Tigers X - Number one Source to Talk Auburn Tigers Sports
Pat Dye Field => War Damn Eagle => Topic started by: Townhallsavoy on January 03, 2011, 01:18:24 PM
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1. Panthers 2-14 .125 .574
2. Broncos 4-12 .250 .516
3. Bills 4-12 .250 .578
4. Bengals 4-12 .250 .582
5. Cardinals 5-11 .313 .465
6. Browns 5-11 .313 .570
7. 49ers 6-10 .375 .488
8. Titans 6-10 .375 .508
9. Cowboys 6-10 .375 .512
10. Redskins 6-10 .375 .516
11. Texans 6-10 .375 .523
12. Vikings 6-10 .375 .539
13. Lions 6-10 .375 .543
14. Rams 7-9 .438 .449
15. Dolphins 7-9 .438 .539
16. Jaguars 8-8 .500 .453
17. Patriots (from Raiders) 14-2 .875 .504
18. Chargers 9-7 .563 .457
19. Giants 10-6 .625 .453
20. Buccaneers 10-6 .625 .477
So what's your mock draft so far?
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I don't have one but looking at that list I see several teams in need of a QB. With only a handful of 1st RD draftees at the QB position, Newton and Mallett will not be on the board long.
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I don't have one but looking at that list I see several teams in need of a QB. With only a handful of 1st RD draftees at the QB position, Newton and Mallett will not be on the board long.
I agree.
I'm hoping Newton lands in Tennessee. Would be awesome to get to drive up and see him play NFL ball a few times.
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I agree.
I'm hoping Newton lands in Tennessee. Would be awesome to get to drive up and see him play NFL ball a few times.
The Titans aren't too much of a stretch either but I could see Luck, Newton and Mallett being plucked before the 6th pick. I bet their will be some heavy lobbying by teams like Washington and Miami to get their feet in the door too. You could possibly see these two teams give up their first two rounds and some cash to get a QB out of this NFL draft.
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No question there's some serious QB needs with several of the top 10 teams picking. I can easily see all 3.... Luck, Mallet and Newton going pretty high in the 1st.
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Anyone think Jim Harbaugh will be the next Broncos coach, especially with Elway now as some sort of advisor? You could pretty much pencil Luck in as a Bronco.
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Anyone think Jim Harbaugh will be the next Broncos coach, especially with Elway now as some sort of advisor? You could pretty much pencil Luck in as a Bronco.
I don't think he'll make it to #2. The hyperbole has already started with Luck. I believe I heard, "The most complete prospect the NFL draft has ever seen" on the NFL network the other day.
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IMO, the draft order for quarterbacks will be...
1. Luck
2. Locker
3. Mallet
4. Newton
I don't think all will go in the top 15.
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IMO, the draft order for quarterbacks will be...
1. Luck
2. Locker
3. Mallet
4. Newton
I don't think all will go in the top 15.
I don't think Locker is going to test as well as people think. He needs the combine to put him in the top 4 QBs because his numbers and success at Washington have not been impressive at all.
His measurables will still be really good, but they won't overshadow the height and strength of Mallet or the Vick-like athleticism of Newton.
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I don't think he'll make it to #2. The hyperbole has already started with Luck. I believe I heard, "The most complete prospect the NFL draft has ever seen" on the NFL network the other day.
Yeah, they're talking his shit up for sure. I agree with them that Luck will be a good NFL QB but the best? I can't make that stretch.
I think you might be right about not even making it past the 1st pick. Here is Carolinas QB depth chart:
Jimmy Clausen
Matt Moore
Tony Pike
Not exactly star power but the Panthers have never really went after star power. Its always been the serviceable guy even back to them drafting Jay Barker. I bet they go defense first pick.
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I'm not saying Locker is a better QB, I'm saying some dumb ass GM will fall in love with him and take him higher than he should go.
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IMO, the draft order for quarterbacks will be...
1. Luck
2. Locker
3. Mallet
4. Newton
I don't think all will go in the top 15.
Yeah, I think THS is on top of this. Locker hurt himself by not going in the draft early. He will probably be a good NFL QB but he will be a two year project. Mallet and Newton will go before him.
I'm not saying Locker is a better QB, I'm saying some dumb ass GM will fall in love with him and take him higher than he should go.
Now thats probably likely.
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Blaine Gabbert will be taken before Cam.
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There is not a QB that I would take over Cam Newton. I could argue with anyone that Cam is better than any QB available...
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Blaine Gabbert will be taken before Cam.
I've wondered where his name has been.
Is he for sure entering the draft? He was a five star recruit and an immediate star at Missouri. Surely he's going to be drafted high.
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There is not a QB that I would take over Cam Newton. I could argue with anyone that Cam is better than any QB available...
Make the argument that Cam is better than Andrew Luck.
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I've wondered where his name has been.
Is he for sure entering the draft? He was a five star recruit and an immediate star at Missouri. Surely he's going to be drafted high.
Just read where he has already turned in his papers to do so. I didn't realize that this was his first year as starter. He seems to be getting lots of 1st RD pub.
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Don't forget Kellen "I has teeeths and no toofbrush" Moore.
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Don't forget Kellen "I has teeeths and no toofbrush" Moore.
I now have two loves in my live. Big city livin' and a voodoo woman name Phyllis.
Ciao,
Roberto
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Don't forget Kellen "I has teeeths and no toofbrush" Moore.
He's a junior.
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I now have two loves in my live. Big city livin' and a voodoo woman name Phyllis.
Ciao,
Roberto
Who's Helen?
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Make the argument that Cam is better than Andrew Luck.
Cam has as many TD's passing, 28, as Luck has with one fewer interception and 100 fewer attempts. Cam is 3" taller and has about 30 lbs on Luck...while Cam is definitely the better runner. Cam had 1400 yards rushing with 20 TD's on the ground while Luck had 438 yards rushing and 3 TD's.
Cam is by far the superior athlete.
Cam is a winner. He lead Auburn to an undefeated season with a chance for a National Title and let Blynn JUCO to a National Title last year as well.
Cam played in the SEC where there are superior defenses to that of the Pac-10. Auburn also played Clemson which ranks in the Top 25 in total defense as well.
Cam has far more up-side than Luck. You can build a team around Cam. He can take a group of guys and make them excel. Can Luck do that? Cam took a 7-5 team last year and made them 13-0 this year. With almost the exact same players.
Luck will have to have play makers surrounding him to be successful...Cam is a playmaker that makes other players successful.
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Honestly, I would take a long look at Toofies Moore. Not saying 1st round over any of the bigger pro style QB's but this kid is good. He'll be worth a pick when he does enter the draft. He's as accurate as any QB I've seen and has a stronger arm than you would think for a dwarf.
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Cam has as many TD's passing, 28, as Luck has with one fewer interception and 100 fewer attempts. Cam is 3" taller and has about 30 lbs on Luck...while Cam is definitely the better runner. Cam had 1400 yards rushing with 20 TD's on the ground while Luck had 438 yards rushing and 3 TD's.
Cam is by far the superior athlete.
Cam is a winner. He lead Auburn to an undefeated season with a chance for a National Title and let Blynn JUCO to a National Title last year as well.
Cam played in the SEC where there are superior defenses to that of the Pac-10. Auburn also played Clemson which ranks in the Top 25 in total defense as well.
Cam has far more up-side than Luck. You can build a team around Cam. He can take a group of guys and make them excel. Can Luck do that? Cam took a 7-5 team last year and made them 13-0 this year. With almost the exact same players.
Luck will have to have play makers surrounding him to be successful...Cam is a playmaker that makes other players successful.
^^This^^
But you and I are homers. An NFL scout is going to say,
Luck has been doing it in Div. I for 3 years, Cam has only had 1 year at the top level.
Luck has been in a pro style offense, Cam has not.
And spread QB's do not have the best track record in the NFL, that will scare off a lot of people.
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^^This^^
But you and I are homers. An NFL scout is going to say,
Luck has been doing it in Div. I for 3 years, Cam has only had 1 year at the top level.
Luck has been in a pro style offense, Cam has not.
And spread QB's do not have the best track record in the NFL, that will scare off a lot of people.
You shut your dirty hoarish mouf. Cam is a god.
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Who's Helen?
Some whore of Babylon?
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Cam has as many TD's passing, 28, as Luck has with one fewer interception and 100 fewer attempts. Cam is 3" taller and has about 30 lbs on Luck...while Cam is definitely the better runner. Cam had 1400 yards rushing with 20 TD's on the ground while Luck had 438 yards rushing and 3 TD's.
Cam is by far the superior athlete.
Cam is a winner. He lead Auburn to an undefeated season with a chance for a National Title and let Blynn JUCO to a National Title last year as well.
Cam played in the SEC where there are superior defenses to that of the Pac-10. Auburn also played Clemson which ranks in the Top 25 in total defense as well.
Cam has far more up-side than Luck. You can build a team around Cam. He can take a group of guys and make them excel. Can Luck do that? Cam took a 7-5 team last year and made them 13-0 this year. With almost the exact same players.
Luck will have to have play makers surrounding him to be successful...Cam is a playmaker that makes other players successful.
No offense, but most of your reasons sound like that of a 12 year old Auburn fan who has never been outside of 36830.....meaning, almost all of the same things could be said about Luck if you were a Stanford fan that had never been outside of 94305. In other words, it sounds a little like "he's better because he's my favorite".
Luck is 6' 4", 235 lbs....so Cam has him by 2" and 15 lbs....which is pretty irrelevant since both are easily NFL ready size. It's kind of like saying someone clears a hurdle by 1" and someone else clears it by 2"....as long as you clear it, it really doesn't matter.
Is Luck not a winner? Didn't he just go 11-1 at STANFORD of all places. (Stanford was also 8-5 last year).
I'm mostly just not sure how statements like "you can build a team around Cam" and "he can take a group of guys and make them excel", could not also apply equally to Luck. You just happen to be an Auburn fan, not a Stanford fan. Cam may very well be a better pro one day, but nothing you just listed necessarily sets him apart from Luck.
Essentially it will come down to what a team is looking for. If a team has no intention on running their QB, then most of the statistical advantage (rushing numbers) for Cam will be meaningless to that particular GM.
As for upside, again, that's a guess. You could say Cam has more because he could be a dual threat like Vick, but if Luck turned out to be a Tom Brady or a Peyton Manning, then "dual threat" is of no interest and not necessary. Of course Luck could be the next Ryan Leaf. But Cam could be the next Brad Smith or Vince Young. You just never know.
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No offense, but most of your reasons sound like that of a 12 year old Auburn fan who has never been outside of 36830.....meaning, almost all of the same things could be said about Luck if you were a Stanford fan that had never been outside of 94305. In other words, it sounds a little like "he's better because he's my favorite".
Luck is 6' 4", 235 lbs....so Cam has him by 2" and 15 lbs....which is pretty irrelevant since both are easily NFL ready size. It's kind of like saying someone clears a hurdle by 1" and someone else clears it by 2"....as long as you clear it, it really doesn't matter.
Is Luck not a winner? Didn't he just go 11-1 at STANFORD of all places. (Stanford was also 8-5 last year).
I'm mostly just not sure how statements like "you can build a team around Cam" and "he can take a group of guys and make them excel", could not also apply equally to Luck. You just happen to be an Auburn fan, not a Stanford fan. Cam may very well be a better pro one day, but nothing you just listed necessarily sets him apart from Luck.
Essentially it will come down to what a team is looking for. If a team has no intention on running their QB, then most of the statistical advantage (rushing numbers) for Cam will be meaningless to that particular GM.
As for upside, again, that's a guess. You could say Cam has more because he could be a dual threat like Vick, but if Luck turned out to be a Tom Brady or a Peyton Manning, then "dual threat" is of no interest and not necessary. Of course Luck could be the next Ryan Leaf. But Cam could be the next Brad Smith or Vince Young. You just never know.
Ok.
You are right.
Can we just agree that he looks like a fucktard?
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No offense, but most of your reasons sound like that of a 12 year old Auburn fan who has never been outside of 36830.....meaning, almost all of the same things could be said about Luck if you were a Stanford fan that had never been outside of 94305. In other words, it sounds a little like "he's better because he's my favorite".
Luck is 6' 4", 235 lbs....so Cam has him by 2" and 15 lbs....which is pretty irrelevant since both are easily NFL ready size. It's kind of like saying someone clears a hurdle by 1" and someone else clears it by 2"....as long as you clear it, it really doesn't matter.
Is Luck not a winner? Didn't he just go 11-1 at STANFORD of all places. (Stanford was also 8-5 last year).
I'm mostly just not sure how statements like "you can build a team around Cam" and "he can take a group of guys and make them excel", could not also apply equally to Luck. You just happen to be an Auburn fan, not a Stanford fan. Cam may very well be a better pro one day, but nothing you just listed necessarily sets him apart from Luck.
Essentially it will come down to what a team is looking for. If a team has no intention on running their QB, then most of the statistical advantage (rushing numbers) for Cam will be meaningless to that particular GM.
As for upside, again, that's a guess. You could say Cam has more because he could be a dual threat like Vick, but if Luck turned out to be a Tom Brady or a Peyton Manning, then "dual threat" is of no interest and not necessary. Of course Luck could be the next Ryan Leaf. But Cam could be the next Brad Smith or Vince Young. You just never know.
Didn't Luck have a RB that was a Heisman trophy runner up last year? And Luck hasn't been doing it for 3 years...he was red shirted his first year. He has 2 years and Cam has 1...not counting the days at Florida. I take my chances on Cam who has played and won in the SEC.
Seriously...who is the last Pac-10 QB that has been really good in the Pro's? I have to be missing someone besides Palmer? Cassel? Leinart?
Edit...
Rodgers is pretty good I guess...He played at Cal right?
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There is not a QB that I would take over Cam Newton. I could argue with anyone that Cam is better than any QB available...
With what's available, I'd have to agree he'd be no bigger a gamble than any, and has more upside as an athlete.
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Didn't Luck have a RB that was a Heisman trophy runner up last year? And Luck hasn't been doing it for 3 years...he was red shirted his first year. He has 2 years and Cam has 1...not counting the days at Florida. I take my chances on Cam who has played and won in the SEC.
Seriously...who is the last Pac-10 QB that has been really good in the Pro's? I have to be missing someone besides Palmer? Cassel? Leinart?
Edit...
Rodgers is pretty good I guess...He played at Cal right?
Who is the last SEC QB to make the Pro Bowl? Manning(s)? Stafford may be good if he can stay upright. Cutler can't differentiate DB's from WR's.
SEC QB's haven't exactly been tearing it up.
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Who is the last SEC QB to make the Pro Bowl? Manning(s)? Stafford may be good if he can stay upright. Cutler can't differentiate DB's from WR's.
SEC QB's haven't exactly been tearing it up.
I would say Cutler is doing pretty damn good
TDS
23
INT
16
YDS
3,274
RTG
86.3
Not to mention he has the Bears as the second best team in the NFC
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I would say Cutler is doing pretty damn good
TDS
23
INT
16
YDS
3,274
RTG
86.3
Not to mention he has the Bears as the second best team in the NFC
1 and done in the playoffs... and if they play the Patriots, it will be 1 quarter and done.
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Some of these guys aren't exactly spectacular, but the Pac 10 has:
Rogers, Palmer, Cassel, Leinart, Kevin Kolb, Mark Sanchez, Derrick Anderson, Trent Edwards, and Matt Moore.
Several of them could be described as "sucking"....but the fact is, they have all played and started a significant amount of games this year in the NFL, so that says something. That's 9 guys from the 10 team Pac 10. Not bad.
The SEC has the two Mannings, Cutler, Stafford, and Jason Campbell. Five guys from 12 teams.
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16 int's is still a lot. And he's a jerk to boot. At this point in his career he's just Jeff George.
Here's a mock draft of the 1st round.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2011/1/3/1910205/2011-nfl-mock-draft-andrew-luck
Some notables. Luck 1st to Carolina, Fairley 7th to 49ers, Cam 12th to Vikings (they have Tennessee taking Dareus at 8, apparently they are counting on Bud keeping Young).
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16 int's is still a lot. And he's a jerk to boot. At this point in his career he's just Jeff George.
Here's a mock draft of the 1st round.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2011/1/3/1910205/2011-nfl-mock-draft-andrew-luck
Some notables. Luck 1st to Carolina, Fairley 7th to 49ers, Cam 12th to Vikings (they have Tennessee taking Dareus at 8, apparently they are counting on Bud keeping Young).
I don't see the Vikings taking Cam. They seem to be liking what they may have in Webb from UAB.
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Who is the last SEC QB to make the Pro Bowl? Manning(s)? Stafford may be good if he can stay upright. Cutler can't differentiate DB's from WR's.
SEC QB's haven't exactly been tearing it up.
Cutler, Stafford, Eli, Peyton, Tebow, Jason Cambell,
That's 6 QB's that start from SEC schools.
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Cutler, Stafford, Eli, Peyton, Tebow, Jason Cambell,
That's 6 QB's that start from SEC schools.
I didn't mean starting, I meant performing like first round picks. Of those you mentioned, I would count Peyton. Cutler did OK this year, but he still throws interception like his name his Favre. Only he doesn't do it with a childlike joy and passion that inspires middle aged sportswriters to pop a chubby.
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I didn't mean starting, I meant performing like first round picks. Of those you mentioned, I would count Peyton. Cutler did OK this year, but he still throws interception like his name his Favre. Only he doesn't do it with a childlike joy and passion that inspires middle aged sportswriters to pop a chubby.
You wouldn't count Eli?
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Vot about Rocky Marciano?
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Some of these guys aren't exactly spectacular, but the Pac 10 has:
Rogers, Palmer, Cassel, Leinart, Kevin Kolb, Mark Sanchez, Derrick Anderson, Trent Edwards, and Matt Moore.
Several of them could be described as "sucking"....but the fact is, they have all played and started a significant amount of games this year in the NFL, so that says something. That's 9 guys from the 10 team Pac 10. Not bad.
The SEC has the two Mannings, Cutler, Stafford, and Jason Campbell. Five guys from 12 teams.
Kolb played at Houston...Conference USA
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Kolb played at Houston...Conference USA
Halt with your Cougar trivia.
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You wouldn't count Eli?
I guess. He's thrown 20 interceptions twice, with his most ever coming this year. What's odd is that he threw the most interception this year while getting sacked the least amount in his career. I don't watch enough NFL to know if he is trying to get rid of the ball faster and making mistakes, or has time and still throws picks. He also fumbles a lot (5 fumbles in 16 sacks, for comparison Cutler was sacked 52 times to lead the league and fumbled 9 times). Just checked the stats on ESPN.com and he is top 10 in every statistical category except rating. So the numbers are there, except for the 25 int's.
I think looking at Peyton, Brady, and Brees have spoiled me for what a good NFL QB used to look like.
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Rogers, Palmer, Cassel, Leinart, Kevin Kolb, Mark Sanchez, Derrick Anderson, Trent Edwards, and Matt Moore.
Those are starters. And Palmer, Cassel and Sanchez all came from the same school...
I wasn't taking the whole damn roster. Hell, I guess I could throw in John Parker Wilson and Brody Croyle if I had to...
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Those are starters. And Palmer, Cassel and Sanchez all came from the same school...
I wasn't taking the whole damn roster. Hell, I guess I could throw in John Parker Wilson and Brody Croyle if I had to...
They've all started games and played quite a bit. I wasn't just looking at rosters, but at QBs who have started this year. I even admitted some of them sucked....but they've all started.
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Was just listening to Morten Anderson...says that any GM or coach in the league agrees Luck is the #1 guy by far.
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Some of these guys aren't exactly spectacular, but the Pac 10 has:
Rogers, Palmer, Cassel, Leinart, Kevin Kolb, Mark Sanchez, Derrick Anderson, Trent Edwards, and Matt Moore.
Several of them could be described as "sucking"....but the fact is, they have all played and started a significant amount of games this year in the NFL, so that says something. That's 9 guys from the 10 team Pac 10. Not bad.
The SEC has the two Mannings, Cutler, Stafford, and Jason Campbell. Five guys from 12 teams.
The SEC has had Jason Campbell, Payton and Eli Manning, Jay Cutler, Ben Rothelisburger, Michael Vick, Tom Brady, Shaq, Pistol Pete, Tiger Woods, Jack Nicholson, Matthew Stafford, etc.
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The SEC has had Jason Campbell, Payton and Eli Manning, Jay Cutler, Ben Rothelisburger, Michael Vick, Tom Brady, Shaq, Pistol Pete, Tiger Woods, Jack Nicholson, Matthew Stafford, etc.
Mike Vick? Really?
Was just listening to Morten Anderson...says that any GM or coach in the league agrees Luck is the #1 guy by far.
I didn't say that I was right...I just said that I can make a case for him to be the taken over anyone else. I just don't see how Luck is the clear cut number one. That just doesn't make sense to me.
Matter of fact, I think I just saw Kiper's big board and the Missouri QB who just announced he was coming out was the second QB predicted to be taken. That makes no sense to me either.
BTW, the number 2 over all pick on that list was Fairley...
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Mike Vick? Really?
I didn't say that I was right...I just said that I can make a case for him to be the taken over anyone else. I just don't see how Luck is the clear cut number one. That just doesn't make sense to me.
Matter of fact, I think I just saw Kiper's big board and the Missouri QB who just announced he was coming out was the second QB predicted to be taken. That makes no sense to me either.
BTW, the number 2 over all pick on that list was Fairley...
I wasn't saying you're wrong. You and I agree on Cam. Luck has the advantage of playing in "Pro Style" offense, and being coached by an "NFL guy". I think if not for that, he'd not be nearly as highly regarded.
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I wasn't saying you're wrong. You and I agree on Cam. Luck has the advantage of playing in "Pro Style" offense, and being coached by an "NFL guy". I think if not for that, he'd not be nearly as highly regarded.
Watching the game tonight?
Yeah...I take my chances on a QB that doesn't play in an offense only league...
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Bingo...
Which NFL teams need a QB? Titans, 49ers, Jaguars, Texans...?
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Watching the game tonight?
Yeah...I take my chances on a QB that doesn't play in an offense only league...
He's not doing horrible, but yeah, it's not easy for him either. A big time QB can carry a team in a game like this. Luck can't.
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Bingo...
Which NFL teams need a QB? Titans, 49ers, Jaguars, Texans...?
Panthers, Broncos, Bills, Vikings, Dolphins...
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Luck looked pretty damn good to me. First time I've seen him play this season. He's the best pro style QB in this draft. Maybe not the best college quarterback, but he'll be the best NFL quarterback of this bunch.
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Luck looked pretty damn good to me. First time I've seen him play this season. He's the best pro style QB in this draft. Maybe not the best college quarterback, but he'll be the best NFL quarterback of this bunch.
He looked much better in the second half.
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Panthers, Broncos, Bills, Vikings, Dolphins...
The Panthers took their QB last year with Clausen....2nd round if I remember correctly. Denver has their QB in Tebow. So, Bills, Vikings, Dolphins. Dolphins with Ronnie B and Ricky or the Vikings with Adrian P and Gerhart.
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The Panthers took their QB last year with Clausen....2nd round if I remember correctly. Denver has their QB in Tebow. So, Bills, Vikings, Dolphins. Dolphins with Ronnie B and Ricky or the Vikings with Adrian P and Gerhart.
I would love to see Newton running the offense in Miami. This offense is "AWK" made for him. If he can stay in the pool until the 18th pick, I def see the Dolphins making the move. They need a QB in a bad bad way. Hell, they may even jump up and get him just to secure it. I really hope they don't trade Ronnie though, that would spoil it a little but for me.
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I would love to see Newton running the offense in Miami. This offense is "AWK" made for him. If he can stay in the pool until the 18th pick, I def see the Dolphins making the move. They need a QB in a bad bad way. Hell, they may even jump up and get him just to secure it. I really hope they don't trade Ronnie though, that would spoil it a little but for me.
Ronnie's as good as gone.
They screwed him in the last game, and he hasn't been very productive this year. Either he'll want to go, or they're wanting to get rid of him. (Just my opinion)
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Ronnie's as good as gone.
They screwed him in the last game, and he hasn't been very productive this year. Either he'll want to go, or they're wanting to get rid of him. (Just my opinion)
Yeah, I remember you said that and it certainly seems to be the writing on the wall. It sucks because that takes a little of the luster out of Cam to the Dolphins scenario. It sure is funny how things have worked out for Ricky Williams though. I would have never imagined that he would still be there after his little episode.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_QlwLnT5oLJs/SX3wDizpa-I/AAAAAAAABTg/9b13mu1oDng/s320/ricky-williams-smoking-weed2.jpg)
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He looked much better in the second half.
Yes he did. He made a couple of damn good throws the second half. I am still not sold that Cam could not have done the exact same thing though...
Honestly, the only plus that Luck has over Cam is the system he plays in. I think there is just much more upside with Cam.
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Yes he did. He made a couple of damn good throws the second half. I am still not sold that Cam could not have done the exact same thing though...
Honestly, the only plus that Luck has over Cam is the system he plays in. I think there is just much more upside with Cam.
It's like I say it, then you say it.
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Yes he did. He made a couple of damn good throws the second half. I am still not sold that Cam could not have done the exact same thing though...
Honestly, the only plus that Luck has over Cam is the system he plays in. I think there is just much more upside with Cam.
One flaw in your argument is that not only has Luck played in a more desirable system, he has excelled.
We only have "if's" and "buts" when it comes to discussing Cam's success in an NFL system.
In the end, people believe that Luck has the measurables, ability, and experience to step in and perform as well as Sam Bradford or Matt Ryan did in their rookie seasons. They also believe that Cam has the measurables and ability, but he'll have to spend time learning the NFL style of offense. That's the biggest difference between the two.
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And it's a moot point. If Luck declares he will be the #1 overall pick.
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Guess Luck wont be the #1 draft pick after all.
Staying in School.
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Guess Luck wont be the #1 draft pick after all.
Staying in School.
I think this may make even more doubtful that Cam stays for next season.
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I'm incredibly impressed with how much Cam improved as a passer from game 1 forward. Still, he's as much a product of Malzahn's system as Luck is of Stanford's. Newton obviously has the intangibles that will give him a leg up on most QB's but we all know he won't be running and scrambling in the NFL with 1/4 the success he has now. People like Karlos Dansby will hurt you.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but my feeble analysis of the difference in a "system" QB and what you have to do in the NFL would be having to survey the field. What I see in Cam and Luck and those like them, is pretty much knowing exactly where you're going with the ball on 90+% of your throws. You take the snap and play action or in Cam's case, take the quick step forward to fake a run and then hit the designated receiver. Certainly, there are plenty of cases he has to pull it down or find the 2nd option but for the most part, receiver #1 is going to work...or not.
In the pros, it seems these guys have to have the ability to quickly check options 1, 2 and 3 and pull the trigger. A lot more reading of defenses etc. I have no idea if Cam is there yet or has the ability to do it at that level with one year of D1 experience. Have no idea. I know I probably simplified that too much.
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I'm incredibly impressed with how much Cam improved as a passer from game 1 forward. Still, he's as much a product of Malzahn's system as Luck is of Stanford's. Newton obviously has the intangibles that will give him a leg up on most QB's but we all know he won't be running and scrambling in the NFL with 1/4 the success he has now. People like Karlos Dansby will hurt you.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong here but my feeble analysis of the difference in a "system" QB and what you have to do in the NFL would be having to survey the field. What I see in Cam and Luck and those like them, is pretty much knowing exactly where you're going with the ball on 90+% of your throws. You take the snap and play action or in Cam's case, take the quick step forward to fake a run and then hit the designated receiver. Certainly, there are plenty of cases he has to pull it down or find the 2nd option but for the most part, receiver #1 is going to work...or not.
In the pros, it seems these guys have to have the ability to quickly check options 1, 2 and 3 and pull the trigger. A lot more reading of defenses etc. I have no idea if Cam is there yet or has the ability to do it at that level with one year of D1 experience. Have no idea. I know I probably simplified that too much.
I believe it was Steve Young I heard say that the difference between playing in the pros and college is that in college you look check down to the open receiver and hit him, because there will almost always be an open receiver. In the pros there is almost never a wide open receiver, so it becomes all about judgement and accuracy on who is the best matchup and can I get the ball to where only my guy can get it.
Basically you check down in both, but compared to college none of the receiver will look "open" in the pros. You just have to have the snap judgement to get the ball in the window to the guy. That's why there is so much debate over the player's mechanics. If you are telegraphing when you are going to throw it or your motion takes too long you will be toast.
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Guess Luck wont be the #1 draft pick after all.
Staying in School.
I like the decision if Harbough is staying.
But if Harbough leaves? Absolutely stupid. No recognized coach is going to take over Stanford (unless he just likes the weather)
Which means Stanford's team will have a drop off next year. Which means Luck's stats won't be as good as this year. Which means Luck may take a few more sacks and risk getting injured. Which means Luck may not be the #1 pick in the draft.
I don't care how much money Luck's family has nor how admirable it is to stay and get your prestigious degree. Would he not be able to go back later and finish?
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If you're top 3...you come out. Why stay? What, are you going to improve your draft stock?
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I believe it was Steve Young I heard say that the difference between playing in the pros and college is that in college you look check down to the open receiver and hit him, because there will almost always be an open receiver. In the pros there is almost never a wide open receiver, so it becomes all about judgement and accuracy on who is the best matchup and can I get the ball to where only my guy can get it.
Basically you check down in both, but compared to college none of the receiver will look "open" in the pros. You just have to have the snap judgement to get the ball in the window to the guy. That's why there is so much debate over the player's mechanics. If you are telegraphing when you are going to throw it or your motion takes too long you will be toast.
I don't really feel like writing a whole ton, but I would imagine in the pro's, the schemes are a lot more advanced. In college, you may get to check cover 2, cover 3, blitz middle, blitz outside, etc. Sure they may try to hide the blitzes, but the amount of blitzes and the types aren't going to be near as easy to read.
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I don't really feel like writing a whole ton, but I would imagine in the pro's, the schemes are a lot more advanced. In college, you may get to check cover 2, cover 3, blitz middle, blitz outside, etc. Sure they may try to hide the blitzes, but the amount of blitzes and the types aren't going to be near as easy to read.
Yep, the looks you get are much more numerous, and the disguise is much better. Sometimes there's an athlete on the other side that can do things that make some reads impossible.