going on all the time. It's difficult for me to believe that BVG has had the success he's had, and doesn't know how to build a defense, and defensive players from the ground up.
It's difficult for me to believe that with all the programs, coaches, and players he's been around that Loeffler doesn't know how to build an offense, and know the skills needed at each position to make it work.
Same same for the other assistants, with the understanding that some ACs are kept around more for their recruiting skills than coaching skills, but still then, it's the job of the coordinator to make sure that coach knows the things he's supposed to coach each day, and focus on. No AC is, or rather should not be, left to his own devices to coach his position. The the coordinator should direct what skills are taught, and may even have directives on how they're to be taught, though I would expect that if Loeffler gives Grimes the assignment on a particular day to focus on say pass pro, then he'll give grimes the Xs and Os part, but let Grimes decide how to teach the individual skills.
Some have railed on Grimes, but I don't get it. The OL in 2009 was good, stellar in 2010, and poor last year with 3 Fr starting, yet improved this year with the same number of Fr starting. To me, OL is not a major issue this year, and the same can't be said for almost any other position except maybe RB/FB, and to a lesser extent WR/TE. We do at least have one of each that can catch if Frazier ever gets them the ball. DL, LBs, and DBs suck monkey nuts with the exception of the DEs. Whittaker is, IMHO, a bust for his recruiting ranking of 4 star, 5th at his position, and 54th in the nation. He's a Jr. He even had some time under The Rock. He's done jack shit.
Something is missing in the development process. I don't know what it is, but Chiz better fucking figure it out.
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What about me?
I'm gonna' touch your face.
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I'm gonna' touch your face.
Auburn ain't the only one getting their shit pushed in that weekend :gig:
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We're not allowed to see all of practices, so we can't know what is going on all the time. It's difficult for me to believe that BVG has had the success he's had, and doesn't know how to build a defense, and defensive players from the ground up.
It's difficult for me to believe that with all the programs, coaches, and players he's been around that Loeffler doesn't know how to build an offense, and know the skills needed at each position to make it work.
Same same for the other assistants, with the understanding that some ACs are kept around more for their recruiting skills than coaching skills, but still then, it's the job of the coordinator to make sure that coach knows the things he's supposed to coach each day, and focus on. No AC is, or rather should not be, left to his own devices to coach his position. The the coordinator should direct what skills are taught, and may even have directives on how they're to be taught, though I would expect that if Loeffler gives Grimes the assignment on a particular day to focus on say pass pro, then he'll give grimes the Xs and Os part, but let Grimes decide how to teach the individual skills.
Some have railed on Grimes, but I don't get it. The OL in 2009 was good, stellar in 2010, and poor last year with 3 Fr starting, yet improved this year with the same number of Fr starting. To me, OL is not a major issue this year, and the same can't be said for almost any other position except maybe RB/FB, and to a lesser extent WR/TE. We do at least have one of each that can catch if Frazier ever gets them the ball. DL, LBs, and DBs suck monkey nuts with the exception of the DEs. Whittaker is, IMHO, a bust for his recruiting ranking of 4 star, 5th at his position, and 54th in the nation. He's a Jr. He even had some time under The Rock. He's done jack shit.
Something is missing in the development process. I don't know what it is, but Chiz better fucking figure it out.
You mentioned Rock. Weve also been through Roof, Lolley, Malzahn....who is the common coach this whole time? Their boss. Buck stops at him. Leadership and development comes from the top down and he ain't cutting it right now, obviously.
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Auburn ain't the only one getting their shit pushed in that weekend :gig:
I didn't know VV was coming.
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I didn't know VV was coming.
DAMNIT you AWK!! You stoldt my punchline.
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You mentioned Rock. Weve also been through Roof, Lolley, Malzahn....who is the common coach this whole time? Their boss. Buck stops at him. Leadership and development comes from the top down and he ain't cutting it right now, obviously.
Agree. But IF that is the case, and it seems to be, isn't it proof he's in over his head as an SEC HC? And if he is in over his head? Who "develops" the HC?
I didn't hear it, and the guy that told me this isn't always reliable to repeat things exactly right, maybe you or someone else heard it, but he claims to have heard Lutz in the post game presser make the statement "we don't call the plays, we just do what we're told". Now, context is everything, and I don't know what the question was, or even if that statement is accurate, but it left him believing there's some internal strife going on. Maybe some failure to buy in.
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DAMNIT you AWK!! You stoldt my punchline.
I figure I would just beat you guys to it, because I knew it was coming.
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I didn't know VV was coming.
With skittles:
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u1/miked0003/121231.gif)
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With skittles skeetles:
(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u1/miked0003/121231.gif)
Fixt.