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At least he's not Hillary...

Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #380 on: June 15, 2016, 12:52:48 PM »
Oh, and one more thing.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/apr/14/donald-trump/donald-trump-wrong-about-1980-ronald-reagan-race-a/That was from two months ago. His numbers have continued to decline since.

Also the ONE AND ONLY poll in 1980 was, Gallup, was perfect and not at all flawed by your assertation. The fact that we have MULTIPLE of polls in 2016 for the very reason that we can average them to account for potential flaws in individual polls has no bearing.

https://newrepublic.com/article/107171/exploding-the-reagan-1980-comeback-myth
Also not a factor that incumbent Carter was steadily declining, while newcomer Reagan was steadily increasing, save for one huge dip for Carter and one huge bump for Reagan around the conventions right before Carter support rallied.
http://themonkeycage.org/2012/08/what-really-happened-in-the-1980-presidential-campaign/


Compare that with Trump's overall decline and Hillary's overall ascent. Apples and turnips.

Also not a factor that the January/early March polls tested Reagan just before he started winning the primaries whereas Trump has been locked in for a while now. Not a factor that Trump is doing the opposite.

Haven't even had the convention yet. 

Let's wait and see before we have the inauguration based on your "polls" mmmmkay? 

Thanks for posting from "the monkey cage" though.  That's one hell of a legitimate site.  How many monkeys live there? 


As I very clearly said, Carter still led until late July.  There are the unbiased numbers.  (facts). 

Doesn't matter who was declining, rising, polling, strolling or soup bowling.  We're not to July, the race (except by your flawed poll) is within five points or so, and a lot can happen. 

Why Reagan even fell behind Carter again in September.  Oh lord!  Carter was rising!!  It's over. Fucking Carter was president again.  Whatever happened to that Reagan guy? 

But if you want to win the Internet, I will send you a nice trophy.  It won't mean anything, about like the polls, but at least you'll have it. 
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Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #381 on: June 15, 2016, 12:53:55 PM »
Still waiting on this.

You'll be waiting a long, long time chief.  General consensus is that you haven't been insulted. 

I took a poll.
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wesfau2

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #382 on: June 15, 2016, 12:58:28 PM »


As I very clearly said, Carter still led until late July.  There are the unbiased numbers.  (facts). 


Um...


Polls are, by their very nature, subject to bias.  Depends on how the question was phrased, what the possible answers are, the population that was polled, etc. 

...

And I don't think I've ever said one poll was better than another, only that there are others that have different conclusions.  I really don't give a shit in a peach basket what any poll says.  They're often wrong.

...

Poll numbers are actually a reporting of opinion.  Polls are subject to bias.  ALL polls. And yes, all are essentially meaningless in my opinion.  I hate them for their ability to shape a narrative. 




« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 01:00:32 PM by wesfau2 »
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You can keep a wooden stake in your trunk
On the off-chance that the fairy tales ain't bunk
And Imma keep a bottle of that funk
To get motel parking lot, balcony crunk.

AUChizad

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #383 on: June 15, 2016, 12:59:28 PM »
Missed this post earlier:

Seriously?  You're going to claim that I'm insulting you?  Page after page after page of "moron, mouthbreather, knuckle dragger, etc. ad infinitum" spewing from you and you're going to throw THAT stone?  Come on, dude.  I've been WAAAY civil.  You haven't been insulted.  I've asked questions like "are you insane" because the point you were trying to defend was absurd.  I've poked at your arguments, but you'll have to search for where it was ever personal from me.  I'm not really sure what you're reading. 
Bull. Shit.

Where do I say "K is a knuckledragger" "K is a mouthbreather"? WHERE? I may say things like "Only an idiot could interpret X as Y". You don't HAVE to have those interpretations. You choose to because you can't ever fucking admit you made a bad argument.  99% of my statements in that ballpark have been directed specifically at things TRUMP says that are easily proven false and/or misleading and/or oversimplications with FACTS. The rest have been reserved for the ignoramuses at his rally barking "WHATEVER LYIN' TED!" in the face of facts. A tactic you've adopted here. Take from that what you will.

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Come the fuck on.   My ENTIRE ARGUMENT is that Trump is a better option than Hillary.  That's the alpha and omega. 

I find it unbelievable that you'd consider anything I've said to you "mudslinging."    I've hurled zero "insults" at you. 
Normally I'd ignore this and let it go, BUT I PRESENTED FOUR EXAMPLES FROM YOUR FOUR PREVIOUS POSTS. Those are FACTS. This is textbook to your problem with facts and what they are. You think you can just say that now and that negates the fucking litany of times you FACTUALLY hurled insults with no rhetorical purpose. Obviously some are buying it, so I guess it's working for you.

The reality remains the reality.
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Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #384 on: June 15, 2016, 01:01:45 PM »
Um...

Oh, I don't disagree.  The polls may have been wrong all along.  I find them essentially worthless.

Please recognize when a bear is poked with a sharp stick. 
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Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #385 on: June 15, 2016, 01:11:15 PM »
Missed this post earlier:Bull. Shit.

Where do I say "K is a knuckledragger" "K is a mouthbreather"? WHERE? I may say things like "Only an idiot could interpret X as Y". You don't HAVE to have those interpretations. You choose to because you can't ever fucking admit you made a bad argument.  99% of my statements in that ballpark have been directed specifically at things TRUMP says that are easily proven false and/or misleading and/or oversimplications with FACTS. The rest have been reserved for the ignoramuses at his rally barking "WHATEVER LYIN' TED!" in the face of facts. A tactic you've adopted here. Take from that what you will.


A. You say "only a -- insert slur here -- could support Trump.
B. For reasons of my own, I support Trump.
If A is true and B is true, then C:  I am  -- insert slur here -- , must also be true. 

Fact, schmact. 

Your idea of a "fact" is illustrated thusly:

"Trump made a pee-pee joke."  Ohhhhh SHIIIIIIIIITTTTTT!!!!!!!  I told you!! HE DOESN'T UNDERSTAND TRADE, COMMODITIES, NATURAL RESOURCES, GLOBAL WARMING (COOLING, CHANGE, CLIMATE), PIPELINES, OR ANYTHING!! HE'S A MORAN AND YOU ARE TOO IF YOU SUPPORT THIS DUMBASS!!! HE'S A DUMBASS BECAUSE OF THIS FACT, AND I ALREADY SAID HE WAS A DUMBASS, SO YOU MUST BE TOOOOO!!!!1!!11!!

Normally I'd ignore this and let it go, BUT I PRESENTED FOUR EXAMPLES FROM YOUR FOUR PREVIOUS POSTS. Those are FACTS. This is textbook to your problem with facts and what they are. You think you can just say that now and that negates the fucking litany of times you FACTUALLY hurled insults with no rhetorical purpose. Obviously some are buying it, so I guess it's working for you.

The reality remains the reality.

I have no problem with facts.  Doesn't mean I have to CARE. 

You've not been insulted, Chizad.  I've poked fun at your point of view, but not at you personally.  Whether you wish to recognize it or not,  that's really not my style any longer. 
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AUChizad

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #386 on: June 15, 2016, 01:22:00 PM »
You've not been insulted, Chizad.  I've poked fun at your point of view, but not at you personally.  Whether you wish to recognize it or not,  that's really not my style any longer.
I know you see that it is insanely hypocritical that you directly insulting me by CALLING ME dumb, infantile, ignorant, etc. is just "poking fun at my point of view" but me not even directly invoking you AT ALL by insulting Trump and his legion of supporters is a direct attack on you and serves no purpose but to insult.

IF ANYONE BELIEVES WHAT YOU JUST SAID they're idiots. I know you don't. No one else in this thread has to either.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 01:33:17 PM by AUChizad »
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GH2001

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #387 on: June 15, 2016, 01:25:01 PM »
The polls from 1980 look similar to the ones now. Very ebb n flow. Far apart. Then close. Then back apart again. Then a little closer again. Then the conventions. Then the election. And so forth and so on.

For what it's worth some of these same polls had Cruz winning Indiana a work before the election there. And Rubio within the margin of error in Florida. Neither were even close.
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WDE

wesfau2

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #388 on: June 15, 2016, 01:27:30 PM »
I know you see that it is insanely hypocritical that you directly insulting me by CALLING ME dumb, infantile, ignorant, etc. is just "poking fun at my point of view" but me not even directly invoking you AT ALL by saying Trump and his legion of supporters is a direct attack on you and serves no purpose but to insult.

IF ANYONE BELIEVES WHAT YOU JUST SAID they're idiots. I know you don't. No one else in this thread has to either.

Further, if Kaos isn't a Trump loyalist/supporter, then your comments don't apply to him.
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You can keep a wooden stake in your trunk
On the off-chance that the fairy tales ain't bunk
And Imma keep a bottle of that funk
To get motel parking lot, balcony crunk.

CCTAU

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #389 on: June 15, 2016, 01:28:36 PM »
Tell that soldier he's a thief and he's wrong. Tell him that Trump meant something else entirely from what he meant. Tell him it wasn't slimy.

I got several guys that did not sit in a cushy air conditioned trailer the whole time that would tell this guy he wasn't the only one there. Others did what Trump is alluding to. But that too does not fit the "new" conservative narrative.
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Five statements of WISDOM
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friends, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

AUChizad

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #390 on: June 15, 2016, 01:32:30 PM »
Further, if Kaos isn't a Trump loyalist/supporter, then your comments don't apply to him.
BOOM. THAT RIGHT FUCKIN THERE.
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Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #391 on: June 15, 2016, 01:36:30 PM »
I know you see that it is insanely hypocritical that you directly insulting me by CALLING ME dumb, infantile, ignorant, etc. is just "poking fun at my point of view" but me not even directly invoking you AT ALL by saying Trump and his legion of supporters is a direct attack on you and serves no purpose but to insult.

IF ANYONE BELIEVES WHAT YOU JUST SAID they're idiots. I know you don't. No one else in this thread has to either.

None of those things have happened.  I haven't called you dumb.  I don't think you are.  You've taken some really dumb positions, but haven't we all?   

I said ONCE that your rant was infantile.  That's not saying you're an infant.  You know that. 

Big difference in saying "your rant was infantile" and "only a moron would support trump..."  One is a consideration of the tone of an argument, the other a direct comparison between Trump supporters and morons.  You know that too. 

I think everyone believes what I say.  I'm straight legit that way. 

Might be a good idea for you to go back and start on page one.  Look at how many times you called us (and I'm lumping CCTAU and others in there) ignorant, idiots, etc.  Maybe you won't be surprised.  Maybe you will.  I dunno. 

I've tried to keep my end of it civilish.  Yeah, I do childish things to amuse myself - like "lalalalala, not listening..."  but I got no animus toward YOU, just your opinion on this one particular issue.  Sorry if you thought it was more than that. 

And btw?  If you weren't joking, you seriously swung and missed on Wiregrass.  That looked really bad if you were serious. 
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Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #392 on: June 15, 2016, 01:38:57 PM »
Further, if Kaos isn't a Trump loyalist/supporter, then your comments don't apply to him.

His assertion and belief is that I was and am.  His comments were largely directed at me in that he assumes me to be a Trumper.

And to the degree that he's a better option than Hillary?  I'm wearing the Make America Great Again hat, shirt and boxers.  Damn skippy.
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CCTAU

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #393 on: June 15, 2016, 01:46:51 PM »
His assertion and belief is that I was and am.  His comments were largely directed at me in that he assumes me to be a Trumper.

And to the degree that he's a better option than Hillary?  I'm wearing the Make America Great Again hat, shirt and boxers.  Damn skippy.

Like my wife said, "We are down to two. Its either him or her! Now that he is the nominee, get with the program!"

Every bash of Trump is an endorsement for hitlary.
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Five statements of WISDOM
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friends, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #394 on: June 15, 2016, 02:00:28 PM »
This is good.

http://townhall.com/columnists/johnstossel/2016/06/15/my-lunch-with-hillary-n2178372

Like most politicians, she assumes problems are best solved with new rules. She doesn't notice that most new rules create new problems. Worse problems. Problems that often take away opportunity altogether.

I don't want to live in a shipping container. But when politicians say "no one" may, they prevent desperate people from improving their lives.


Yep.
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AUChizad

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #395 on: June 15, 2016, 02:14:19 PM »
None of those things have happened.  I haven't called you dumb.
You can say it 200 times. It will be a lie all 200 times.
 

Quote
Big difference in saying "your rant was infantile" and "only a moron would support trump..."  One is a consideration of the tone of an argument, the other a direct comparison between Trump supporters and morons.  You know that too. 
No. The difference is one is an attack on ME and the other is an attack on AN IDEA. Yet the narrative we've somehow crafted here is that I'm the one hitting below the belt, which is simply amazing.

Quote
Might be a good idea for you to go back and start on page one.  Look at how many times you called us (and I'm lumping CCTAU and others in there) ignorant, idiots, etc.  Maybe you won't be surprised.  Maybe you will.  I dunno. 
Maybe you should. Hundreds of examples of exactly what we're talking about here. From at least 5 or 6 different people. Directly insulting me (and wes). Seriously, do it. There are about 5 different insults toward the two of us before I make the first post in here. And then a torrent of them as soon as I do. Check the tape. You're making shit up again.

Quote
And btw?  If you weren't joking, you seriously swung and missed on Wiregrass.  That looked really bad if you were serious.
How so? I'm aware that all he has contributed is trolling. Somehow this became a referendum on ME who is incapable of making an argument without just needlessly hurling insults. If that describes anyone it's his behavior toward me, whether he's being sincere or not.

His assertion and belief is that I was and am.  His comments were largely directed at me in that he assumes me to be a Trumper.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
You have got to be dizzy from all that spinning. If anything I'm giving you reasons why you shouldn't be, as futile as that may be.

Which goes back to what makes this whole discussion so hilarious. A few pages ago you were going on about how unlike me, you are capable of independent rational thought and I'm just a brainwashed idiot who parrots whatever (insert liberal comedian) tells me. And then out of the other side of your mouth you say that no preponderance of evidence can persuade you from changing your stubborn mind and you don't give a damn what anyone else thinks. If so, then why do you give so much of a fuck what I "perceive" you to be? Could it be that you are purposely manipulating the argument to spin and defer from your refusal to acknowledge facts?
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Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #396 on: June 15, 2016, 02:33:59 PM »
*sigh*

Unreal.
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Kaos

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #397 on: June 15, 2016, 02:46:09 PM »
You can say it 200 times. It will be a lie all 200 times.

Isn't, wasn't and will never be a lie.

No. The difference is one is an attack on ME and the other is an attack on AN IDEA. Yet the narrative we've somehow crafted here is that I'm the one hitting below the belt, which is simply amazing.


I'm hardly the only one saying it. 

Maybe you should. Hundreds of examples of exactly what we're talking about here. From at least 5 or 6 different people. Directly insulting me (and wes). Seriously, do it. There are about 5 different insults toward the two of us before I make the first post in here. And then a torrent of them as soon as I do. Check the tape. You're making shit up again.

Horse shit.  Utter horseshit.  You're the one perceived as screaming, shouting, ranting, insulting.  I'm not the one wearing that crown. 

How so? I'm aware that all he has contributed is trolling. Somehow this became a referendum on ME who is incapable of making an argument without just needlessly hurling insults. If that describes anyone it's his behavior toward me, whether he's being sincere or not.


The fact that you can't see his responses as nonsensical and playing is a clear and compelling referendum on your inability get down off the ledge. 

It says a ton about your mental state as it pertains to this argument. 

It casts doubt upon every emotional response you display.  Really does. 

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
You have got to be dizzy from all that spinning. If anything I'm giving you reasons why you shouldn't be, as futile as that may be.

Which goes back to what makes this whole discussion so hilarious. A few pages ago you were going on about how unlike me, you are capable of independent rational thought and I'm just a brainwashed idiot who parrots whatever (insert liberal comedian) tells me. And then out of the other side of your mouth you say that no preponderance of evidence can persuade you from changing your stubborn mind and you don't give a damn what anyone else thinks. If so, then why do you give so much of a fuck what I "perceive" you to be? Could it be that you are purposely manipulating the argument to spin and defer from your refusal to acknowledge facts?

What part of this are you missing?  How many times do I have to spell it out for you?

I've done my own research.  I've thought (and maybe even -gasp!- prayed) about it.  She's the worst human being I've ever personally witnessed. (And by personally witnessed I mean watched her political life, I don't know her).  That simple fact (there's that word again) renders anything you say in regard to Trump irrelevant.  If you can show me photos of him actually eating babies at his breakfast table, then I could potentially be swayed.  But videos of him making jokes, saying goofy things, having bad hair?  Fucking polls?  All that shit?  It's pointless. Because I don't care.

I'm not manipulating anything because it makes not one fuck to me. 

I am, in some cases, pointing out how utterly blind you are to anything but "OH NOES!!1! He's a moron!" point of view.  You've taken some pretty innocuous statements and tried to turn them into mountains.  It's hysterical (not in the ha ha way), it's a little insulting, and it's borderline frothing at the mouth. 

You're digging a big hole.  Probably time to put the shovel down.
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CCTAU

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #398 on: June 15, 2016, 03:04:21 PM »
I am, in some cases, pointing out how utterly blind you are to anything but "OH NOES!!1! He's a moron!" point of view.  You've taken some pretty innocuous statements and tried to turn them into mountains.  It's hysterical (not in the ha ha way), it's a little insulting, and it's borderline frothing at the mouth. 

You're digging a big hole.  Probably time to put the shovel down.

Oh shit!

Here comes another barrage of links about how Trump injured another person with his hateful words...
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Five statements of WISDOM
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friends, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

AUChizad

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Re: At least he's not Hillary...
« Reply #399 on: June 15, 2016, 03:32:41 PM »

Isn't, wasn't and will never be a lie.
 

I'm hardly the only one saying it. 

Horse shit.  Utter horseshit.  You're the one perceived as screaming, shouting, ranting, insulting.  I'm not the one wearing that crown. 
Only ONE other person in this thread hasn't basically in some form or another said they would vote for fucking Hitler if he ran against Hillary and therefore could give a fuck less about facts or any argument presented here. If therefore they want to lionize you and demonize me, or in the very least look away and let your flagrant bullshit run unchecked has absolutely no bearing on reality. None. I don't care if zero people agree with me. I invited you to post my first insult in this thread, and yet you won't. Because you know that if you can even find one, it is a FACT that I can post 50 more aimed at me, that are probably much more direct and much worse, that preceded it. Please, please try to disprove that fact. I'm waiting. Still waiting on GH too since he's the Tom Ritter of this thread. Check the replay, Tom.
 
Quote
The fact that you can't see his responses as nonsensical and playing is a clear and compelling referendum on your inability get down off the ledge. 

It says a ton about your mental state as it pertains to this argument. 

It casts doubt upon every emotional response you display.  Really does. 
Can you read? You are not demonstrating that you have that ability. What part of this quote is confusing to you and implies, as you say here, that I don't recognize them as "nonsensical and playing". Where? Point to it.
Quote
How so? I'm aware that all he has contributed is trolling. Somehow this became a referendum on ME who is incapable of making an argument without just needlessly hurling insults. If that describes anyone it's his behavior toward me, whether he's being sincere or not.
Your whole argument is to blur reality and fact and truth and say what clearly fucking happened never happened. I recognize it as adopting Trump's entire strategy. I'm not one of the rubes that falls for that shit.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 03:58:35 PM by AUChizad »
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